Huge spark at alternator positive terminal

[greeny]

I'm beginning to think this post is a "wind up".

 

[Sandy]

Well Balmar technical support and their web site says it has an internal regulator.

I use my multimeter daily on the boat but I'm not touching that positive terminal with a metal rod from a multimeter after seeing the marks it left on my adjustable wrench

I am more than happy to attend your boat, all expenses paid at my normal charge out rate, to demonstrate how to use a multi-meter.

 

[Rhylsailer99]

I turned off both battery switches before I did anything.

I'm pretty sure I didn't touch the engine or anything else with the adjustable wrench. The negative terminal is far away, so I definitely didn't touch that. It happens every time, not just once.

Alternator is wired direct to the +on the battery, and the Earth is never switched off.

 

[sailboatliving]

You joined the "field" (blue) wire and the "stator" (white) wire together and connect both to the positive output terminal ? Why on earth did you do that? It is NOT what is shown in the diagram!

You appear to have no understanding of what you are doing. Please stop messing with it before you do irreparable damage or worse.

That is the way it looks to me. The white disappear in the diagram after the bundle part. Which wire should be connected to the positive then, field or stator?

 

[PaulRainbow]

I was able to make the pictures small enough now.

The second positive cable is not visible on the picture.

I also tried to connect the stator and field into one cable with a butt crimp and then I installed it on the positive terminal as shown in the picture. It didn't not go well. The cable starter smoking as soon as I started the engine.

If you want t change from the external regulator to the internal regulator you leave all the wring as it is, with one exception, you disconnect the external regulator excite wire and connect the internal regulator excite wire. It's all in the instruction manual.

It's on page 9 of the manual, where you got the image you posted, you need to read the text as well as look at the picture.

https://balmar.net/wp-content/uploads/2019/01/SUP-0207-2010-2018.pdf

Unfortunately, there is no knowing what damage you have done by messing around with the wiring as you have.

If you want to run the engine with no alternator charging just leave both excite wires disconnected, simple.

 

[PaulRainbow]

That is the way it looks to me. The white disappear in the diagram after the bundle part. Which wire should be connected to the positive then, field or stator?

Neither, stop randomly joining wires together, see post #25

 

[sailboatliving]

If you want t change from the external regulator to the internal regulator you leave all the wring as it is, with one exception, you disconnect the external regulator excite wire and connect the internal regulator excite wire. It's all in the instruction manual.

It's on page 9 of the manual, where you got the image you posted, you need to read the text as well as look at the picture.

https://balmar.net/wp-content/uploads/2019/01/SUP-0207-2010-2018.pdf

Unfortunately, there is no knowing what damage you have done by messing around with the wiring as you have.

If you want to run the engine with no alternator charging just leave both excite wires disconnected, simple.

That what I did at first, but the alternator was not charging the batteries.

 

[PaulRainbow]

That what I did at first, but the alternator was not charging the batteries.

In that case, disconnect the two excite wires so there is no alternator charging. No need to do any more to stop it charging completely.

 

[chriscallender]

That is the way it looks to me. The white disappear in the diagram after the bundle part. Which wire should be connected to the positive then, field or stator?

The thing at the bottom left of the diagram says "regulator wiring harness", it isn't meant to represent a bundle but connections through a harness to the external regulator. To be fair, I don't think they have done the drawing in a very clear way, I can see how it looks that way at a quick glance. As said in the previous post, all that needs to happen to get it to use the internal regulator is that "internal regulator excite" needs to be powered and "external regulator excite" needs to be unpowered. As the note says, is very important that they are not both powered simultaneously, basically this is how you tell the thing which regulator to use, and you don't want to use both at once. The internal regulator will also need the "internal regulator voltage sense" wire as shown on the diagram, but that should already be there.

Since I think you already tried that (from above - "That what I did at first, but the alternator was not charging the batteries."), it seems like the internal regulator isn't working either. That's about the end of what you can try, if it doesn't work with external or internal

 

[sailboatliving]

The thing at the bottom left of the diagram says "regulator wiring harness", it isn't meant to represent a bundle but connections through a harness to the external regulator. To be fair, I don't think they have done the drawing in a very clear way, I can see how it looks that way at a quick glance. As said in the previous post, all that needs to happen to get it to use the internal regulator is that "internal regulator excite" needs to be powered and "external regulator excite" needs to be unpowered. As the note says, is very important that they are not both powered simultaneously, basically this is how you tell the thing which regulator to use, and you don't want to use both at once. The internal regulator will also need the "internal regulator voltage sense" wire as shown on the diagram, but that should already be there.

Since I think you already tried that (from above - "That what I did at first, but the alternator was not charging the batteries."), it seems like the internal regulator isn't working either. That's about the end of what you can try, if it doesn't work with external or internal

Thanks for a great reply. Yes, Sense was already installed.

Then I will just disconnect the brown excite wire and use the engine without charging from the alternator until I get find a new alternator.

 

[Alex_Blackwood]

Thanks for a great reply. Yes, Sense was already installed.

Then I will just disconnect the brown excite wire and use the engine without charging from the alternator until I get find a new alternator.

Just a word of caution, if you can get the alternator checked before you buy a replacement, may be an an idea as there is just the possibility that the fault lies elsewhere

 

[ghostlymoron2]

You should maybe get an electrician to sort it out for you. A couple of hours could well save wrecking you charging system.

 

[sailboatliving]

I think an electrician screwed it up in the first place. I removed the house battery cable from the alternator and I lost solar charge on the starter battery. So the solar charge most have gone through house battery cable to the alternator and back to starter via the starter battery cable! I have three switches and by turning on the middle one (which the electrician said should be off, I got solar to the starter battery

Should I just move the cable that connects "switch both" and "switch starter" one over, so it is on the solar cable terminal?

 

[greeny]

see post 21. If not, then get an electrician.

 

[Alex_Blackwood]

see post 21. If not, then get an electrician.

Think he has had a spider in!
Seriously if what he has drawn was done by an electrician, he needs a second opinion! One thing obvious, with all due respect, the OP is not going to fix it

 

[PaulRainbow]

I think an electrician screwed it up in the first place. I removed the house battery cable from the alternator and I lost solar charge on the starter battery. So the solar charge most have gone through house battery cable to the alternator and back to starter via the starter battery cable! I have three switches and by turning on the middle one (which the electrician said should be off, I got solar to the starter battery

Should I just move the cable that connects "switch both" and "switch starter" one over, so it is on the solar cable terminal?

Assuming the drawing is correct, this looks like it started out correct, but someone has added the Balmar alternator and solar panel and wired them up wrong.

The alternator cannot be wired as shown, as it's linking the two batteries, which is why you have the issue with the solar not charging the engine battery when the alternator positive is removed. The cable from the alternator to the house battery needs to be removed.

The solar controller needs to be connected to the battery terminal of the house switch.

The busbar that is connected to the both switch should be connected to the house switch terminal that the switch panel is connected to.

You need a VSR connected between the battery terminals of the engine and house switches. This will allow the alternator (when fixed or replaced) and the solar panel to charge both batteries.

As a temporary measure, until you can find an electrician, remove the cable between the alternator and the house switch. You can then use the both switch to get some charge into the engine battery (or to allow starting from the house battery). This should not be left on all of the time, get some charge into the engine battery and then switch it off, or you can end up with flat batteries and no way to start the engine.

EDIT: According to the sketch the inverter is connected to the battery, with no fuse and no isolator switch, this is very wrong and could easily start a fire in the event of a short.

 

[sailboatliving]

Thanks for the lengthy reply. The electrician that installed the inverter moved some cables around. The solar was in the house switch before that.

There is a 250 ANL fuse on the positive cable going to the inverter, I just forgot to add it to my drawing

 

[PaulRainbow]

Thanks for the lengthy reply. The electrician that installed the inverter moved some cables around. The solar was in the house switch before that.

There is a 250 ANL fuse on the positive cable going to the inverter, I just forgot to add it to my drawing

He's an idiot then.

As i said "The solar controller needs to be connected to the battery terminal of the house switch." As it stands, if the house switch is turned off the solar goes nowhere.

 

[sailboatliving]

Thanks, I have changed everything except the VSR which i don't have access to at the moment.

So in the future I will only have 1 positive cable from the alternator to the engine battery switch and then a VSR between engine switch and house switch to charge the house batteries as well?

My switches are only on/off. They have two terminal each and some of the terminals are getting too crowded, does it matter if I use terminal 1 or 2 on for example the house switch.

Also the positive cable from the engine switch to the the alternator is connected to the engine on its way to the alternator, see picture. Is this okay?

 

[PaulRainbow]

Thanks, I have changed everything except the VSR which i don't have access to at the moment.

Well done

So in the future I will only have 1 positive cable from the alternator to the engine battery switch and then a VSR between engine switch and house switch to charge the house batteries as well?

Yes. The VSR will also allow the solar panels to charge both batteries.

My switches are only on/off.

Good.

They have two terminal each and some of the terminals are getting too crowded, does it matter if I use terminal 1 or 2 on for example the house switch.

It does. For the house switch, one terminal has the battery and solar connections, the inverter. switch panel and the both switch etc connect to the other terminal. But, the proper way yo do it is to connect all of those loads to a busbar, then just use a single cable from the busbar to the switch.

The engine switch has the battery and alternator connected to one terminal, with the engine and the both switch connected to the other.

The VSR can be connected to the house busbar and the engine terminal of the engine switch.

Also the positive cable from the engine switch to the the alternator is connected to the engine on its way to the alternator, see picture. Is this okay?

It's common the the cable from the battery switch to go to the starter solenoid and another, thinner, cable to go from the starter solenoid to the B+ on the alternator.