Leisure 23SL actual weight

[AEMD]

hi,
I am considering changing my Newbridge Venturer for something a tad bigger, 23ft, that has headroom - to avoid backache....
I am interested in a Leisure 23SL, but will probably need to buy a new trailer for it as I want to be able to take it home for winter.

For this reason does anyone have an ACTUAL , not guesswork figure of the real weight of one of these boats - I would be buying with an outboard rather than an inboard ? Perhaps one of you good people has had one lifted in slings on a crane at some time ?

I ask this because my Venturer weighs about 400kgs more than the stated weight, calculated by deduction at a proper weighbridge, the all up weight on trailer is 2200kgs.

The boat is going to be kept in France, so whatever boat I get I will need to register the trailer; hence the reason for probably buying new to get a certificate of conformity. I successfully registered my existing Hayling trailer, but not without a lot of hard work - and a certain degree of fudging paperwork. I will need genuine figures on paperwork for the French authorities, as well as for the car insurance to tow the outfit. I don't want to buy a trailer only to find the boat is too heavy for it. At the moment I am thinking 3000KGs all up.

 

[LittleSister]

For this reason does anyone have an ACTUAL , not guesswork figure of the real weight of one of these boats - I would be buying with an outboard rather than an inboard ? Perhaps one of you good people has had one lifted in slings on a crane at some time ?

I ask this because my Venturer weighs about 400kgs more than the stated weight, calculated by deduction at a proper weighbridge, the all up weight on trailer is 2200kgs.

I will need genuine figures on paperwork for the French authorities, as well as for the car insurance to tow the outfit. I don't want to buy a trailer only to find the boat is too heavy for it. At the moment I am thinking 3000KGs all up.

I don't know an actual tested figure, I'm afraid, but I can say the pre-SL Leisure 23 mk1 was quoted by PBO as 4050lbs (= 1837kg) design displacement. The 23SL is unlikely to be very different, I would have thought, as it has the same hull. Your guess of 3,000kgs looks reasonable to me (though I know that doesn't solve your problem).

 

[VicS]

I don't know an actual tested figure, I'm afraid, but I can say the pre-SL Leisure 23 mk1 was quoted by PBO as 4050lbs (= 1837kg) design displacement. The 23SL is unlikely to be very different, I would have thought, as it has the same hull. Your guess of 3,000kgs looks reasonable to me (though I know that doesn't solve your problem).

The brochure displacement figure can be found on the LOA website ...1841kg.

 

[Seashoreman]

AEMD I have owned a L23sl for about five years and am quite willing to answer what I can if you wish to PM me. However the Leisure Owners Association website is full of such details, a member has spent a great deal of time and effort creating a dedicated L23 'handbook'. I fully recommend and suggest you join for £6 (?) per year, very worthwhile.
As for you and trailer, I assume you have factored in the added weight of batteries, fuel, water, tools, heads (?) and general stuff? Certainly adds up.

 

[Simonpk]

This might give you some details to compare with the LOA.

http://sailboatdata.com/viewrecord.asp?class_id=4062

 

[Lakesailor]

I despair.

 

[AEMD]

Lakesailor, that's really helpful ... You despair of what precisely ??? !!!
Thank you other people who have taken the trouble to put the weight 1841KGs, I had already found that, having researched at great length, but it was kind of you.

I am fully aware that all the stuff you put in a boat adds to the weight, but I am also aware that the manufacturers weight might bear little resemblance to the empty weight of the boat, also it can vary from boat to boat as well.
I am pretty sure that if I removed every last thing in my Venturer, including the sails it would weigh more than 1275KGs. Did they include the mast, boom, sails or is it just the bare hull ? ??
When I bought it, I changed my car to a 4x4 to be able to tow it as the 1600KGs tow limit of our Volvo 850 T5, whilst apparently on paper OK was too close for comfort. I was somewhat shocked when I put it on the weighbridge, without the outboard or fuel tank and it came up at 2200KGs - the trailer then weighing 500kgs . This is why I asked the question re the Leisure. I think I am quite justified in doing so ?

I like to do things legally and whilst Uk basks in the situation - for a while longer - where you can still get away with towing boats on trailers hopelessly overloaded and not fit for the purpose, I have no intention or option but to do this properly, and more importantly safely.

So, thanks for the answers so far -

 

[Seajet]

AEMD,

well you must admit it was a bit of a long shot, and someone else's L23 might have absorbed more or less water, been better or worse fitted out etc, than the one you fancy.

I was surprised by the weight of your Venturer, a lot heavier than my Anderson 22 and that's not a light boat.

I share your cynicism re brochure weights though; that quoted for the A22 is ' 2,500lbs ' which always struck me as a suspiciously round figure !

 

[Lakesailor]

Lakesailor, that's really helpful ... You despair of what precisely ??? !!!

You have a go at me when I am sympathising with you.

I despair because you asked if anyone had actually weighed a boat and everyone tells you it's design displacement. Like that is an answer to your question.

 

[AEMD]

Yup, I guess I knew that, and now I wish I'd taken details when I saw Leisure 23s for sale in Germany where they put every last figure because like her in France, they have to. In Germany they also have to have a trailer MOT, which hasn't yet hit us over here..

. Anyway Colin Shead has been in touch via the owners association with some useful information, not about the weight, but about things to look out for.

Anderson 22, I agree, a nice boat, I just wish you could stand up in them... I sailed in one on a sunny afternoon many years ago at Rutland, and it seemed huge, but then I owned a Club 16, so it's all relative.

I think when trailer registration and car towing capabilities really become something that is inspected, there will be a lot of people caught out, and, for once, I think this is a good thing. I have seen some true horrors out there, on the roads, and for sale. I would not want to be on the same patch of road when it all goes wrong.

 

[AEMD]

Well, you have to admit your post wasn't all that clear LOL Anyway I can always forge the figures.... oh, what did i just say ?? ;-)

 

[Seajet]

Yup, I guess I knew that, and now I wish I'd taken details when I saw Leisure 23s for sale in Germany where they put every last figure because like her in France, they have to. In Germany they also have to have a trailer MOT, which hasn't yet hit us over here..

. Anyway Colin Shead has been in touch via the owners association with some useful information, not about the weight, but about things to look out for.

Anderson 22, I agree, a nice boat, I just wish you could stand up in them... I sailed in one on a sunny afternoon many years ago at Rutland, and it seemed huge, but then I owned a Club 16, so it's all relative.

I think when trailer registration and car towing capabilities really become something that is inspected, there will be a lot of people caught out, and, for once, I think this is a good thing. I have seen some true horrors out there, on the roads, and for sale. I would not want to be on the same patch of road when it all goes wrong.

Forgive me if you've seen me mention this before, but there is a spot at the end of the M27 at Cadnam where it goes into the New Forest, where the police lie in wait for caravans and anything on a trailer; they openly said a while ago ' boats on trailers have been getting away with it for too long '.

So now these easy targets are picked up and escorted by a posse of expensive police interceptors ( can't be too careful with high risk criminals like these, as the drug runners and ultra violence thugs into Southampton speed by ) to a weighbridge and heaven forfend the crockery being over the limit.

' Detectected crime ' without a chance of any comeback, welcome to UK 's 21st century police.

 

[LittleSister]

I despair because you asked if anyone had actually weighed a boat and everyone tells you it's design displacement. Like that is an answer to your question.

No, not like that is an answer to his question! (Some of us specifically said we weren't answering his question.)

Given the unlikelihood that anyone on the forum had actually weighed a Leisure 23SL, a number of people chipped in with info or advice that might be of some use or interest in the absence of (or in advance of) the answer he ideally wanted. Had they not done so his thread would currently comprise only his original post, and have long disappeared out of sight should someone who had weighed a 23SL happen along.

You seem rather grumpy of late, Lakey. Isn't it about time you got yourself a new boat?:encouragement:

 

[colhel]

When we had our 23SL we had her transported home for the Winter on a flatbead twin axle trailer with no problems. Ours had an inboard and with a mixture of research and guesswork I arrived at a weight of 2.5 tons.

 

[Lakesailor]

When we had our 23SL we had her transported home for the Winter on a flatbead twin axle trailer with no problems. Ours had an inboard and with a mixture of research and guesswork I arrived at a weight of 2.5 tons.

Did you swing by a weighbridge to confirm your suspicions? It only costs about a fiver.

 

[Seajet]

Incidentally, Hayling Trailers have gone bust, which judging by their customer service attitude is not exactly astonishing.

 

[davidpbo]

No, not like that is an answer to his question! (Some of us specifically said we weren't answering his question.)

Given the unlikelihood that anyone on the forum had actually weighed a Leisure 23SL, a number of people chipped in with info or advice that might be of some use or interest in the absence of (or in advance of) the answer he ideally wanted. Had they not done so his thread would currently comprise only his original post, and have long disappeared out of sight should someone who had weighed a 23SL happen along.

People should know what they are towing weighs. If you have a collision insurance is likely to be invalid if trailer is overweight for vehicle (at the least any fully comprehensive element) or load overweight for trailer.

The trailer for my Jeanneau Tonic 23 was plated at 2000kgs, carrying capacity 1800kgs which just so happened to be the displaement weight of the boat. When I put it on a weighbridge it came out as something like 2200kgs I had to change my vehicle and the trailer axles, hitch and tyres were ok. Boat weight was no so far out but trailer weighed about 450kgs instead of the 175kgs quoted. Something that had not changed and that the trailer manufacturer should have got right. It has undoubtably put on weight do to additions and replacements. Nothing ever seems to weigh less than what was taken out.

The Tonic 23 has a fairly large lump of cast iron under it which I believe weighs in the order of 450kgs.

 

[colhel]

Did you swing by a weighbridge to confirm your suspicions? It only costs about a fiver.

No. In my ownership it only made one return trip on a trailer and this was done by a transport company.

 

[AEMD]

Jeanneau Tonic, now I'd like one of those, but by the time you add on a trailer it's beyond my budget. We have one as a neighbour on the mooring, a Beneteau 235 next to it. Both nice boats.

I'm pleased you think the same way as me davidpbo re the legalities of towing - far too many people seem to have the 'it won't happen to me guv' attitude.

LittleSister, it'she not he , it's my boat and my husband and two dogs are crew. LOL

Seajet
I guess Hayling will be like other firms who either couldn't be bothered or couldn't afford to go down the process of type approval for their trailers, I know it is very costly and complicated - we registered our Blue Line trailer here, but it took over 3 years, we had to wait for their Conformity approval to be finalised by the Dutch firm who were dealing with Blue Line before the French would accept it. However, now the whole European market is available to them, whereas before nobody in their right mind would have imported an English trailer - tto much hassle. SBS have done the same, but I think a lot have gone under - Fountain Trailers for one in Boston, who were SO much more helpful than Hayling trailers when I was registering my existing boat trailer. ;-)

 

[LittleSister]

LittleSister, it'she not he , it's my boat and my husband and two dogs are crew. LOL

I do apologise.