Knowing nothing to solo sailing ?

[lpdsn]

Good points above.

That course is £10,000! Is that how much it costs to become a commercially qualified yachtmaster?

If you want to do it in a few months it ain't cheap. Ring around though, there are several Solent sailing schools doing similar so you should be able to get a bit cheaper. If they still exist UKSA, BOSS & Hamble School of Yachting used to do them.

You can do the individual courses and exams for a lot less, but you'll need to pick up experience between them.

Really don't under-estimate the theory. It's easy for experienced sailors to be dismissive of how much they've learnt. I've been trying to teach just tides to an enthusiastic crew member who wants to go straight to YM theory. It's taken several sessions just introducing new concepts one by one and doing a few exercises.

And by the time you're really experienced the theory will be just a few percent of what you've learnt. Even passing YM Offshore is only a step on the way.

I've learnt a huge amount racing, but you have to get on a good boat, and even then it won't teach you everything. Mix and match a bit.

 

[FlyingGoose]

Good points above.

That course is £10,000! Is that how much it costs to become a commercially qualified yachtmaster?

Nice Brochure for you to read, and do not be pulled back by those saying about your age experience, I have changed jobs and careers 4 times , went back to University as a mature Student and got my boat with little experience and learned through going out there , reading , doing therory work and getting wet . no one died , never got rescued , not got into trouble , common sense and grit will see you through
https://www.hamble.co.uk/content/S635838911857223050/PST Email Brochure.pdf

There is the Scottish national centre , good sailing grounds and great place to stay
https://www.nationalcentrecumbrae.org.uk/courses/professional-yachtmaster

£10000 is a lot of money , but you pay £25000 fort a uni course. get a loan or borrow , if its really what you want to do
If there is a will there is a way :encouragement:

 

[[3889]]

Good points above.

That course is £10,000! Is that how much it costs to become a commercially qualified yachtmaster?

No, the commercial endorsement costs more with Sea Survival, PPR and medical on top, after which you will be, at best, a very mediocre yacht skipper. Racking up most of your 2500 miles sailing to the Canaries and back whilst playing at being skipper for a day or two (with an instructor on hand when it all goes pyriform) is pretty worthless. Zero to hero is a good way to get the certificate to satisfy the requirements for super yacht employment but don't think for one minute that the course will make you comfortable skippering a 35 foot yacht into a foreign harbour in the dark with 30 knots of wind and crew of limited ability. It most definitely won't.

 

[Kukri]

I agree with that. I have a friend who was working as a stewardess on superyachts and who put herself through the lot - zero
to hero (in the Channel in the middle of winter!) and commercial endorsements at Warsash and she now has the lot and is a senior deck hand on one of the top superyachts. Her idea of fun is to run half marathons and ... to go sailing.

 

[Uricanejack]

The OP is not looking for super yacht work. He is interested in sailing possibly commercially. I get the impression from the forums. While there are still some people pursuing a YM for the personal interest and achievement. The majority are pursuing the YM for commercial use.

The cost of a Zero To Hero appears to be staggering. Plus you got to consider the time involved. 6 or possibly more months not working. Comparing it to university is not realistic. The return from a university education is likley to be significantly better.
Although for the life of me I can’t figure out what the heck my son will do with his. I just know it cost me a bundle.

The unfortunate school with the intern program is out of business. Although the intern idea may still exist in other places.
If it does it might be worth while.

Many years ago I learned to sail with the OYC. I had a tour of one off thier boats at the Scottish boat show a while ago. I met a couple of young lads working on thier RYA courses.

Perhaps it’s worth while starting a thread about the difrent course opertunies and how they work out as far as looking for work commercially.

 

[awol]

Beware of the odd pitfall if your aim is to reach commercially endorsed YM. Is your eyesight good enough for the medical? If you are mile building on your own boat there is a minimum size for the voyages to count. I'm sure there are more that are not obvious when you start.

 

[lw395]

No, the commercial endorsement costs more with Sea Survival, PPR and medical on top, after which you will be, at best, a very mediocre yacht skipper. Racking up most of your 2500 miles sailing to the Canaries and back whilst playing at being skipper for a day or two (with an instructor on hand when it all goes pyriform) is pretty worthless. Zero to hero is a good way to get the certificate to satisfy the requirements for super yacht employment but don't think for one minute that the course will make you comfortable skippering a 35 foot yacht into a foreign harbour in the dark with 30 knots of wind and crew of limited ability. It most definitely won't.

A zero-to-hero course might get you a deckhand job on a rich man's yacht. From there you learn to be a skipper by putting the years in. Some people love it. If I had no ties or responsibility I could see the attraction. The people who hire ZTH's are not fools, they know the game, the system mostly works.

 

[prv]

No, the commercial endorsement costs more with Sea Survival, PPR and medical on top

Commercial endorsement per se isn't a big deal or ruinously expensive. The underlying qualification that's being endorsed could be, depending on what it is. But I commercially endorsed my dinky little PB2 in case I need to move a small workboat around a harbour (before I did so there were a couple of times at work when it would have been really handy; ironically this hasn't yet happened since!).

Agree with you about what fast track courses do and don't do - I imagine it also depends a lot on the person taking them.

Pete

 

[Uricanejack]

Now that I have completely drifted the thread.

My query is not is zero to hero any good as a skipper. Rather is it actually worth while going to the trouble and expense.
Will it get you to where you want to be. A job as a commercial sailor.
Does it work better than doing it bit by bit? If you want to work commercially.

Of course there are diffrent levels of commercial.
Paid Delivery?
Running a typical crewed charter boat in a popular sailing holiday spot?
Instructing?
Or working on supper yachts? I left it. Dinner cruises are popular here.
Should have been super yachts?
Or small tour boat or passenger vessel?

 

[lpdsn]

If you are mile building on your own boat there is a minimum size for the voyages to count.

Although as the YM Offshore is as much as anything about managing crew I never really understood the righteous indignation over that one. You can't really gain that much crew management experience sailing alone on a 7m boat.

 

[lpdsn]

Does it work better than doing it bit by bit? If you want to work commercially.

I guess it saves time more than anything. Doing a Zero to Hero course maybe takes 6 months. Learning it the hard way, maybe 5 or 6 years. It's a big head start to give your rivals if you want to be a super-yacht captain. And the salaries, perks, bonuses are pretty good once you make it - better than most commercial masters.

 

[weustace]

Although as the YM Offshore is as much as anything about managing crew I never really understood the righteous indignation over that one. You can't really gain that much crew management experience sailing alone on a 7m boat.

Hmm... I will try not to rise to this too much, but I can't resist pointing out my 800nm or so on a 7.2m yacht last summer with one and two crew for various bits vs a distant family friend's cruises in the Med on his 65'er, with him and his non-sailing wife alone... not sure either is more or less admissible, but both have their challenges. I think the indignation is more at the assumption that "anything under 25' isn't a yacht", which I have genuinely heard as a description. [steels self and avoids further argument]

Regards
William

 

[Dutch01527]

If you have plenty of time available, the best way to gain real experience would be to find a different boat to crew on.

Maybe a retired solo sailor who has a decent boat and decades of experience but is struggling a bit as the years advance. There are many such people who would enjoy passing on skills and need the help/company at every yacht club. Two days a week would deliver much more than a shared boat course on a training boat, in my opinion.

A summer of that alongside Day Skipper theory study, possibly online if that suits you, would mean that a Liverpool to Ireland trip was viable maybe as soon as the end of this summer.

Most shouty types in my experience are less experienced people who are a bit unsure of themselves and are not the best teachers (or sailors).

 

[langstonelayabout]

The little that I've picked up over the last few years plus my knowledge:

1 - If you want to learn to sail properly, learn in a dinghy. The RYA syllabus is good. Do the racing courses as well and then go racing in dinghies and cruisers. Make sure you aren’t related to your instructor.
2 - Then move up to a bigger boat. This could be a good time to do a zero to hero course. If the course is GBP 10k it sounds like a good deal for what you get.
3 - Yes, concentrate on the theory as it's dead boring but is a big part of what gets your the qualifications.
4 - Remember, the commercial endorsements, STCW stuff are on top. All depending on you paying professional prices for a professional certificate/service.
5 - When you start delivering or skippering yachts, remember insure yourself. Again, this isn’t for free and will be out of your own pocket.
6 - Your good health and eyesight are all required to support these from the word go. If you aren't a 'robust' person or are often off work to visit your doctor this might not be the career for you.

I sail with my wife on board at nights because I’ve seen plenty of marks with their flashing brown/blueish lights. I have no hope of ever getting a commercial endorsement because of something as simple as bad colour vision.

 

[Tomahawk]

Thinking about your "desire" to become a semi professional yatchsman ...
How do your you think you will enjoy life at 03:00 hours when you are seasick, cold, wet through and have just been woken up to go on watch in a gail of rain? We have all done it at sometime.. Even the sunny Med can be very nasty.

I suggest you do some serious offshore racing on a small and not overly luxurious boat. A few long races will tell you if your dream of sailing is matched by reality when it gets unpleasant... which it always does at some time. You will learn a lot about yourself which will inform your next decision. Most racing skippers ar always wanting crew ... try sites like crewfinder?

 

[lpdsn]

Hmm... I will try not to rise to this too much, but I can't resist pointing out my 800nm or so on a 7.2m yacht last summer with one and two crew for various bits vs a distant family friend's cruises in the Med on his 65'er, with him and his non-sailing wife alone... not sure either is more or less admissible, but both have their challenges. I think the indignation is more at the assumption that "anything under 25' isn't a yacht", which I have genuinely heard as a description. [steels self and avoids further argument]

Regards
William

I'm not in the least denying that sailing a 7m can't be challenging, or indeed that people get indignant about the RYA restriction. However the YM scheme has its roots in a UK scheme to get at least partially trained recruits into the RNVR in WWII and the early Cold War. Maybe for a while after the RYA took it over it was focused on the private yachtsman, but it has been driven by the superyacht industry for a couple of decades at least now. Neither the RN, despite the cutbacks, nor the superyacht industry are really interested in 7m vessels. A 25 footer may be a yacht but even the tabloid press rarely call it a superyacht. I don't know what it was like when you sat your YM Offshore exam, but when I sat mine in 2006 there was a definite focus on crew management.

 

[ross84]

Interesting reading. Thanks all.

Note: miles clocked in a 26ft yacht don't count towards seatime for RYA qualifications?

 

[lpdsn]

Interesting reading. Thanks all.

Note: miles clocked in a 26ft yacht don't count towards seatime for RYA qualifications?

I think 26' is OK. The RYA rule used to be 7m but the tweaked it a bit after there was a bit of a debate whether a bowsprit counted. You could phone them to confirm the boat you have in mind.

 

[Mark-1]

The RYA rule used to be 7m but the tweaked it a bit after there was a bit of a debate whether a bowsprit counted.

I though it was was still 7m LOA. The definition of LOA always seems to be different in different contexts to me but I thought and a Bowsprint/Overhanging Anchor/Raised Outboard/Transom Hung Rudder did count in terms of qualifying length? Just out of interest are the length rules documented anywhere - my google-fu is weak and I can't find the detail to confirm/debunk my memory.

 

[awol]

According to the RYA website the minimum length for YM qualifying passages is 7m (23') LWL. When it comes to the exam the RYA reserve the right to declare a boat unsuitable despite its length - try searching for Black Pig's posts on his difficulties. The problem he encountered was no examiner wanted to take his exam - thus the RYA caveat was created.