Language proficiency

[stranded]

My wife and I decided we would move to France. This autumn we started language classes with Alliance Française. We’re both crap and haven’t a cat in hells chance of reaching the b1 standard which I understand is likely to be required to achieve permanent residency.

I have always decried Brits who move to another country and do not learn the language. Now I am (with great shame) looking at ways to join them - gotta get out of here somehow.

Be interested to know from those who have got some sort of status which allows them to live long term in a country without being proficient in the language how they find the reality.

For example, I can over a few beers in a bar have quite an interesting chat with a French person in Franglais, although it is never clear whether we both thought we were having the same conversation. But bar talk is special - it is all about the connection - the content is pretty immaterial. I cannot imagine then going round to dinner at theirs and developing an actual relationship - my crapness is sufficiently amusing in itself to sustain for a couple of hours, but there is then nowhere to go.

So do those of you who are based overseas all have decent language proficiency. Do you just hang out with anglophones (apologies to the non-Anglophones on here whose English puts many of my compatriots to shame) and get by in your pidgin language when you have to interact with the locals. Has anyone thought like us that they would be unable to learn a language then amazed themselves by actually being in the country.

All sounds very naive but I have always assumed I could learn most things if I put my mind to it, but have discovered that I may just have the wrong kind of mind.

 

[Stingo]

Your SWMBO may not approve of this, would finding yourself a horizontal dictionary with nice boobs help? I've heard that it's normal practice in France.
Worked for me in Brazil many moons ago. Highly recommended tuition....
Do let us know how it works out for you?

 

[stranded]

Ah! So that’s what conjugal relations are for.

 

[capnsensible]

My wife and I decided we would move to France. This autumn we started language classes with Alliance Française. We’re both crap and haven’t a cat in hells chance of reaching the b1 standard which I understand is likely to be required to achieve permanent residency.

I have always decried Brits who move to another country and do not learn the language. Now I am (with great shame) looking at ways to join them - gotta get out of here somehow.

Be interested to know from those who have got some sort of status which allows them to live long term in a country without being proficient in the language how they find the reality.

For example, I can over a few beers in a bar have quite an interesting chat with a French person in Franglais, although it is never clear whether we both thought we were having the same conversation. But bar talk is special - it is all about the connection - the content is pretty immaterial. I cannot imagine then going round to dinner at theirs and developing an actual relationship - my crapness is sufficiently amusing in itself to sustain for a couple of hours, but there is then nowhere to go.

So do those of you who are based overseas all have decent language proficiency. Do you just hang out with anglophones (apologies to the non-Anglophones on here whose English puts many of my compatriots to shame) and get by in your pidgin language when you have to interact with the locals. Has anyone thought like us that they would be unable to learn a language then amazed themselves by actually being in the country.

All sounds very naive but I have always assumed I could learn most things if I put my mind to it, but have discovered that I may just have the wrong kind of mind.

Have you tried the free app Duolingo? Great at giving you basics to get you started chatting to locals. It can get you to B1 if you get stuck in and combine it with their podcasts, listening to local radio and TV. And of course most important, keep on talking to people around you!

 

[Bouba]

Ok...my situation...and every word the truth....we have residency, but it was a grandfathered Brexit one...lots of paperwork but no real problem....the wife is fluent...and not just French....myself is different...I’ve lived in foreign countries most of my life...but have only ever mastered English....and that’s because I’m English. But I have studied French for twenty years...and I cannot hold a conversation, understand the simplest thing...I believe I have no language centre in my brain. But I did pass my B1 ...and am now studying for the B2...I have also done advanced boating exams in French....and the secret ?...study...and I study hard...I treat it like any other subject that I have sat exams for...study and memorize...I may not be good at French...but I am good at exams

 

[stranded]

Have you tried the free app Duolingo? Great at giving you basics to get you started chatting to locals. It can get you to B1 if you get stuck in and combine it with their podcasts, listening to local radio and TV. And of course most important, keep on talking to people around you!

Yes - Duolingo is great and how I tend to learn - lay down a layer - maybe just vocabulary, then superimpose a bit of grammar, rinse, repeat. But the formal route to b1 seems to involve conjugating every verb perfectly, knowing every exception, knowing the social context in which each is applicable, understanding subtle alternatives. I ain’t gonna live long enough…

 

[Bouba]

Yes - Duolingo is great and how I tend to learn - lay down a layer - maybe just vocabulary, then superimpose a bit of grammar, rinse, repeat. But the formal route to b1 seems to involve conjugating every verb perfectly, knowing every exception, knowing the social context in which each is applicable, understanding subtle alternatives. I ain’t gonna live long enough…

You have completely misunderstood the exam....yes, you need all of that if you want 95%...but it’s a pass or fail exam...50% is your goal. The B1 exam is for life...once you pass it can’t be taken from you...and a pass is all you need

 

[stranded]

You have completely misunderstood the exam....yes, you need all of that if you want 95%...but it’s a pass or fail exam...50% is your goal. The B1 exam is for life...once you pass it can’t be taken from you...and a pass is all you need

Thanks Bouba - that is interesting. Does it mean you have to get 50% of the answers 100% correct, or 100% of the answers 50% correct?

 

[Bouba]

Thanks Bouba - that is interesting. Does it mean you have to get 50% of the answers 100% correct, or 100% of the answers 50% correct?

No...the exam is split into 4 parts.....listening, reading, writing, speaking..each part is worth 25 points .....each individual part you must score a minimum of 5 out of 25....but 50 points in total to pass

 

[stranded]

No...the exam is split into 4 parts.....listening, reading, writing, speaking..each part is worth 25 points .....each individual part you must score a minimum of 5 out of 25....but 50 points in total to pass

OK - and I know I am being dim, but this is the crux of it - in the writing test, do the answers to garner me the 5 points have to be perfect - so does “me Tarzan, you Jane” get me a point for point made, or nul points for vandalising the language?

 

[Bouba]

For me the hardest is the listening....but nowadays the answers are all multi choice....so you always have a chance of getting it right

 

[Bouba]

OK - and I know I am being dim, but this is the crux of it - in the writing test, do the answers to garner me the 5 points have to be perfect - so does “me Tarzan, you Jane” get me a point for point made, or nul points for vandalising the language?

First rule....French hand writing is incomprehensible...so make sure you follow that rule.....it can be simple as you like...the more fluent the higher the score....memorise stock phrases....most importantly, know who you are writing to...never make the mistake of talking informally to your boss...it’s tu and vous...but I bet you know this already....

 

[Poignard]

My local library (in the UK) offers free online language training with a scheme called Transparent Language.

If the OP is registered with a UK library, he may find they offer it.

Learn a Language Online - Transparent Language Online

 

[Bouba]

Listen to the following podcast without subtitles

Try to get as much information out of the podcast as you can but don’t stop it to look things up

Then go on to his website
Innerfrench.com
Join up, it’s free…download the transcript
Next (after a little brain rest)..,,listen to the podcast again, while reading the French transcript silently at the same time.
Rest some more…then read the transcript aloud without the podcast…each time you should gather more information, more meaning and the reading aloud will exercise your lips…believe me French is hard work on the lips.
Then the following day do his next podcast (he has well over a hundred)
If you get into his study rythme, then check his videos and even his online courses
There are others just like him…all aiming for the B1 exam

 

[colind3782]

Having used Duolingo for some years, I recently signed up to Babbel and I have learned far more that I ever did with Duolingo. Not free though...

Not relevant to the OP but Duolingo Spanish is Latin American Spanish.

 

[IanCC]

Regardless of B1 or whatever. I ended up living in France for a few years. Spoken French is basically easy. Forget the plurals, then for any tense and verb all the singulars sound the same. Use On for we. Learn the irregulars. Re: listening, the pulse beat of French is slower than English, your ear will dial in at some point. Don't get wound up by too many complex tenses, french is not so tense specific as english. Present, perfect and imperfect will get you a long long way. Learn lots of vocab. Work really hard at it for 3 months and you might suprise yourself.

 

[ashtead]

How’s your Subjunctive knowledge going? Always found that tricky to learn

 

[Fr J Hackett]

I suspect the OPs teacher is being to "formal" which was typical of foreign language teaching in the UK. Bouba has it correct the B1 is not hard at all. The most difficult thing is the listening and understanding what is being said but at B1 level the language and situations are very simple and clear quite unlike real life. It is important to be able to conjugate a reasonable number of verbs but again for B1 you can forget about the more complex tenses like the subjunctive, if you can use it for a few practiced phrases then great but don't worry about it. Practice conjugating the common ER verbs and faire then try to expand with some irregular, ir and re verbs. It is just a case of working at it. With B1 you will have just enough to get you about but you will be constantly asking people to repeat things which isn't really a problem.
For what it's worth my language skills were always poor but I mastered basic French a long time ago and when I moved here permanently I brushed up and took a few lessons at a French University language school designed to get foreign students to a level that they can live and attend a university, ( they were mainly Chinese so if they can do it you can)

 

[westernman]

Watch the news programs on TV. They repeat the same stuff throughout the day. Listening to the same thing several times spoken by different people will help you get used to listening and understanding.

Nothing beats practice.

Watch movies on Netflix or whatever, in French. With subtitles. Initially subtitles in English and later subtitles in French. And then without the subtitles.

Vocabulary is king. Forget learning grammar, it will come naturally after a while.

I went to Germany to work at a large very German company. I did not speak a word of German when I started. In my group at work they were no other foreigners apart from one Austrian. The company paid for a one hour lesson twice a week. To help me fit in, my boss paired me with another guy who was supposed to help me with everything. He picked the guy in the group with the worst English by far. After only a couple of weeks, it became easier for me to speak extremely hacked German to him and let him do the work of trying to work out what I was talking about rather than me trying to explain something to him in English.

In just a few months I became reasonably fluent and could handle most situations with no trouble.

My experience with French has been similar, but I had a head start with some schoolboy French and now for a long time I live with my French partner. We speak exclusively French at home although my partner has very good English skills.

 

[Bouba]

You could do it Fr Hackett’s way which is on the pillow…it means ditching your wife for a French one…it only gets confusing if you want to be a polyglot