Move from tiller to wheel - less pleasure helming?

Changed about 18 months ago after 15 years with a tiller and skeg-hung rudder on a Sadler 29. We now have a 39 footer with a single large wheel and a semi-balanced spade rudder. I think the change in rudder type is as big a shock as the change from tiller to wheel. The helm stays spookily light in almost all conditions. I agree that a wheel and/or instrument system which forces you to sit or stand on the centreline is a mistake. Sitting on the downwind coaming to steer to windward with a wheel in light to moderate conditions feels great.
 
In my opinion there is no reduction in pleasure using a wheel compared to a tiller. Both obviously have the same function and deliver the same objective. Steering systems that are shit, stiff links, loose tillers, are not pleasurable to use.
 
BlowingOldBoots said:
In my opinion there is no reduction in pleasure using a wheel compared to a tiller. Both obviously have the same function and deliver the same objective. Steering systems that are shit, stiff links, loose tillers, are not pleasurable to use.
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Exactly so. I suspect that a lot of the negative comments about wheel steering are related to either poor linkages with stiffness or poorly designed boats or cockpits. There are some cracking boats with wheels that are a joy to sail and a fair few that look good in the boat show but are not so nice at sea.
 
john_morris_uk said:
Exactly so. I suspect that a lot of the negative comments about wheel steering are related to either poor linkages with stiffness or poorly designed boats or cockpits. There are some cracking boats with wheels that are a joy to sail and a fair few that look good in the boat show but are not so nice at sea.
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my guess is that a tight tiller is easier to maintain than a tight wheel steering system.

D
 
dunedin said:
As ever, it depends on a lot of other factors.


Personally cannot imagine sailing a saily boat properly from a wheelhouse. Must be very uncomfortable when heeled (and unless a multihull or canting keel, not going to be generating much forward power upwind or across wind when upright). Feels like a solution for a mobo with large burgee / ensign posts
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The answer is in your first sentence!

The most important factor from my experience is boat balance from good sail trim - then there isn't a lot if steering to be done. On my Eclipse it was very comfortable unless powered up on a beam reach when it was hard work on the small inside wheel and not a whole lot better on the outside wheel.

Im going to miss sitting inside out of the rain and wind with the heater and radio on whilst the crews of ' proper' saily boaties get drenched and blasted.
 
One other thing about wheels is you can normally lock them. Balance the sails until there is no lee or weather helm then lock the wheel, you then don''t have to steer at all. We had a windvane but the new owner and I decided to see if we could deliver the boat from Lymington to Scarborough doing that and it worked. We got seriously lucky we had a north wind heading east and were reaching as we wanted to turn north to Scarborough the wind turned west so we didn't even have to steer the turn.
 
You could have both! The smaller Dujardin-Atlantis boats can be specified with two tillers and two steering wheels (one at the front of the cockpit under the spray hood, and the other at the interior helm).
 
My new 31 ft boat came with a tiller & it was so heavy to steer that my wife could not hold a course & subsequently refused to touch the helm. This made cruising with her a real pain. In fact she no longer sails with me. I have since solved the heavy steering problem by raking the mast forward 300mm & having decent new sails etc. Plus an Aeries for most of the helming as the Raymarine AV100 cannot cope in heavy weather.
Originally I was really upset i did not have the wheel but now I have the boat properly set up I realise that the wheel would take up too much cockpit room & make manouvering in a marina awkward. So I am now happy with the tiller & glad I did not get the wheel
The next boat - if it ever happens- will be a lot bigger & will have a wheel though
 
One of the benefits of having a motor sailor is I have both wheel and Tiller steering (Vetus hydraulic) and would not go back to just having one or the other and at 71 years old and having various boats over 50 years my idea of sailing is not sitting at a tiller getting cold and soaking wet.

I almost 90% of the time 'sail only' and always use the tiller as you can not beat feeling the wind direction, seeing the sea state and watching the sails etc, however like many other places the weather in the North Sea can change in minutes and its sure nice to get undercover in seconds.

Yes of coarse there is a difference in the response and feeling being on the tiller or wheel BUT in heavy weather give me the wheel every time:)
 
capnsensible said:
You can sit or stand either side or behind the wheel you can steer with a knee or a foot if it's tea and cake time. Just need a decent sail trim.

Mind you, it's easy to steer with a tiller for all of the above!
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Although you can sit either side of a wheel, if you sit upwind, you will generally be pushing most of the time. The extensor muscles of the limbs are weaker than the flexors, consequently, pulling is less tiring and feels more natural. Some modern designs make the helmsman's situation even worse by making him/her perch in the transom. The aft cockpit HR 37 is a typical example.
 
johnalison said:
Although you can sit either side of a wheel, if you sit upwind, you will generally be pushing most of the time. The extensor muscles of the limbs are weaker than the flexors, consequently, pulling is less tiring and feels more natural. Some modern designs make the helmsman's situation even worse by making him/her perch in the transom. The aft cockpit HR 37 is a typical example.
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On my last boat, I'd mostly sit alongside the wheel, lifting the rim of the wheel against the slight weather helm.
I could also hold the wheel still with a foot or a knee.

Tiller steering is more direct, you can steer quicker to nip a spainnaker broach in the bud, but somewhere around 37 feet the tiller becomes unwieldy.

The fact that the autopilot was already bolted to the wheel as against rummaging in a locker for the tillerpilot was a big plus, I often just use a wheelpilot to just lock the wheel, e.g. to trim the jib.

Neither would put me off a good boat.
In either case, a good rudder with the right amount of balance is the key to pleasant easy helming IMHO.
I don't like little wheels on AWBs with arrays of screens in front and no access to the mainsheet, and no verstility to sit alongside the wheel and/or even in front of it.
 
Clydewanderer said:
I had only sailed my 30ft tiller steered boat for a few months before doing the day skipper practical on a wheel steered boat but found it strange and void of much feedback plus i felt exposed to the elements been so far aft of the sprayhood. On Hummingbird i can helm while tucked under the hood standing or sitting, i can feel the slightest effect of the wind on the sails and as, Dylan says, can helm with my eyes closed and feel what is happening, and even prepare to avert a roundup. Hummingbird takes massive weatherhelm where 2 hands are needed and while i cock my ears back and haul like a donkey to keep her on course. :)
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I'm afraid that's ' Hummingbird ' telling you to learn sail trim - easiest answer being let the main traveller off, or sheet out the main a touch; if it happens off the wind, consider reefing the main, and if racing or in a hurry, increase sail area forward to pull her by the forestay.

Not that relevant to tiller v wheel, except the tiller will probably make it easier and quicker to tell what the boat is feeling, if she's say less than 40'.
 
When I purchased my CW28 ketch the move to a wheel proved traumatic.

Close quarters manoeuvring was a pain as you had no idea where the rudder was pointing. There is 3.75 revolutions of the wheel, lock to lock. The wheel is light and easy to use but there is very little feedback from the rudder. It is cable not hydraulic by the way.

Telling what the wind was up to involved jumping off the helm seat, running out the back of the wheelhouse and trying to guess wind direction with all the eddies caused by wheelhouse and mizzen sail.

Solution was to install a rudder position indicator with the readout adjacent to the wheel and installation of mast head wind speed/direction instrument (NASA).

I also fitted a windex to the mizzen mast.

Now it is possible to manoeuvre in marinas by glancing at the rudder indicator before engaging gear, also good for checking sail trim at sea. The wind instrument means I can now luff up in gusts and sail to the wind.

The fully enclosed wheelhouse is great in many ways, heated, comfy and quiet but I found being so insulated from the outside world made sailing a less intuitive activity.
 
WE were used to tiller steering, but acquired a new-to-us wheel steering boat at the beginning of this year's season.

Our first sail in her was leaving Portsmouth for Argyll, and the worst bit in terms of tiller/wheel transition was getting through Port Solent Marina to the fuel berth without hitting anything......

I'd assumed that it would be as easy and instinctive as a car steering wheel, but I was still in tiller mode - every time I wanted to go to port I'd push the wheel over to starboard. Took a couple of days to break the habit.
 
I have sailed for nearly 50 years which has mostly been tiller steered dinghies and cruisers, but have raced for a few years on bigger wheel steered boats from 34-45 feet.
I have a dodgy back and shoulder and 2 years ago converted my Moody 31 to wheel steering. A friend had done it on his boat and provided me with the drawings and photos so I decided to do it. I am pleasantly surprised that there is a fair amount of feel to the wheel as it is a draglink connection and very positive.

I was finding the tiller hard work in a blow and the wheel which is a Lewmar 32" folding wheel means I can sit out comfortably on the coaming and see the tell tales.
Engaging the autopilot is just a push of the button and the best thing is the throttle on the pedestal so I do not have to bend my back as well as the plotter in front of me.

I always thought that a tiller was best but now the wheel suits me fine. Just an age thing.
 
Like many, my ownership and experienced has progressed from tiller to single, large and now to twin, smaller diameter steering wheels.

Without a doubt, a balanced rudder and well trimmed sails makes sailing more enjoyable.

We enjoy mid-distance cruising so my helming is mostly close quarters manoeuvring.

There's more pleasurable things to do on a passage than be slave to the steering.

Sitting comfortably in the cockpit, reading, listening to music, good conversation, drinking coffee and eating treats. Oh yes, and having a look around for traffic every twenty minutes or so!
 
Of course having a wheel does allow for some fun:

1) Eye patch and parrot on your shoulder, talk like a pirate

2) Lashed to the wheel hunting great white whales.

My own personal favorite of last summer - alone on deck in thick fog in a 4 meter swell hand steering while stood at the wheel about to enter the Casquets shipping lane.The feeling of total isolation was fantastic, not sure if I would felt the same sat at the tiller.
 
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