Move from tiller to wheel - less pleasure helming?

dylanwinter

dylanwinter

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www.keepturningleft.co.uk
I have never owned a boat with a steering wheel.

As a dinghy sailor I love the feel of a tiller and often close my eyes just to feel the boat and see if I can keep her on the wind just by touch alone.

On the 1978 Centaur (Harmony with the skeg and the "ew profile" keels] steering her was a real pleasure.

The second Centaur [Lily M is older and has the old keels and the skegless rudder] has all the feel of stirring kam with a wooden spoon so I just leave the tiller pilot to do all the work while I trim the sails.

I was wondering if there is less pleasure to be had from a steering wheel - especially when used from inside a cabin.



So chaps.... have any of you gone over to a wheel and then decided to go back to a tiller because you miss that sailing feeling.

Dylan

894533_0-1.jpg


PS Note to self.... must get one of the local fisher 25 owners in Kip to let me have a go on one out in a blow.
 
I think it depends very much on the type of sailing you do. Our first two boats were both tiller steered and we were happy with them - but they were 18 foot and 27 foot, and a long passage was 20 miles. As we got more experienced, we got more ambitious and moved up in size - 33 foot and now 43 foot. We also are going further afield - passages of 60 miles or more - including multiple days at sea. Both the larger boats have been wheel steering and I could not imagine helming anything so large with a tiller, or helming for so long or so far on a tiller. There are a few times when we miss "something small and wet", but we could not possibly justify having two boats and the primary requirement is for a reasonably large cruiser with good accommodation. YMMV.
 
YMMV indeed. Happy memories of a classic 100 square metre (Overlord), 58 feet long and tiller steered, a delight to steer under sail, took me as far as the Canary Islands.
 
When I was a student at the Solent School of Yachting ( a ruffty tufty outfit with seriously experienced instructors compared to some Solent places ) they had two Yamaha 31's, fine seagoing boats especially in heavy weather.

One had wheel steering, the other a tiller; they were converting the wheel steered one back to a tiller, as it's so much more intuitive as to which way to point it.

Other snags which spring to mind, unless one really needs the mechanical advantage of a wheel;

much more linkage to wear out / go wrong

cold to hands

much more expensive autopilots

not instantly obvious where the rudder is pointing in port etc, hence the need for position indicators - something else to go wrong
 
Seajet said:
When I was a student at the Solent School of Yachting ( a ruffty tufty outfit with seriously experienced instructors compared to some Solent places ) they had two Yamaha 31's, fine seagoing boats especially in heavy weather.

One had wheel steering, the other a tiller; they were converting the wheel steered one back to a tiller, as it's so much more intuitive as to which way to point it.

Other snags which spring to mind, unless one really needs the mechanical advantage of a wheel;

much more linkage to wear out / go wrong

cold to hands

much more expensive autopilots

not instantly obvious where the rudder is pointing in port etc, hence the need for position indicators - something else to go wrong
Click to expand...

Or a new boat that I chartered with the chain mounted the wrong way round, meaning that the boat turned in the opposite way to the helm...

As I get older the neck action stiffens and so to sit sideways on the whole time with a tiller can be uncomfortable. I expect my next boat will have a wheel.
 
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dylanwinter said:
I have never owned a boat with a steering wheel.

As a dinghy sailor I love the feel of a tiller and often close my eyes just to feel the boat and see if I can keep her on the wind just by touch alone.

On the 1978 Centaur (Harmony with the skeg and the "ew profile" keels] steering her was a real pleasure.

The second Centaur [Lily M is older and has the old keels and the skegless rudder] has all the feel of stirring kam with a wooden spoon so I just leave the tiller pilot to do all the work while I trim the sails.

I was wondering if there is less pleasure to be had from a steering wheel - especially when used from inside a cabin.



So chaps.... have any of you gone over to a wheel and then decided to go back to a tiller because you miss that sailing feeling.

Dylan

894533_0-1.jpg


PS Note to self.... must get one of the local fisher 25 owners in Kip to let me have a go on one out in a blow.
Click to expand...

As a minimalist you might like this one. (Though not minimalist as far as price goes unfortunately.)

http://haber-yachts.com/index.php?page=en-hb660v
 
maby said:
There are a few times when we miss "something small and wet", but we could not possibly justify having two boats and the primary requirement is for a reasonably large cruiser with good accommodation. YMMV.
Click to expand...

We've ended up with two boats for years now as the smaller one won't sell so sometimes move from a 42 foot wheel steer to 24 foot quarter tonner type with tiller. One boat fits like a glove and skips around like it's part of your body and the other pushes the water aside as it moves our home to its next destination and is often a pleasure to live and sleep on as we sail along.

So different pleasures. But I use autohelm a lot on both as I single hand the smaller one and my neck does not enjoy looking sideways for hours.

So I can definitively answer whether wheel or tiller is best. It depends.
 
Seajet said:
... One had wheel steering, the other a tiller; they were converting the wheel steered one back to a tiller, as it's so much more intuitive as to which way to point it.
...
cold to hands
...
not instantly obvious where the rudder is pointing in port etc, hence the need for position indicators - something else to go wrong
Click to expand...

Perhaps there should be a poll of who genuinely found a tiller "intuitive" the first time they encountered one!

I agree a bare steel wheel in a cold climate doesn't sound fun; there are simple cures for that!

And have to agree about the rudder angle, however visible the "TDC" mark is on the wheel.

I remember steering with a tiller between my knees when the boat would heel underneath me and automatically move the tiller to keep her tracking straight...

Mike.
 
Difficult to generalise. An old style fishing bawley with tiller steering is anything but a pleasure to steer, probably needing tiller lines to control it in anything of a blow. Likewise I expect that Fisher will be pretty boring to steer from inside. On the other hand a modern fin keel boat with a big balanced spade rudder and a direct wheel steering system can be a delight (like my Bavaria).

You soon get used to steering with a wheel and appreciate its advantages. However there are of course boats around the 30-35' mark where either a tiller or a wheel will work and for some the tiller may well be more appropriate.
 
dylanwinter said:
I was wondering if there is less pleasure to be had from a steering wheel - especially when used from inside a cabin.
Click to expand...

It really depends upon the size of the boat. There's certainly fun to be had steering a larger boat by wheel, even with the weight of twin wheels. A larger racer, of the type with the huge wheel in the cockpit, will give you the precision and feel of a tiller at a size you couldn't manage with a tiller.

I do find it daft when people retro-fit wheels on smaller boats that work very well with a tiller.

I've never seen a tiller used at an inside steering position. I suspect it might be a tad inconvenient to use.
 
Kelpie said:
Unless your wheel is only a single turn lock to lock then it's not quite that simple.
Click to expand...

We do have an over large wheel with cockpit seat moulding that suggest it was designed with that size in mind - that allows a single turn lock which does make it that simple. I prefer that to twin wheels when sailing but not when stern to on a dock.
 
I have sailed boats with a wheel where there is superb "feel" and others where there is no feel or feedback at all.

A lot depends on the type of steering and the length from the quadrant to the rudder stock. The best feel for me is a wire system, then a close second is solid rod steering followed by hydraulic steering which provided little to no feel at all.
 
As ever, it depends on a lot of other factors.

I hate boats with a small wheel on the centreline, particularly if forces to sit or stand behind it - with poor visibility of the sails etc. Dull, dull, dull!

A performance cruiser with good balance and a well set up Jeffa twin wheel is great, helming from the side of the wheels not behind them.

Personally cannot imagine sailing a saily boat properly from a wheelhouse. Must be very uncomfortable when heeled (and unless a multihull or canting keel, not going to be generating much forward power upwind or across wind when upright). Feels like a solution for a mobo with large burgee / ensign posts
 
I have had both types. The feeling when a tiller steered yacht comes alive under sail is marvellous and I have not felt this on any wheel steered boat. Having said that I would not like to swap my wheel and padastal mounted nav display for the sort of cruising I do. If you tend go go out on shortish trips in familiar waters I would try for a tiller.
 
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