Move from tiller to wheel - less pleasure helming?

[flaming]

if your experience of tiller steering is a good cruiser racer.
And then you charter some tub with twin wheels in the med you're very unlikely to think the wheels are up to much.

On the other hand if your experience with tillers is a 40 year old Bilge keeled motor sailor, then you jump on a well sorted 40 foot cruiser racer with a wheel, you're likely to love the wheel by comparison.

In short, what the actual mechanism is that turns the rudder has a very small impact on the helming experience compared to the rest of the variables.

 

[RupertW]

if your experience of tiller steering is a good cruiser racer.
And then you charter some tub with twin wheels in the med you're very unlikely to think the wheels are up to much.

On the other hand if your experience with tillers is a 40 year old Bilge keeled motor sailor, then you jump on a well sorted 40 foot cruiser racer with a wheel, you're likely to love the wheel by comparison.

In short, what the actual mechanism is that turns the rudder has a very small impact on the helming experience compared to the rest of the variables.

Perfectly put and sums up our experience between a GK24 and a heavily laden Jeanneau 42. And frankly exactly why we bought both.

 

[dylanwinter]

if your experience of tiller steering is a good cruiser racer.
And then you charter some tub with twin wheels in the med you're very unlikely to think the wheels are up to much.

On the other hand if your experience with tillers is a 40 year old Bilge keeled motor sailor, then you jump on a well sorted 40 foot cruiser racer with a wheel, you're likely to love the wheel by comparison.

In short, what the actual mechanism is that turns the rudder has a very small impact on the helming experience compared to the rest of the variables.

dinghies, eboat, sonata - so I have sailed some beautifully balanced boats

the later version centaur was pretty6 good

this one, which is older, has all the feel of a porridge spurtle.

D

 

[Kukri]

I have mostly sailed on tiller steered boats, including a long voyage on a fifty foot and thirty ton Bristol Channel Pilot Cutter which would throw you across the cockpit without a second thought if you forgot the tiller lines. Subtle she was not! Conversely my own 37ft gaff cutter had a massive ash tiller, but could be steered with a finger on it, in most conditions.

The boat I have just bought (an Ohlson 38) actually has both, in that, if you wish to, you can ship the tiller and the wheel set up is so light that you can still "feel" the boat without disconnecting it. So we will see...

 

[flaming]

dinghies, eboat, sonata - so I have sailed some beautifully balanced boats

the later version centaur was pretty6 good

this one, which is older, has all the feel of a porridge spurtle.

D

Ah, but have you sailed a well balanced wheel boat?

 

[john_morris_uk]

if your experience of tiller steering is a good cruiser racer.
And then you charter some tub with twin wheels in the med you're very unlikely to think the wheels are up to much.

On the other hand if your experience with tillers is a 40 year old Bilge keeled motor sailor, then you jump on a well sorted 40 foot cruiser racer with a wheel, you're likely to love the wheel by comparison.

In short, what the actual mechanism is that turns the rudder has a very small impact on the helming experience compared to the rest of the variables.

Sums it up for me.

Nothing wrong with wheel OR tiller per se... (in the right size boat)

However either can be hard work and horrible experiences on the wrong boat with the wrong sail trim.

 

[pyrojames]

I had a 33 foot classic that had a wheel. The wheel was awful and I replaced it with a tiller. Much better and did 25k miles that way. Replaced it with the current boat, still a tiller, and no desire to go to a wheel, but it does have a massive under deck AP, which is controlled by a tiny wheel in the doghouse. It has no sensitivity at all.

 

[mjcoon]

.. but it does have a massive under deck AP, which is controlled by a tiny wheel in the doghouse. It has no sensitivity at all.

Giving an autopilot some haptic feedback would be a good engineering challenge!

Mike.

 

[ProDave]

I sail in small boats so mostly tiller steered. I did crew in a race once in a small wheel steered boat. I messed up the start as the boat refused to turn (in light winds). I learned two things that day. 1) it is possible to stall a rudder. 2) that wheel had absolutely no feedback so I didn't understand what was happening.

 

[lpdsn]

I'm afraid that's ' Hummingbird ' telling you to learn sail trim - easiest answer being let the main traveller off, or sheet out the main a touch; if it happens off the wind, consider reefing the main, and if racing or in a hurry, increase sail area forward to pull her by the forestay.

I'd be thinking of adjusting the main halyard/cunningham, outhaul and, if available, backstay first. Amazing what you can achieve by flattening a good sail.

 

[Andrew E]

Sailed an Oceanis 37 a few months ago and loved the wheel. Felt like driving a car, but was very enjoyable.

 

[charles_reed]

I prefer a tiller - though it has little to do with aesthetics and all to do with reliability and feedback.

And how do you deal with that obtrusive round object in the middle of your outdoor living space?

However unbalanced rudders are a pain - literally, in the neck and in shoulders. You should be able to steer with two fingers on a tiller.
So - wheels are definitely better for badly designed, badly set-up boats.

 

[maby]

I prefer a tiller - though it has little to do with aesthetics and all to do with reliability and feedback.

And how do you deal with that obtrusive round object in the middle of your outdoor living space?

However unbalanced rudders are a pain - literally, in the neck and in shoulders. You should be able to steer with two fingers on a tiller.
So - wheels are definitely better for badly designed, badly set-up boats.

It's horses for courses - our first two boats were under 30 foot and tiller steered - a wheel would have been quite impractical for the size of cockpit. Our third boat was 33 foot and wheel steered - it would have worked either way and it was certainly true that it was a bit of a struggle getting past the wheel carrying a large package. Our current boat is 43 foot with twin wheels - plenty of space to pass between them and a cockpit that can double up as a dance floor. A tiller would be hard work, I think, and being mounted centrally, it would impact more on the free space than the two wheels do.

 

[RupertW]

And how do you deal with that obtrusive round object in the middle of your outdoor living space?
.

Just on that point - even with our oversized wheel it doesn't feel in the way when under way as the only person with business behind it is the person steering, in the unlikely event that we are hand steering. And I feel safer with a big round railing behind me when on watch in bad weather or at night.

But although I've got used to it now, it is a bit of a pain when stern to, swimming or getting in an out of the dinghy as you have to swing around it. If I didn't have a dozen other expensive changes I'd like to make to the boat (12v fridge, solar panel, ligher rib, etc. etc) then I'd replace it with a folding wheel.

 

[Ruffles]

I think a cockpit should really be designed for tiller or wheel, not both.
And many small racing boats seem to be set up for efficient and comfortable tiller steering giving the helm a good view of the genoa luff with the tiller extension in the lap.
On our old Moody it takes me a while to get comfortable.
I've found helming to windward a whole lot more fun since we bought a new main a year or so back.

 

[Seajet]

I'd be thinking of adjusting the main halyard/cunningham, outhaul and, if available, backstay first. Amazing what you can achieve by flattening a good sail.

That must be why I have ball bearing blocks on all halliards, reefing, backstay and outhaul then.

For a lot of people not from a dinghy racing background, the main traveller & sheet is their first or maybe only option, loads of the people here will tie off their main clew outhaul in Spring and only untie it on laying up.

As for the comments about wheel steering pedestals making the throttle easier to hand, true; but a friend with a Centaur - and a tight marina berth - has modified his throttle, now it's relocated on the starboard coaming, which works well for right handed people ( it's sited so as to hopefully not get snagged by sheets or berthing lines for youtube full power moments ).

 

[Seatrout]

Question for wheelists.
Just about to convert from stick to wheel on a newly acquired yacht. The steering is wire from binnacle to steering gear in aft cabin.
Should the wire fail, is there a way of manually steering in such an emergency? If so what does this entail?

 

[Kelpie]

Not a wheelist myself, but there should probably be an emergency steering system. Generally involved something on the quadrant that an emergency tiller fits on to. You may find that the person doing the steering has to do it from within the aft cabin, and have order shouted down to them from someone on deck who can see where they're going.

 

[Sgeir]

I was pleasantly surprised at how sensitive wheel steering can be after changing over from our old tiller-steered long fin boat to a wheeled long keeled one of same 34' LOA.

Now we've got used to wheel steering, I'm completely neutral about it while under sail. Both boats are a joy to steer and, once the sails have been trimmed, can more or less be left unattended. I do not believe that there has been any loss of sensitivity.

The wheel may be slightly easier if under engine - motoring with tiller steering always seemed a bit more of a chore if the autohelm couldn't be used.

Emergency tiller procedure is straightforward, but unused to date - open cover, insert tiller and steer.

 

[robp]

Question for wheelists.
Just about to convert from stick to wheel on a newly acquired yacht. The steering is wire from binnacle to steering gear in aft cabin.
Should the wire fail, is there a way of manually steering in such an emergency? If so what does this entail?

Might well be an emergency tiller stored somewhere. Mine was just inside the engine bay. It dropped through the afterdeck onto the quadrant, having removed an access panel. However, as already mentioned, it might be operated from below decks.