Mast lowering disaster - a cautionary tale

[JumbleDuck]

I don't think the weight is the main concern, it is more the leverage. .

I used to carry the 26' mast from my 21' Westerly around the yard by myself, and I dropped and raised it singlehanded - with the boat afloat - several times. It was just about as much as I could lift at that transferring the weight from the forestay to my shoulder in the companionway point. even the mast on my wee (16') Hunter is quite a load at that point. I wouldn't even think about trying it on a 31-footer.

 

[maxi77]

So how much weight IS involved on the mast of a 31' ? I'm dropping the mast on mine next week, using a suitable crane, but I can foresee that me and my 1 crew might want to shift it around for best fit while we do the Forth Clyde canal.

Once it is down it is not to bad to move it around if you plan ahead, I moved the mast on our Moody 36 from the centerline to the side to make the airdraft on the Forth and Clyde on my own.

 

[James_Calvert]

Since then I have wondered about a couple of things:-

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- Firstly the stupidity of trying to lower a mast with just two people and none of the correct gear

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- Second, exactly how much weight were we trying to support, say ten feet aft of the tabernacle with a fully rigged mast.

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- Lastly - should I have offered to help at all - the consequences could have been far, far worse for me (broken leg, possible liability ??) - but I don't see how you could stand by and watch.

Any thoughts?

Re the second thought, assuming the base of the mast was effectively restrained in some kind of pivot in the tabernacle, the position you'd have been in was akin to the nut in a nut-cracker, so the weight you were experiencing might have been a multiple of the actual weight.

eg if the mast was 40ft long and your position was 10ft along from the base of it, the weight you'd have experienced would be in the region of double its actual weight.

This mechanical disadvantage reduces as your position moves towards the middle of the mast, and becomes an advantage beyond that point. Fine if you have a very short mast or very long arms.... or as Lakesailor suggested, you had managed to jam a ladder into position (ideally nearer the end of the mast)

As an aside, if the mast wasn't pivoted, you wouldn't have borne more than the actual weight at any time, but you wouldn't have been able to arrest its fall from the 10 ft position, and in the process its foot could have swept the foredeck...

 

[Boathook]

My mast took 2 of us just to move it a few years ago. It is heavy being of large section for around 10 metres long. Last time it came off I got the yard to do it.

 

[Thistle]

Shamal

What sort of a man would you be if you didn't try to help someone in a mess? I hope most of us would.

I agree, but with the usual 20/20 hindsight, perhaps the best help would have been suggesting they get it back upright before it reached the point of no return. They could then have re-secured the mast and re-considered their plan for lowering it with first-hand experience of some of the problems.

 

[prv]

I agree, but with the usual 20/20 hindsight, perhaps the best help would have been suggesting they get it back upright before it reached the point of no return.

By the sounds of it they had already passed that point, the forestay had become ineffective, and Mr Numpty was stuck doing his Atlas impression on the coachroof.

Pete

 

[Poignard]

I agree, but with the usual 20/20 hindsight, perhaps the best help would have been suggesting they get it back upright before it reached the point of no return. They could then have re-secured the mast and re-considered their plan for lowering it with first-hand experience of some of the problems.

Hindsight's certainly a wonderful thing

But Shamal did his best in difficult circumstances. Good luck to him.

His worst move was, in my opinion, posting an account of it on here.

 

[prv]

Easy to say after the event, but at the moment you got involved it would have been good to look for a ladder or similar that you could have employed as a crutch to take the weight of the mast whilst you worked out your next move.
Must be a ladder or something around in a boat yard.

There was definitely at least one - the one he climbed up to get on board .

(I wouldn't rely on definitely finding a spare ladder lying around - in our yard they are always locked to the cradle (or round one leg of a bilge-keeler) to make it harder for thieves to get at boats ashore.)

Pete

 

[Mandarin331]

Thanks to all the input, very interesting and appreciated.

A ladder would have been a great idea, but they are all padlocked to the rails and so impossible to use, even if there had been time - as the mast was past the point of no return and the guy was collapsing under the weight.

The mast was on a tabernacle, therefore the 'nutcracker' effect applied.

I beleive its 35' long, and from what I've gathered since probably weights about 150 kgs with all the rigging, its a very heavily rigged boat with a large diameter mast compared to our own 30'er.

I have no interest in compensation - one day it might be me needing help and i hope my neighbour would come to my assistance without hesitation, however I hope it serves as a note of caution to any others thinking that as they have a tabernacle they can easily lower their mast.

 

[30boat]

I think you did the right thing in helping.They had put themselves in an impossible situation and you couldn't just stay back and watch,I'd do the same.Sorry about your leg.

 

[AntarcticPilot]

I think you did the right thing in helping.They had put themselves in an impossible situation and you couldn't just stay back and watch,I'd do the same.Sorry about your leg.

+1

When I was a boy, my Mum and Dad had a similar problem - but in that case, the mast was a heavy wooden one. Even though the mast was in a tabenacle and had an A-frame set up, my Dad lost control as the mast went down the last bit, and my mother, who was guiding the mast down, was lucky not to be brained by it! Fortunately, it went down straight into a support that took the weight.

As a result, I'm very respectful of the mechanics of mast lowering, and would never attempt it unless there was no other option.

 

[davidpbo]

I raise the mast on my 24ftr (pivoted at the bottom) myself but not without a pole of the front of the mast, something like a 6 to 1 pulley system and ratchet straps to the mast and pole to limit sideways movement. It is the largest I would want to raise or lower. I can lift one end of it when it is horizontal.

The scenario reminds me of a situation when I was in Jersey harbour before I started with boats. A young lad had decided to move a large multi masted sailing boat around on his own, I think it was a sail training vessel probably 40ft or more with a high freeboard. In the end having questioned him as to whether it was a wise decision to try it on his own I did help and we managed it.

Whilst I am not backward at coming forward to offer assistance I am not sure what I would have done in the Ops situation knowing some of the forces and weights involved. As it was you had a good result, two people with hopefully minor injuries as opposed to more serious damage.

Several weeks with what I hope is a trapped nerve is making me question what I can safely lift.

 

[Daydream believer]

I have had a word with the owner & he would like your address for his solicitor
It seems you interfered & caused damage to his mast
He wants compensating for stress & inconvenience as well as a new mast, tabernacle & cabin top replaced plus some rigging that was stored in the garage at home was kinked in the incident .
The cost of keel compression has yet to be assessed.

It would appear that 2 hanging baskets fell down from the spreaders injuring a scrounger watching from a nearby field
The owners daughter was down below & has had a pregnancy terminated due to shock so he will add that to the bill( apparently it was due in 10 months time but she was seriously thinking about having a baby during the accident )

i believe that 5 Bosnians may also be seriously injured with whiplash when they get to read the post
they have agreed to do an out of court settlement to ease the pain if you wish

i am told that the yard are also being sued for not supervising the event correctly & no risk assessment was presented first
Being a Sunday evening after dark the yard was not suitably floodlit & they should have had a team on hand to assist

i think you will be lucky to keep your house!!!!

 

[prv]

I have had a word with the owner & he would like your address for his solicitor
It seems you interfered & caused damage to his mast
He wants compensating for stress & inconvenience as well as a new mast, tabernacle & cabin top replaced plus some rigging that was stored in the garage at home was kinked in the incident .
The cost of keel compression has yet to be assessed.

OK, it's a huge cliché, but nevertheless I think the advice offered in the celebrated case of Arkell v Pressdram is apposite here

Pete

 

[Mandarin331]

LOL.

 

[alan_d]

OK, it's a huge cliché, but nevertheless I think the advice offered in the celebrated case of Arkell v Pressdram is apposite here

Pete

Ah yes, the traditional advice with regard to sex and travel.

 

[Lakesailor]

Nah. No need to get litigious. The Good Samaritan Defence will suffice.

 

[William_H]

Calculation of the weight of the mast as OP felt it while standing at the back of the cabin is a bit difficult but I will try. You could imagine about 100kg of mast half of which might be described as pressing on a point 3/4 of the way up the mast. That point will be about 3 times as far up the mast as the distance you were lifting/holding from the base of the mast. So I could imagine about a 3 times leverage effect that you felt of the 50kg or conceivably 150kg. Perhaps less, so it is no wonder you dropped it. It is amazing he held it or the 2 of you held it.

This disaster was well in motion when you (OP) stepped in to try to help. Any careful consideration by you would have known that it would drop and so got yourself and then others out of the fall path. Unfortunately we don't always consider these things in the rush of the moment. On the one hand he was right to try to move down to the cockpit so he could take the weight at a more advantageous position but on the other hand to leave you with the load was pretty foolish.
Of course if numpty had any sense he would have had something to catch the mast in. A crutch as high as possible is needed. But then if he didn't have a gin pole to improve the pull angle then he probably wouldn't think of anything else either.

No I think OP did his best and I would probably do the same thing as he, hopefully with more care for my own safety. I have seen similar disasters, one which left a trailer sailer mast broken over the stern rail. It is all so simnple if you just stop and think and get organised. olewill