Lithium. Really?

[fredrussell]

I'm a bit puzzled by the enthusiasm for battery powered drills. Obviously useful where mains power is unavailable, but they seem to now be the default choice, despite the issues of battery safety, capacity and longevity.

Lack of power cord drag/entanglement is probably nice, but I havnt found that a huge issue with my corded drills

Whilst I, like many other respondents on here, find your dislike of cordless tools mystifying, I will say there is a case for some corded tools still. I’ve done jobs where the charge rate of the three or four batteries I possess is not enough to keep the tool going. Obviously that’s just a case of me not owning enough batteries, or the ones I have being a bit tired perhaps. Other than that, it’s cordless every time. I think if you used a modern quality tool with a 5a/h battery you would very quickly reassess their usefulness.

 

[Bouba]

Ten years ago.... I would buy (extremely) cheap corded tools because a) they did the job b) they were disposable. Another reason is that the cheap cordless ones at the time were gutless and the battery life abysmal.
That changed....I don’t really see those cheap (MiC) corded tools on the shelves as much....and even mid range cordless are extremely good....both power and battery life.
The only thing you can really complain about is that the cordless tools are a bulkier and often have very wide grip handles. But that is more than offset by not cutting your electric flex with your hedge trimmer or angle grinder.
Just out of interest....after a devastating flood in my workshop some time ago....I used the insurance money to get fewer better tools rather than my collection of cheap tools...which were accumulated over the years and not a planned purchase

 

[Sea Change]

I can't say enough good things about my Makita LXT tools, but there are some occasions when corded makes more sense. Anything very high powered that is used for prolonged periods.
E.g. when I was grinding back a trailer to bare steel, a corded grinder was lighter and could run indefinitely. Sanding and polishing likewise.
But for everything else, cordless all the way.

On a related note, when I was building my house I ditched the Paslode nail gun in favour of a compressor powered one. This is the air tool equivalent of going back to corded. The air hose was a pain, but not as big a pain as having to constantly swap gas bottles which refused to work properly in a Scottish winter, and had to be kept warm in an inside pocket (or even better a mug of tea!)

 

[ducked]

I have read the whole thread and there’s no plausible explanation. There’s some explanation of how poor LA battery powered tools were twenty years ago but that’s irrelevant now.

With the greatest of respect, your dismissal of modern battery powered tools is irrational unless you simply don’t do any DIY or own boat maintenance.

The reason I cited tradespeople is that if battery powered tools were as bad as you’ve suggested, they wouldn’t use them. The reality is that they’re not stupid and they ALL without exception use lithium battery powered tools for most of their work. You don’t need to be a tradesperson to follow their good practice and benefit. If you really do any amount of DIY, and borrowed my Makita 18V drill for a few days I believe you’d be a convert.

I’m also not sure why you think tradespeople are not reasonably well off. I was delivering a yacht recently with the owner on board. He was a qualified electrician and admitted he wouldn’t get out of bed for less than £350/day. I know lots of people have much larger salaries but…

OK, seems I do have to explain it after all. My mistake.

Runagroundhard wrote "Cordless started with the trades as it saved having to run temporary power cables to work locations. They contribute to productivity and reduce overheads contributing to better profits"

Productivity argument sounded pretty plausible to me. Unsure about the reduced overheads, but time is (a lot of) money to a trady so thats probably sufficient explanation.

They go on to say "Corded is perfectly suitable for infrequent use of the tool or where the tool tends to be used in the same place all the time."

This is my situation. I'm likely to be working in a boatyard with power for some time, and will be attacking rust on keels, which I suspect will feel like the same place all the time." If I burn out my three corded drills doing this, or if I need to do work out on a mooring which a hand drill or inverter wont cope with In the future, then I'll reconsider, but right now I have no requirement.

I’m also not sure why you think I think tradespeople are not reasonably well off, so I'd better explain that as well.

I think tradespeople, generally speaking, are rolling in it, and I possibly think that to an exaggerated extent, Harry Enfields Loadsamoney plasterer stylee. This implies that I think the cost of many Makitawatts isn't of much significance to tradies, whereas it would be to me.

I think I wouldnt be well off as a tradesperson because I am too slow. This further implies that the time spent unreeling my power lead isnt really a big deal to me in the overal scheme of timewasting things

 

[ridgy]

I think tradespeople, generally speaking, are rolling in it

Maybe you don't know many tradesmen. I do and they generally aren't rolling in it.

For sure an electrician can make 350 a day but can he do it 5 days a week 48 weeks a year? I know a good electrician but he can always fit me in at short notice during the day.
I know a good plasterer who was just off work for 2 weeks unpaid after a bruising encounter with a steel beam. I know a bricklayer who didn't work at all in April waiting for a job to start that got delayed.

Also, the rates paid by builders to tradesmen are substantially less than you would pay privately. Take your pick, regular work from the builder or risk being quiet privately and have to quote jobs you don't get and might not get paid for if you do.
Obviously sorting their own pensions out as well.

 

[john_morris_uk]

Maybe you don't know many tradesmen. I do and they generally aren't rolling in it.

For sure an electrician can make 350 a day but can he do it 5 days a week 48 weeks a year? I know a good electrician but he can always fit me in at short notice during the day.
I know a good plasterer who was just off work for 2 weeks unpaid after a bruising encounter with a steel beam. I know a bricklayer who didn't work at all in April waiting for a job to start that got delayed.

Also, the rates paid by builders to tradesmen are substantially less than you would pay privately. Take your pick, regular work from the builder or risk being quiet privately and have to quote jobs you don't get and might not get paid for if you do.
Obviously sorting their own pensions out as well.

I agree with you that trades people aren’t generally rolling in it. They may get 350 a day for the days they work but that doesn’t take into account the cost of their van, insurance, tool replacement, etc. Nor does it take into account the no pay when they’re not working e.g. holidays bank holidays etc.

However I was responding to ducked who claims he would be extremely poor or in his words ‘even more broke’ if he was a tradesperson. It appears that’s because he works very slowly, not because of the lack of pay of a trades person.

 

[john_morris_uk]

OK, seems I do have to explain it after all. My mistake.

Runagroundhard wrote "Cordless started with the trades as it saved having to run temporary power cables to work locations. They contribute to productivity and reduce overheads contributing to better profits"

Productivity argument sounded pretty plausible to me. Unsure about the reduced overheads, but time is (a lot of) money to a trady so thats probably sufficient explanation.

They go on to say "Corded is perfectly suitable for infrequent use of the tool or where the tool tends to be used in the same place all the time."

This is my situation. I'm likely to be working in a boatyard with power for some time, and will be attacking rust on keels, which I suspect will feel like the same place all the time." If I burn out my three corded drills doing this, or if I need to do work out on a mooring which a hand drill or inverter wont cope with In the future, then I'll reconsider, but right now I have no requirement.

I’m also not sure why you think I think tradespeople are not reasonably well off, so I'd better explain that as well.

I think tradespeople, generally speaking, are rolling in it, and I possibly think that to an exaggerated extent, Harry Enfields Loadsamoney plasterer stylee. This implies that I think the cost of many Makitawatts isn't of much significance to tradies, whereas it would be to me.

I think I wouldnt be well off as a tradesperson because I am too slow. This further implies that the time spent unreeling my power lead isnt really a big deal to me in the overal scheme of timewasting things

If I was attacking rust on keels I would either be looking up the details of a local grit blasting company or using a corded angle grinder with a rotary wire brush. It’s an exception to the rule and doesn’t prove cordless are no good. The reason professionals say corded is ok for infrequent use is because infrequent use means you don’t waste time unwinding a power lead.

I’ve just sanded the washboards on my daughter’s boat. I used a Makita palm sander running off an 18 V lithium battery. Despite sanding for the last 40 minutes or so the battery is still showing five red lights indicating it’s more than 75% charged.

I still think that if you tried my Makita 18 V lithium battery drill which has a screwdriver function as well as drill and hammer drill function you’d be converted very quickly. I use it a lot and I think I charged it last week or the week before but I can’t remember…. It might have been three weeks ago.

 

[Wansworth]

My cordless drill stands on the new work bench ready whilst the three corded drills are gathering dust and damp,…..cordless lawn mower,hedge/ brush cutter ,small chainsaw ……all good tools and flexible to use without cutting danger !

 

[Chiara’s slave]

My cordless drill stands on the new work bench ready whilst the three corded drills are gathering dust and damp,…..cordless lawn mower,hedge/ brush cutter ,small chainsaw ……all good tools and flexible to use without cutting danger !

My cordless lawnmower is mostly parked up. Because it’s successor is not just cordless but completely automatic. Though I did have to ask it politely via it’s app, to park itself while we have tea on the lawn.

 

[Wansworth]

My cordless lawnmower is mostly parked up. Because it’s successor is not just cordless but completely automatic. Though I did have to ask it politely via it’s app, to park itself while we have tea on the lawn.

Pondering the idea for the wife finca saving a six hour round trip to cut the field,slightly at a gradient……one worry will it get nicked

 

[Bouba]

My car is cordless

 

[Fr J Hackett]

Pondering the idea for the wife finca saving a six hour round trip to cut the field,slightly at a gradient……one worry will it get nicked

My hosts on my recent trip to Blighty had a Husqvarna automatic mower nearly £4K and he put in the charging system cabling, concrete base and cover and GPS unit. It does a very good job of cutting his lawns twice a week but he says that if the grass gets longer than a weeks growth it won't manage. Looking at the blades (£19 a pop) they look moor like razor blades. So unless you have a 240 / 110 volt supply and can guarantee that the grass will be reasonably short with no obstacles like dog poo or twigs ( he has to walk the lawns before it starts to make sure there are no such things) then I doubt it's for you.

 

[sigma38dave]

35 years experience tradesperson here…the only items I plug into the mains - Festool dust extraction, 4 port battery fast charger, Henry hoover and a kettle.

I’d wager my lithium batteries have a much tougher life than most DIYers and have not had or heard of a single issue with them via my colleagues.

This further implies that the time spent unreeling my power lead isnt really a big deal to me in the overal scheme of timewasting things

Wait until someone won’t let you plug into their electrical supply and then you’ll appreciate why we like to be as self sufficient as possible with our cordless gear!

 

[Trident]

Like everything with cordless you get what you pay for. After burning out a corded Wolf drill trying to use a hole saw through some very thick hard wood, my mate lent me his Festool cordless (I thought he was joking) which went through it like butter. It was then 10 years old and used daily and perfect. As a wooden boat shipwright he has the full set of Festool stuff and I'm very envious. My Makita kit works very well though and didn't cost me £10k a decade ago...

 

[ducked]

Seems there should be lots of idle high quality corded stuff available cheaply second hand.

Which is nice.

 

[zoidberg]

Y'all have just reminded me. I've left a 'el cheapo' 20Ah battery on charge a couple of days too long....

...and I've just now checked. Yes, I HAD switched off the power to my bandsaw and bench drill press. Habit!

 

[zoidberg]

May I re-energise this thread?

What's the consensus on carrying one of those emergency starter devices to and from the boat? Some have USB-C outputs so could be useful for recharging some devices.

Reliability? Safety? Likely to do what it says on the tin?

 

[Fr J Hackett]

If you have a half sorted / decent electrical installation preferably with a bit of solar you are never going to have flat batteries so the investment should be in sorting out the boats systems rather than buying sticking plasters.

 

[lustyd]

I sort of agree with Fr here, i considered a “solar generator” but realised the space was far better used by another house battery. That said, our use isn’t everyone’s use so I think some boats lend themselves to a portable unit either starter or “generator” and as you say, USB chargers are definitely useful.
Safety wise, if it’s small like a car starter then easy to throw in the oggin. If it’s bugger and heavier like a generator, make sure it’s LFE and I can’t see an issue. Obviously don’t buy a cheap one from AliExpress expecting safety to be front and centre in the design.

 

[ducked]

If I was attacking rust on keels I would either be looking up the details of a local grit blasting company or using a corded angle grinder with a rotary wire brush. It’s an exception to the rule and doesn’t prove cordless are no good. The reason professionals say corded is ok for infrequent use is because infrequent use means you don’t waste time unwinding a power lead.

I’ve just sanded the washboards on my daughter’s boat. I used a Makita palm sander running off an 18 V lithium battery. Despite sanding for the last 40 minutes or so the battery is still showing five red lights indicating it’s more than 75% charged.

I still think that if you tried my Makita 18 V lithium battery drill which has a screwdriver function as well as drill and hammer drill function you’d be converted very quickly. I use it a lot and I think I charged it last week or the week before but I can’t remember…. It might have been three weeks ago.

Well thats fine, because I've no interest in proving cordless are no good, and no more use for such a proof than I might have for whatever the "rule" is that it might be an exception to.

It just happens to be my most likely use case.

My other likely use-case is power sanding old antifouling off, maybe in prep for coppercoat, if I can face doing it. Less sure about that (and cant remember what sanding kit I've got available in the UK, so I might need to get something new, at least to me.)

I suspect corded might have the edge there too since it'll be a long tedious nasty job. You'll be dragging a power cord but you wont be lifting a battery.

There is maybe a shock hazard if sanding wet though.

Oo-er

and Ugh!