Lysander 17

[Snoopy463]

Built one from plans that I had bought 20 years previously. When we moved to a house that had a big enough garage I built it, sheathing it inside and out. Took about three years (work got in the way) and cost best part of four grand. Sailed it in the BC . Great on neaps F3 max. Terrifying in wind over tide >F3. Sold it for £800 and bought an Achilles 24.
Lysanders would be superb on lakes or the Broads but limited in strong tidal waters. However I thoroughly enjoyed the build and fulfilled a long held ambition.

 

[johnmcc]

I had a wooden Lysander - my first boat - in the late seventies. Sailed it along the South Coast between Newhaven and the Beaulieu River for a few years. It was gunter-rigged, but outsailed my friend's YM Senior easily, and wasn't seen off by another friend's Westerly 22. Never gave me cause for concern, but I never took it out in more than Force 5. I'd say they are very safe boats if used within sensible limits, and the GRP version is bermudan-rigged, so should point a little higher than mine did. A 4hp outboard is more than adequate, and you can sleep two fairly comfortably. Like others on here I carried extra ballast in the form of 30 kilos of lead stowed under the mast. Had it on a trailer, so never paid for a crane-out. I'm quite jealous - I think I had more fun and more actual sailing in that little boat than any subsequent one.

PS - I had a couple of 7' sweeps to row it with in case of engine trouble. Took a bit of fiddling to set up temporary rowlocks (loops of cord) but they did the job on flat water.

 

[ridgy]

Oh wow check this out:

3 Rivers Race

Looks like we got a deadline for the refit (if it goes ahead...)

 

[johnmcc]

Oh wow check this out:

3 Rivers Race

Looks like we got a deadline for the refit (if it goes ahead...)

That will be exciting (if it goes ahead). Used to be a regular feature of our life when we livd in Norfolk. I ran a rescue Dory there for a couple of years in the late 1990s, usually at Thurne Mouth. There was one Lysander I remember, which didn't do too badly on handicap (I think they used Portsmouth Yardstick for that). The only boats we had to tow home were what you mght call family sailing dinghie with low aspect ratio rigs which sometimes couldn't complete the course in the 24 hours.

 

[norwester]

I built one back in the early70s. It was a great little boat.
After launching and a weeks shakedown, sailed from Gower >Devon>Lundy>Tenby.
Huge open cockpit tho not self draining so a good pump needed.
I later changed the rig from gunter to bermudan and that improved windward performance markedly.

 

[Sybarite]

Like Roger I too have a set of plans somewhere. I was going to build one as I had built a dinghy designed by Percy Blandford (Foamcrest) but one came up for sale locally on a trailer for very little money. The hull was rotted in places as were some frames but I cut this out and replaced it. Mine was just ply no sheathing. I added some lead ballast built a home made wind vane painted her bright signal red and renamed her blood vessel. This was back in the 1970s. Sailed out of west Mersey for two seasons. She was a great little boat but with no self draining cockpit if we had a lot of rain she tended to fill up with water on the swinging mooring

My first sailing boat was a Lysander which took me all over Strangford Lough. I used to take my books out to study moored off some of the islands. And to swim with the seals. I painted mine red too. It was gunter rigged and had Enterprise blue sails.

 

[oldgitofthewest]

I had a Lysander in the seventies. Gunter rigged and mine had some extra ballast bolted to the bottom of the bilge keels. I agree about adding a bit of weight forward. I learned to sail in her on the Menai Straits and spent many happy days afloat. Sailed round Anglesey at least twice. When you hit a sandbank, the rudder hit first causing it to lift off its pintles making it difficult to steer away from danger - the solution was to jump overboard and push. It seemed to cope with big and often very steep waves very well or was I just young, inexperienced and stupid? Anyway, I have been sailing ever since.

 

[Stemar]

It seemed to cope with big and often very steep waves very well

There have been a number of comments about the undesirability of getting a wave in the cockpit, and I certainly wouldn't argue the point but, in practice, how often does that happen outside offshore racing and bluewater sailing? I've never come close, even in some fairly unpleasant conditions for a 24 footer, so is it really something to worry about for an inshore cruiser?

 

[STATUE]

So a friend has one of these in his front garden that has been in the family for many years though since his father died a long time ago it has sat there doing nothing.

This chap has some issues with family tragedy and alcoholism so I've been encouraging him to make some use of it, remind himself of better days etc. I'm wondering how seaworthy they are . I can find a displacement of 380kg but no keel weight or ballast ratio. Ideally we'd take it to the menai straits and do some fishing etc but I'm not sure if that are made for the sea.

Curious if anyone has stories of derring do on the high seas in one...

Peter Sallis the 'Wallis' of 'Wallis & Gromit' fame said on 'Desert Island Discs' "his luxury to take on the island, his boyhood dream 'The Mechano No. 7' - the one with its own mahogany cabinet, like the rich boy at the end of our road had"

This Lysander is you & your friends 'Mechano No. 7' !

Yep, you will have challenges, but that's what will keep your heads occupied and your hands busy.

Finally, you will be the pioneers of the new Reformation of Sailing i. e . ordinary people taking back the seas from the 'dead weighters' kidding themselves they know about the sea on their 36' 40' 45' plastic platforms.

 

[steve yates]

To be clear, this isn't for me. If I was looking to add to my boat collection it would have to be alot more sporty than this thing.

I'm trying to rejuvenate my friend by rejuvenating his fathers boat for him and understanding what we can do with it when it's sorted. I'm just providing the knowledge, motivation, and probably the money!

Your doing a good thing. Folk need more friends like you.

 

[ridgy]

Finally, you will be the pioneers of the new Reformation of Sailing i. e . ordinary people taking back the seas from the 'dead weighters' kidding themselves they know about the sea on their 36' 40' 45' plastic platforms.

A delightful reply and a very lovely thought but I did my apprenticeship on small bilge keeled outboard powered boats 20 years ago. My first trip as skipper was delivering my new to me Hurley 22 from fishguard to bangor only half an hour after seeing it float for the first time and then taking 36 hours after running out of petrol near bardsey island. 3 more years of that sort of thing and I was very pleased to move up to an inboard with standing headroom and I'm not looking to revisit those early years which are definitely best left as rose tinted memories.

The only records we'll be setting on this thing are for the amount of wine consumed and fish caught while tied up and i hear that the Norfolk broads are ideal in every respect...

 

[norwester]

Ah.. The jaundiced and jaded brigade are pitching in. Just say you're considering a British Seagull outboard for propulsion on your Lysander and just wait for the apoplectic posts to flood in.
It's sad that so many feel that they have to comment in posts that have are of no real interest to them!
One reason the Lysander never grew swiftly in popularity was, I believe, due to a vicious article in an old PBO magazine that referred to it as ' a ditch crawler..... Could this possibly have been down to a dislike of its original sponsor which was an oppo publication called Light Craft?
Take no notice of the hate crowd. Restore the little boat. It can take you places that all the big boats just can't go and enjoy anchoring in peace and tranquillity away from the crowds.

 

[johnmcc]

Quite right about the Seagull. My Lysander was pushed along when necessary by a Seagull 102 with the old cylindrical tank. It did cause the odd problem but was easily fixed. On one memorable occasion we were going east through the Looe Channel off Selsea Bill when it conked. Through bad planning we had an ebb tide gradually exposing the rocky bits around us and not a breath of wind. I chucked the fisherman anchor out, which fortunately held, while I took the rotor top off the engine (with the Seagull tool and a big hammer), reset the points, cleaned the plug and reset the gap, reassembled it, and - Glory - it fired up again first pull.

 

[oldharry]

Built one from plans that I had bought 20 years previously. When we moved to a house that had a big enough garage I built it, sheathing it inside and out. Took about three years (work got in the way) and cost best part of four grand. Sailed it in the BC . Great on neaps F3 max. Terrifying in wind over tide >F3. Sold it for £800 and bought an Achilles 24.
Lysanders would be superb on lakes or the Broads but limited in strong tidal waters. However I thoroughly enjoyed the build and fulfilled a long held ambition.

Lysander 'terrifying in wind over tide >F3' Achilles 24 'terrifying in wind over tide > F9' . My Lysander never terrified me even when it should have done, and coped with everything I threw it at - which was a lot more than was safe sometimes, being my first boat. Steep learning curves, but the boat and I survived several quite foolhardy moments!

 

[The Q]

That will be exciting (if it goes ahead). Used to be a regular feature of our life when we livd in Norfolk. I ran a rescue Dory there for a couple of years in the late 1990s, usually at Thurne Mouth. There was one Lysander I remember, which didn't do too badly on handicap (I think they used Portsmouth Yardstick for that). The only boats we had to tow home were what you mght call family sailing dinghie with low aspect ratio rigs which sometimes couldn't complete the course in the 24 hours.

That might have been me, I competed in the 3RR in my or a friend's Lysander for quite a few years.
The true handicap for a Lysander is 34% off your finishing time on broads handicap, but the most they give in the 3RR is 25% off . That's because they want to discourage too many slow boats entering.
In the maybe ten times I've competed in a Lysander we failed to get round twice, once we broke the tabernacle, another we were within 800 yards of finishing when we got timed out after 24hours. The best we achieved if you recalculate to 34% off would have been 16th. I have achieved a top 10 finish in a yeoman since then.

Tips for the race?
Check the tides they really are important. A displacement boat like a Lysander needs to go with the tide.
Empty everything out of the Lysander you don't need, in the Lysander owners magazine some one weighed their Lysander it was over a ton.... 1/2 a ton overweight!!! There's a lot of room in the lockers to store junk...
Put your outboard down in the bottom of the boat under the mast apart from from waving a large chunk of metal at your fellow competitors being impolite, a Lysander drags her bum at the slightest excuse,.
The helm needs to sit in the middle of the cockpit seat, the crew right up by the cabin.. again don't drag your Lysander's bum...

What do I race now ? My own home built 16ft open keel boat should be launched at the start of Hornings season at the end of march. But I won't be doing the 3RR, because this year, like the last 4races, I'll be guardship commander at Hickling broad..
PS I'll post a notice for this year's race shortly.

 

[Sybarite]

That might have been me, I competed in the 3RR in my or a friend's Lysander for quite a few years.
The true handicap for a Lysander is 34% off your finishing time on broads handicap, but the most they give in the 3RR is 25% off . That's because they want to discourage too many slow boats entering.
In the maybe ten times I've competed in a Lysander we failed to get round twice, once we broke the tabernacle, another we were within 800 yards of finishing when we got timed out after 24hours. The best we achieved if you recalculate to 34% off would have been 16th. I have achieved a top 10 finish in a yeoman since then.

Tips for the race?
Check the tides they really are important. A displacement boat like a Lysander needs to go with the tide.
Empty everything out of the Lysander you don't need, in the Lysander owners magazine some one weighed their Lysander it was over a ton.... 1/2 a ton overweight!!! There's a lot of room in the lockers to store junk...
Put your outboard down in the bottom of the boat under the mast apart from from waving a large chunk of metal at your fellow competitors being impolite, a Lysander drags her bum at the slightest excuse,.
The helm needs to sit in the middle of the cockpit seat, the crew right up by the cabin.. again don't drag your Lysander's bum...

What do I race now ? My own home built 16ft open keel boat should be launched at the start of Hornings season at the end of march. But I won't be doing the 3RR, because this year, like the last 4races, I'll be guardship commander at Hickling broad..
PS I'll post a notice for this year's race shortly.

As a student I cruised 4 up around SW Ireland in my Lysander. When I say 4 up it was 2 +2 and a tent. Being prudent I telephoned the coast guard for advice about rounding Mizzen Head.

"Are you mad?"

 

[The Q]

In between living in Norfolk i lived in the outer Hebrides for 18 months, and sailed in the Minch up and down the outer Hebrides. Very studiously checking the shipping forecast each time. Got caught out once...
Shipping Forecast said nothing the night before, so I launched her in the morning, had a little sail up and down in beautiful sunshine . Stopped for lunch before heading out and......

The next forecast said Hebrides gales imminent!!!! I had no access to TV this was pre internet so no view of pressure charts of the Atlantic.

The tide was out I couldn't recover the boat. So I had a look at the charts and found a very small sheltered bay with only a small entrance, . Went there, dropped anchor, lowered the mast, put the boom tent over the mast instead of the boom. And spent a very uncomfortable 36hours bouncing around listening to the wind roaring overhead..

 

[ridgy]

Well since the thread has been resurrected I might as well give an update.

After some considerable lockdown fettling, mostly of the trailer which had rusted away in parts, I'm pleased to report that Griff sails again. and that we did indeed enter the 3 rivers race.

There was pretty much no wind for the race which in a dumpy bilge keeled boat with very tired sails was somewhat terminal to progress. We therefore retired gracefully after a couple of hours to the comfort of Malthouse Broad for a pleasant afternoon in the pub and then a soothing night at anchor.

Given that there was no wind whatsoever in the evening I had expected the whole fleet to have retired so when we motored back to Horning SC for breakfast on Sunday morning I was astonished to find boats still sailing and finishing. Fair play to the finishers, I wouldn't have that much patience even in a sportier boat but thanks to Horning SC for a super event and we intend to try again this year.







On the road to Norfolk:





After 23 years or something, a captain of his fathers ship once more:

 

[Snoopy463]

That's one posh Lysander. Metal mast, pulpit, pulpit and stanchions; very impressive!

 

[The Q]

I wondered where you'd gone to during the race. Please make it to Hickling broad this year, so I can see you and hopefully take a Piccy.
It was an odd year last year, many very fast boats didn't finish, but some slower boats did, because they used the tides better.. Probably with local knowledge.

Of which this might help...
Norfolk-Broads.org
click on tides then forward it to 28 /29 May 2022 then click on view tides and you can print out the tides for the broads for the day ..

High tide this year is again just after midday, so unless the wind is very strong, don't try to go up the Ant first against the tide , you'll be too late and be wasting your time.
Decide at that point whether you have 4 hours to get to the Lower Bure Buoy with the tide. If not do South Walsham first , then come up to Hickling with the changing tide. Then down with the tide to the lower Bure Buoy. Then back via the short legs..

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