Ignorant yachties

[Guest]

I attended a corporate event just recently, on board a Princess 460. Got talking to the owner, a very nice man; we spent some time talking pros and cons in a very constructive way. I did not agree with everything that was said and I am sure he did not agree with everything that I said.

The one argument he did put forward though was that yachts should display an inverted cone when motorsailing, I believe him when he told me that he would change his course, being the give way vessel only then to see water streaming from the exhaust of the 'stand on vessel', with no thanks!

Motorsailing without an inverted cone is now almost standard (bad) practice, more and more boats I see leaving Chichester Harbour, even with both main and foresail set, plus engine, skippered by people who should know better.

Sunday lunch time I was sailing back to Emsworth past East Head, despite the normal mayhem that exists there I insisted my (nervous) crew should helm, for experience. I then noticed a heavy 'classic GRP' yacht on my port quarter under full sail, windward side. I noticed he was catching me up, not giving us much room. In the 12 knts of wind his speed was a bit of a suprise. Despite the fact that he was overtaking and on the windward side I choose to exercise rule 2, which involved me gybing. After pulling over for him, I may as well have been invisible, no thanks, no recognition. The ignorant helmsman 'looked' like he should know beter. I then looked in disbelief to see water and steam coming from the exhaust!!!

If we, as yachties expect respect and courtousy from each other and from power boat owners then we should exercise the same discipline ourselves, showing a good axample of to those new to the sport. A classic boat and a bretton cap does not make you a better person than the power boat owner. It is ones respect for the sea, the Col regs and other sea goers.

My host was right there are some very ignorant yachties out there.


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[max_power]

Anchor balls seem to have gone out of fashion these days but motorsailing cones never did seem to get off the ground from the start.

In my view the humble bucket hung upside down on the Ensign flagstaff is a much better idea.
Blue Ensign flyers would of course have to use something a bit better and the Classic boat set a proper 'clang' metal 50's galvanised job.

On the subject of classic type boatowners. Yes they are a bastard format of a sailor. "Because we have more string, they we must be king"

On the East Coast there are many, the worst ones being smacks. Although they have engines , they insist on sailing into harbours like Brightlingsea. This is ok, but they disregard all the colregs on the basis of ' look at me I'am sailing a boat that used not to have an engine ! So just to prove that I'am very clever I am going to sail in. The worst one I came across the other year was the Lily May out of Bradwell Marina. Narrow channel, half tide running in with an enormous boom extended nearly across the channel. All with a stupid smirk on their faces.
The rest of us, coming the other way were trying not to run aground. I howled with laughter though the other day though because one of them fell into the water when tying up in the marina recently. Tee Hee - that candle wax I put down really did do the job.

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[l'escargot]

Whilst not condoning motorsailing without a cone, it would be appreciated if more motorboats were aware of the effect of their wash on yachts whether under sail or not, and particularly when at the mast putting the sail up or down. I might of had a word or two in the shell-like of the two Fairline skippers racing off of Egypt point last evening, when one passed either side of me about 100 yds apart. They seemed to do it deliberately as they then headed back out again towards Portsmouth.

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[Neraida]

Well said. Arrogance and ignorance are not unique to classic yachties, it is like driving. Some people swear that volvo's/bmw's/mercedes/any kind of car they cant afford usually are driven by pillocks. Same old same old. If everybody obeyed the rules of the road to the letter (land and sea), we would all be very happy. (and swiss!!)

And if the bloke who......
nearly ran me down in the maintained depth at the entrance to soton water on saturday 1700hrs ish, by not maintaining a good and proper lookout, motorsailing without a cone, being the overtaking vessel etc etc etc etc.....
is reading this...... an apology is all i wanted!


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[jimi]

I must have passed you round about then, as I was beating down Soton water round about then .. what were you in?

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[Neraida]

First Class 8, white, Our name is on our quarters in red, and we have navy blue tops and feet to our sails. Anyone wanna give us a shout, we listen on 16 and 6. No MMSI yet, i haven't fitted it!!
We are normally tearing around Soton water most evenings, on our ear'ole, showing our dirty bum to the world!!

 

[alant]

Entering Cowes on Saturday lunchtime, motoring sails down, was forced to give way to another yacht motorsailing without cone who continued across my port bow heading west. No sign of any adherance to Coll Regs. Its not only powerboaters who are guilty.

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[duncan]

yacht motorsailing, with or without cone - that would be a powerboater wouldn't it?
/forums/images/icons/smile.gif - in the spirit of this thread

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[Neraida]

I just call it "cheating"... (not counting manouvering in restricted waters, beating tides etc etc etc ....before i get in trouble)

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[Gunfleet]

There's load of water in Bradwell creek you just need to know where it is. That's why the pilot book says 'local knowledge'.

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[wooslehunter]

As a raggie (my boat) and a stinky (not my boat) I see both sides in the Solent area.

True, most people who motor-sail don't show a cone. Having said that if there's a sail up you often can't see the cone from certain angles anyway.

As long as we all give plenty of room there should be few problems. Of more importance in my opinion is the ability to manouvre. In very crowded channels like Chichester Harbour refered to above, on a summer Sunday, most boats have a limited ability to manouvre: there are lots of other boats around, lots of waves and little speed to play with.

I've often been on the approach but outside the spead limit area, at my sedate 5kts, only to look behind and find a 40ft+ motor cruiser at 20+ kts heading straight at my stern. It would only take one of many distractions or problems to cause a very bad collision.

On balance a motor vessel at high spead will cause far more problems to a yacht than a yacht can cause to a motor vessel even if the yacht is officially a motor vessel itself i.e. motoring.

Give some room when you can guys - that would remove most of the moans.



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[MADFISH]

This incident happened to me on Satarday at about 1300 off Newtown creek whilst (obviously) motorsailing to Yarmouth. I was not flying a cone (know the score and have one and a ball and do use both and should have known better).

A 28ftish sportscruiser was approaching us on a reciprical course at a speed of 30 knots+. my speed was 4.5knots. He appeared to be clearing me down my port side. as he closed on me the clearance he was due to have was getting less and less until it was head on. I was awstruck by this and was just about to give it a tiller full of starboard when he flashed down my port side waving his fist!

Now there was clear water all around me for a few hundred yards. he was hand steering. He appeared to be playing chicken with me which discoraged me from altering course to starboard in case he was a complete jerk and we both went the same way. Had I have altered course to port to avert collision we would have collided with deverstating consiquences.

Was he teaching me a lesson as I was too lethargic to put my cone up (as I knew I should) or just being a D***head?

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[ericw]

Long may the smacks reign supreme !!

Don't own one ..... yet, but not all the skippers are bad boys !

Tongue-in-cheek regards,

E.

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[max_power]

I love them really Eric......

Got a line of Classic Boat 4 foot wide in the bookcase.

The skippers do need a thump now and then though.

It was only when I had Colin of Telegraph/Maldon fame in a headlock that he managed to blurt out that he aint got an engine !


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[max_power]

I found out where the water is the other week.

Threw some rubber ducks out ahead of me and followed the one that went the fastest !

Old East Coast trick you know !



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[max_power]

Can understand the frustration but I suppose it's the price we have to pay for the freedom of mandatory certification. It's when somebody gets hurt that things are nasty.

I meet many occasional motorboaters on a slipway where I keep my yacht. All seem very pleasant. They seem to equate driving a motorboat like a car. Driving close to a slow yacht is like going past a cyclist. Making wash is a fact of life that is similar to driving through a puddle and soaking a pedestrian . Things that we do when driving a car. MOst have never been in a sailing boat.

I still believe that any craft capable of doing 10 knots and over should have certification . Better for all parties.


Anyway, life's great at the moment - sailing season, good weather . There's tons more good than bad.


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[townquay]

I still remember an aged craggy-faced instructor defining the meaning of an upside down cone as " A foreign registered vessel motor-sailing"

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[duncan]

simply a dickhead I fear

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[Guest]

Interesting comments from you all.

I would like to know if the percetage of 'newcomers' (I'm not saying newcomers are to blame) is similar to the percentage of people enroling and completing RYA courses.

WE ALL nead to become more tolerent, whilst working hard to improve our own seamanship, to raise the overall standard. There will of course be those who 'never get the message'

Al the sister journals to which we subscribe (or borrow) would do well to consider running concurrently a couple of articles promoting in a big way:

a. Basic Col regs
b. Sea sense (safety)
c. What not to do (opposite of a.)
d. How to treat and respond to other sea users.

Looking at the postings of the last 48 hours this cannot come soon enough, the alternative will be mandatory tests and licences. Either that or complete meltdown making sailing (and motorboating) a macho scrum, with nothing to do with enjoyment.

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[bedouin]

as you say, I think what the postings of the last 48 hours have shown is that there are many contributors to this board who need to be a good deal more tolerant.

I don't know whether that is really the way they feel, or whether posting to this board brings out the worst in people, but the number of threads that stress words like "ignorant", "moron" and the like does no credit to the contributors.

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