chrisb
New member
astonishing report liferafts this month. suppose the point is when you take to your raft take the avon dingy with you[ym december]
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life rafts
- Thread starter chrisb
- Start date
Talbot
Active member
dont take YM only PBO so please expand (have an avon liferaft)
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chrisb
New member
3 rafts tested. one failed to inflate[zodiac].presumably all in good state of service. all reputable manufacturer. ym dec.
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trouville
N/A
i dont have pbo either but when i did i was amazed at the stupid fanticies peoplewho clearly never left the pontoon had about safty!!
Ive often wonderd if the life raft could be got on the water without blowing away--once its on the water its ok--then i wonderd how would i get into it??Ok if its a calm day but with the wind howling and a sea running the boat rolling or pitching ------ukkkkk---i supose just hold on to the line from the raft and jump????ever seen an avon dingy in a blow?Or a zodiac come to that pewww
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Ive often wonderd if the life raft could be got on the water without blowing away--once its on the water its ok--then i wonderd how would i get into it??Ok if its a calm day but with the wind howling and a sea running the boat rolling or pitching ------ukkkkk---i supose just hold on to the line from the raft and jump????ever seen an avon dingy in a blow?Or a zodiac come to that pewww
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Solitaire
Active member
Go do a sea survival course then!
<hr width=100% size=1>Boating is <A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.powerboattraininguk.co.uk>Serious Fun</A>
<hr width=100% size=1>Boating is <A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.powerboattraininguk.co.uk>Serious Fun</A>
trouville
N/A
I know what to do sensible people practice using a merchent boats life raft or as i did the raft repacking people
In another post i noted to my shock that my plastimo 6 person raft fell to pieces when it had been trapped unopend under water for a couple of days. I took it to be opened and repacked even though it had been done that year --i like to change the food and water--and i have a freind who has a overhall service in Italy so i dont pay--this time when we opened it it tried to inflate but fell apart--the seams and fittings fell apart!!i still have it just to show people
better to stay with the boat On and courses are for those with two much time and money
ive been told you even need a permision to sail now--vote labour peww awful
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In another post i noted to my shock that my plastimo 6 person raft fell to pieces when it had been trapped unopend under water for a couple of days. I took it to be opened and repacked even though it had been done that year --i like to change the food and water--and i have a freind who has a overhall service in Italy so i dont pay--this time when we opened it it tried to inflate but fell apart--the seams and fittings fell apart!!i still have it just to show people
better to stay with the boat On and courses are for those with two much time and money
ive been told you even need a permision to sail now--vote labour peww awful
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Shanty
Member
Don't know which worried me more - the Zodiac guy saying "problem - what problem?", or the YM "Verdict" which seemed to be more a plug for Zodiac liferafts. Why was the Ocean model mentioned - it wasn't involved in the test?
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BrianJ
New member
Re: Anybody
Who goes to sea without having done the "sea survival " course is bloody mad.. Do the course,find out how difficult it is ,with all your wet weather gear on ..including boots, life jacket ( PFD) in a wave pool , then imagine the elements ..ie wind blowing like S** * big waves . etc...
Just p[ray yu never have to leave the boat....
BrianJ
<hr width=100% size=1>BrianJ
Who goes to sea without having done the "sea survival " course is bloody mad.. Do the course,find out how difficult it is ,with all your wet weather gear on ..including boots, life jacket ( PFD) in a wave pool , then imagine the elements ..ie wind blowing like S** * big waves . etc...
Just p[ray yu never have to leave the boat....
BrianJ
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Solitaire
Active member
Re: Anybody
And just remember - you should step up into a liferaft, not step down to it! A sea survival course will also make peopele realise why crotch straps and a spray hood are so important.
<hr width=100% size=1>Boating is <A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.powerboattraininguk.co.uk>Serious Fun</A>
And just remember - you should step up into a liferaft, not step down to it! A sea survival course will also make peopele realise why crotch straps and a spray hood are so important.
<hr width=100% size=1>Boating is <A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.powerboattraininguk.co.uk>Serious Fun</A>
Talbot
Active member
You have a bad conception of a life raft. The only reason you should be stepping down into a raft from the boat is if your boat is on fire, and you cant put the fire out. Otherwise getting into the liferaft is only done if the yacht has sunk! - read the reports on the fastnet and compare the statistics of those who remained in their boats against those who took to their liferaft too early.
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trouville
N/A
yes! as i sail a wooden boat, im happy to say i havent sunk! but if it came to abadoning ship i wouldent leave untill the last moment. and from what i was told i should do that just before my boats going down but with enough time to get well away from the wreck
we tried in the river by Rome and as the boat sunk the raft would be sucked under we had to be about 4/5 feet off before it went down. Later the baloons were inflated and the "sunk " boat resurfaced for the next try!! still in "reall" conditions im normaly terrified without being forced to get in a rubber boat when i would be exhausted and affraid--i hope it never happens and i to can dream of getting in my boston whaler and driving to safty ---towing the life raft!!!
<hr width=100% size=1>liveaboard
we tried in the river by Rome and as the boat sunk the raft would be sucked under we had to be about 4/5 feet off before it went down. Later the baloons were inflated and the "sunk " boat resurfaced for the next try!! still in "reall" conditions im normaly terrified without being forced to get in a rubber boat when i would be exhausted and affraid--i hope it never happens and i to can dream of getting in my boston whaler and driving to safty ---towing the life raft!!!
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Peppermint
New member
Re: Didn\'t matter.
As nice mister Zodiac explained the back up system worked. So thats alright then.
Next time I'm slightly hyperthermic, wet, frightened and worried about my crew. It's dark and stormy and the boats just vanished. I'll be reinsured to know that the ill formed bladder I'm swimming around will be fine once I've spent an hour pumping it up.
Might be why I don't own one. Half the stuff you use a lot won't work reliably at sea, so what chance has something that just sits there got.
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As nice mister Zodiac explained the back up system worked. So thats alright then.
Next time I'm slightly hyperthermic, wet, frightened and worried about my crew. It's dark and stormy and the boats just vanished. I'll be reinsured to know that the ill formed bladder I'm swimming around will be fine once I've spent an hour pumping it up.
Might be why I don't own one. Half the stuff you use a lot won't work reliably at sea, so what chance has something that just sits there got.
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nicho
Well-known member
This is a real concern, 'cos I've got the Zodiac tested, albeit the 4 man version - and it didn't bloody well inflate properly in the test. Zodiac's response was also worrying in that "it was OK when inflated with the manual pump provided as a emergencyback up"!!! I don't think that's what I want to hear. Presumably, they will investigate and carry out a product recall if there is a problem. I wouldn't mind, but it was twice the price of some, and I assumed the inflated price (sorry!!) would mean a better quality, and reliability.
I'm going to keep this on follow, and I hope YM do so too.
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I'm going to keep this on follow, and I hope YM do so too.
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BlueSkyNick
Active member
Let me know if you want to sell it at a much reduced price - I have been planning to order one at LBS.
I haven't seen the mag yet - some of us still have to work all day. However, I am sure one could find fault with all brand names on sale, if a sufficiently large sample could be taken. ie they should be testing 100 of each type and comparing the failure rate.
Maybe they have... I'll read about it sometime in the next month!
<hr width=100% size=1>I can't be bothered with a footnote - it's usually rubbish anyway.
I haven't seen the mag yet - some of us still have to work all day. However, I am sure one could find fault with all brand names on sale, if a sufficiently large sample could be taken. ie they should be testing 100 of each type and comparing the failure rate.
Maybe they have... I'll read about it sometime in the next month!
<hr width=100% size=1>I can't be bothered with a footnote - it's usually rubbish anyway.
chrisb
New member
i posted this not as a stimulus to debate survival courses or whether or not to own a liferaft but to stimulate debate upon what i see as a complacent attitude to my safety by a major liferaft manufacturer. i expect my liferaft to inflate when i need it-that is why i invested in one and pay to have it regularly serviced. whether i step up or down to it is irrelevent it may represent my sole chance of survival.it would appear i cannot expect it to perform this function. note the difficulty in using the hand pump and the confusion regarding the valve caps in a swimming pool.this situation would be impossible for a frightened crew at night in a water laden partially inflated liferaft. if you agree lets hear from you all
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peterb
New member
If it doesn't work when you really need it, could you return it under guarantee? I suppose they would claim that the return rate is very low!
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BrendanS
Well-known member
reminds me of the old classic.
Sign at a Parachute manufacturers. If you experience any problems with your purchase, please drop in
<hr width=100% size=1>Me transmitte sursum, caledoni
Sign at a Parachute manufacturers. If you experience any problems with your purchase, please drop in
<hr width=100% size=1>Me transmitte sursum, caledoni
Peppermint
New member
Re: Liferafts are a waste of money
I know its a provocative statement but I think for most sailors it's true. Buying a liferaft is the nautical equivalent of crossing your fingers. I know one guy who, finding his didn't work, got the crew back to work and saved his vessel in a Biscay storm. I sat in a pub with a guy who went into one with three companions and after a night of rolling down waves was the only guy left in to be rescued. They are not a panacea.
Most sailors are rarely more than four hours from rescue. Less if you have a 406 EPIRB with GPS. Most sailors sail well founded yachts. Most sailors agree that the boat sinking or fire are the biggest threat that would lead to an abandonment.
Survival or abandonment suit's with the EPIRB would be a better investment. Spending money on improved maintenance, collision bulkheads and beefing up fire fighting equipment makes more sense. Very few boats go on fire in heavy weather so a better tender should do the job.
There are 10's of 1000's of liferafts on yachts and yet if one gets used it gets in the papers. If your boats not coded and you sail like normal folk, pottering about and doing the odd 100 mile passage you don't need one. If you go a bit further afield you can hire one in.
Spend the money on something that keeps you out of trouble in the first place, or increases the integrity of your main vessel.
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I know its a provocative statement but I think for most sailors it's true. Buying a liferaft is the nautical equivalent of crossing your fingers. I know one guy who, finding his didn't work, got the crew back to work and saved his vessel in a Biscay storm. I sat in a pub with a guy who went into one with three companions and after a night of rolling down waves was the only guy left in to be rescued. They are not a panacea.
Most sailors are rarely more than four hours from rescue. Less if you have a 406 EPIRB with GPS. Most sailors sail well founded yachts. Most sailors agree that the boat sinking or fire are the biggest threat that would lead to an abandonment.
Survival or abandonment suit's with the EPIRB would be a better investment. Spending money on improved maintenance, collision bulkheads and beefing up fire fighting equipment makes more sense. Very few boats go on fire in heavy weather so a better tender should do the job.
There are 10's of 1000's of liferafts on yachts and yet if one gets used it gets in the papers. If your boats not coded and you sail like normal folk, pottering about and doing the odd 100 mile passage you don't need one. If you go a bit further afield you can hire one in.
Spend the money on something that keeps you out of trouble in the first place, or increases the integrity of your main vessel.
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Robin
Well-known member
Re: Liferafts are a waste of money
I have to say that there is a valid argument along those lines for many boats doing just basic local cruising with the odd holiday cruise going 'foreign', which in most cases is a shortish trip anyway. However as always there is a BUT:-
Fire and collision remain to my mind the most likely reason to need a liferaft for the kind of cruising most people do, ie within the accurate part of weather forecasts, within VHF range of Coastguard Stations and in areas frequented by other vessels and not too far from rescue craft. In the event of fire, catastrophic leaking maybe following stranding or collision then there MUST be IMO a means readily and immediately available of abandoning ship, namely an already inflated dinghy on deck or in davits. or at least half inflated (Avon doughnut style). Being marina based, we no longer use a dinghy to reach a mooring and therefore it is not routinely carried on deck either fully or partially inflated. Even when we used to half deflate a Redcrest and stow it on deck, we would not do this if we were expecting heavy weather, especially upwind. Nowadays on our main cruises once the Zodiac is inflated it will be carried on deck as long as heavy weather is not expected, but for normal weekend use that is unlikely and if it is used at all it will be put away for the return trip.
So to my mind I need a liferaft available all season and not just hired in for the longer trips. The hire costs too do not compare favourably with purchasing and servicing costs either, unless the hire periods are very short or very infrequent.
<hr width=100% size=1><font size=1>Sermons from my pulpit are with tongue firmly in cheek and come with no warranty!</font size=1>
I have to say that there is a valid argument along those lines for many boats doing just basic local cruising with the odd holiday cruise going 'foreign', which in most cases is a shortish trip anyway. However as always there is a BUT:-
Fire and collision remain to my mind the most likely reason to need a liferaft for the kind of cruising most people do, ie within the accurate part of weather forecasts, within VHF range of Coastguard Stations and in areas frequented by other vessels and not too far from rescue craft. In the event of fire, catastrophic leaking maybe following stranding or collision then there MUST be IMO a means readily and immediately available of abandoning ship, namely an already inflated dinghy on deck or in davits. or at least half inflated (Avon doughnut style). Being marina based, we no longer use a dinghy to reach a mooring and therefore it is not routinely carried on deck either fully or partially inflated. Even when we used to half deflate a Redcrest and stow it on deck, we would not do this if we were expecting heavy weather, especially upwind. Nowadays on our main cruises once the Zodiac is inflated it will be carried on deck as long as heavy weather is not expected, but for normal weekend use that is unlikely and if it is used at all it will be put away for the return trip.
So to my mind I need a liferaft available all season and not just hired in for the longer trips. The hire costs too do not compare favourably with purchasing and servicing costs either, unless the hire periods are very short or very infrequent.
<hr width=100% size=1><font size=1>Sermons from my pulpit are with tongue firmly in cheek and come with no warranty!</font size=1>
nicho
Well-known member
I don't mind the odd minor fault Nick, but not inflating is a fairly large problem in a liferaft. Still want to buy it??
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