Italian modern wooden classic

[wakeup]

Re: Why hardly anyone buy a catamaran

"and i am only chartering
so i like them
would i buy one
no"

Is that because you think that cats don't perform as well as healy over thingys or are you worried what other salty dogs my think of you if you had a cat??


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[Twister_Ken]

Re: Why hardly anyone buy a catamaran

Two anti cat reasons

In many places they cost a packet to park (esp the biggies)

If they fall over, they can't get up again. Well, not without the sort of engineering that comes hard when you're sitting on the bottom of the hull with nothing in your pocket but a sailing knife.

<hr width=100% size=1><A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.writeforweb.com/twister1>Let's Twist Again</A>

 

[sailbadthesinner]

Re: Why hardly anyone buy a catamaran

nope the bigones are too big for just me swmbo to handle alone
and the small ones i don't like that much
so we would have small mono cos they are not as big and heavy to hold off pontoons etc.
also you need lots of space to anchor cos they sail around
and the marinas charge ven more for a cat when you go in

<hr width=100% size=1><font color=red>if guinness is good for you. i must be very very good</font color=red>

 

[tcm]

Re: lonely sailing?

Well, I spose the thread wasn't talking about the aims of those would be happier with an empty pontoon. We were bemoaning lack of attraction of the sport to others, and esp out nearest and dearest. And perhaps identifying ways of making sailing more encompassing, rather than less, more inclusive, not exclusive, more sociable rather than purposefully antisocial. Cos our wives are lovely and attractive, and not something to escape. And altho they would come camping - they wouldn't come camping every other weekend. And that's the problem with sailing boats. All boats look great brand new. But most new sailboats are a bit nasty after the first few weekends. A house is a much nicer place to be at the weekend. Especially if the nerk husband who is suggesting that she comes on a frigging camping trip is out of the way, eh?

And another thing - you have a speed indicator/log on your boat. Doncha? Does it read to 2 decimal places? I bet it does. Now, what about your lawnmower, or your shoes, your desk, mobile phone, hammock, easy chair, telly, washing machine? No speed/efficiency indicators there eh? Course not. So, please lets stop this garbage about sailing being entirely about tranquil escapism. Sure it's often very peaceful and relaxing. But no other hobby invites you to spend an entire day making something go just 0.5 knots faster, delay or deviate a trip by hours to win a few tidal knots. The guys who drive motorboats as fast as possible in the most direct route as possible - are often raggies!

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[wakeup]

Re: Why hardly anyone buy a catamaran

But how often do they really fall over, is this an urban myth that they fall over a lot or is there some truth in this, if so how do they get insurance?

<hr width=100% size=1><P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1>Edited by wakeup on 26/06/2003 15:50 (server time).</FONT></P>

 

[tcm]

Re: okay then, wine spilling

true. But being caught out in a big sea ain't summinkthat happens in 3 seconds like an airyplane, one minute its a footmassage with michelin nosh next minute it's argh dropping from 40,000 feet. So it could be at least as nice as inside an aeroplane.

Sailing boats know very well, with loads of notice, when they are "at sea" and when "in harbour". Not many tsunamis hit the hamble on a sunny afternnon. And it takes an hour or more to get out of the solent.

So, they could easily have nice comfy putawayable (?) things. Not sure if any sailyboats are comfy first and sailboats second. They might be "big" first, if that's what you mean by "accomodation". And of course, if you are saily, then that's what "what's the accomodation like" means? It means "does it have two aft cabins". It doesn't mean it has leather anything which looks good new and ages nicely, or well-appointed cabins with all the lights turnoffable from in bed from either side, and space for books right there, etc etc etc....

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[tcm]

Re: Perinis

Now you're talking! Cor. Any Perini will be tip top and fine. Well, there was a 23 metre one which unfortunately was a bit weird down below with green lacquer but probly okay at the time (late 80's) but now they are blue with more sensible non-weirdy-italian design. Also, it had no space for lolling about up top, and had spent so much time getting the wide open deck spaces that erm the seats were not long enough to have a kip, bit stupid.

Atmosphere, that mite have been it? Or Salperton? Both around the riviera, salperton will be at monaco show, Atmosphere is in Port de Cannes near the ferry (cheap gits).

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[ccscott49]

Re: Perinis

This one was called Paz, I think it was an early one of the new type/style she had a fair amount of varnish (not too much) and they were redoing some of the interior doors, which were varnished wood, with rattan? centres, looked great, she had oodles of lounging about room on deck and all hydraulic furling etc, hidden winches, all electrickery, absolutely stunning, I had fag ends stuck to my tongue from drooling everytime I went to the office for my mail!

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[tcm]

Re: sailyboots

yes, i agree sailyboats all luverly for freeish longdistance travel. Hence my keeness to see them being made all swish inside. And no, those Oysters are NOT swish inside. It's a bit manky, and for the money it is very very manky, and i would need to take her camping a lot, and never stay in an hotel (except in East Anglia where they think wearing clothes is a bit posh) before she came round to thinkig that the galley or heads are swish in an Oyster.

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[tcm]

Ace boat, Powergenish website

<A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.perininavi.it>http://www.perininavi.it</A>

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[sailbadthesinner]

Re: okay then, wine spilling

indeed
luxury and sailing donot go hand in hand
in fact on some boats they aint even in the same neighbourhood. (twsiter anyone?)
donot know why
i am sure if someone started building boats that had cockpits that were not like sitting on the floor they would sell buckets and soon everyone would copy.
ditto crappy lights.


why does a generator have to be extra or nice heating system
went in scotland in march
nice during day but at night was eoken by steady drip of my own breath from ceiling and we all developed coughs that made us sound like the napoleons troops retreating from moscow.


i think main prob is that the saily boat market is the charter boys. if you want to sell volume you have to design to their spec. so what we should all do is right to sunsail asking for a nice boat with cusions and proper glasses. and a bigger fridge and a generator etc.......
THEN we would see a change

<hr width=100% size=1><font color=red>if guinness is good for you. i must be very very good</font color=red>

 

[tcm]

Re: The Customer Is A Sheep

Designwise, anyway. Look at anything, and it wass designed first, then brought to market with a bit of hope. Hardly ever were new things "invented" by demand from customers. Customers wanted very fast horses that ate less hay. They din't think of cars.

So, it's down to designers. And so far this century, the yottie designers have come up with what? A fenderstep. I am sure swmbo will be pestering me to get a sailboat as a result, not.

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[qsiv]

Re: Perinis

But how often do you see them sailing (as opposed to M/S or plain motoring?). There were two in the Solent a couple of years back (for the AmCup Jubilee) and I never once saw them hoist (or unfurl) a sail - even when leaving to go back to the Med.

IAE - they arent really achievable for many people - and as for the maintenance for the all push button sailing (and other) systems - dread to think!


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[sailbadthesinner]

Re: what about design brief

customer
i want a fast horse that eats less hay

designer
have this car

customer
you went outside the brief

designer
but this is better and your brief was not specific

customer
for you maybe. it looks costly

designer
in the long run it will save money

customer
can i have a boat that is lovely to sail, luxurious and reliable

designer
have this big white plastic boat

customer
this is not what i wanted

designer
look it has a fenderstep

customer
oooooooooooooooooh i 'll take it.




<hr width=100% size=1><font color=red>if guinness is good for you. i must be very very good</font color=red>

 

[david_e]

Re: The Customer Is A Sheep

Surely at Moody/Oyster/Swan type dosh levels you can specify what you want in a boat with a rag and sticks or can't you? What about Farr, are they any good or is the current concept so far removed that they are all light years away?


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[sailbadthesinner]

Re: sailyboots

hmmm
yes i rather got that impression
well you need to get into the boat business
or commission a one off
either way requires considerable money

<hr width=100% size=1><font color=red>if guinness is good for you. i must be very very good</font color=red>

 

[Tiger Rag]

Re: Distancia 60

Have just got back to the office and so am joining in a bit late, but if you are looking for something to bridge the gap between power and sail and not just a little innovation, check out the Distancia 60. I saw her in the flesh not long ago and was mightily impressed.

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[Twister_Ken]

Cat with legs in air

Yachting World has a nice picture of our Ellen sitting on the bottom of upturned tri. Same edition has a picture of RNLI guys trying to get a tow onto an upturned cat - in the Solent. It happens. Not a daily occurence, but something to consider.

<hr width=100% size=1><A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.writeforweb.com/twister1>Let's Twist Again</A>

 

[tcm]

Re: Distancia 60

Agreed. They have a good website too. How much are they Russel and can we have a bit of a discount, please. It can't be squillions for a 60 footer can it?

Not clear on the site if they have made one or several?

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[tcm]

Re: The Customer Is A Sheep

It's not encouraging. Customer specifying should go as far as choosing from a range of "done that" options, not blazing a trail for the builder. So, despite however many trinkets you choose for a house or a car, the essential build quality etc is predetermined, and not by the customer. In visiting the theatre, you should be able to choose which day you go and which play you see. You shouldn't need to prompt them with their lines, or at the interval ask if perhaps the actors could perhaps try a little harder to be, you know, a little bit less rubbish. A supplier has to "get it" first. They lead the way, really, but it's fashionable to pretend otherwise.

I'm not talking about radical huge changes - but they may well seem like that to a customer who can't tell from inside a boat whether it's a jeanneau, bavaria, or anything else. Lots of swmbos can't. Yonks ago i got a new company Sierra and told a mates swmbo that it was a Jaguar, and she thought it was quite decent. Badges are not too important, and much less so in boats, I think.

I think I'm talking about the same sort of radicalism as erm (heck another car analogy) the Ford Cortina 1600E caused way back in the sixties. The first ordinary size car (in the uk, anyway) to step up from being "economical" or "reliable" to being all of that as well as more luxurious, a nice place to be, just for the sake of it. Which was at the time, quite a radical move for Ford, and very popular too, I think.