rotrax
Well-known member
I was always under the impression that Blondie Haslar was one of the survivors of the Cockleshell Hero's raid using kyaks to put limpet mines on German ships. If he did mini subs as well he had one hell of a war...........
How much time and money should I spend planning for failure?
- Thread starter PhillM
- Start date
I was always under the impression that Blondie Haslar was one of the survivors of the Cockleshell Hero's raid using kyaks to put limpet mines on German ships. If he did mini subs as well he had one hell of a war...........
Koeketiene
Well-known member
+1
No amount of safety kit is going to keep you safe.
At best most 'essential' kit serves as a comfort blanket, at worst it will instil a subconscious casual attitude towards danger at sea.
The ultimate bit of safety kit is the software between your ears.
prv
Well-known member
I surprised my mate last weekend by producing a hammer and chisel. I have a crutch for the lowered mainmast that fits into the mizzen mast socket - or rather didn't fit as it had swollen from sitting outside. No problem to whip out the chisel and pare it down. He was surprised that anyone would carry a wood chisel on a small fibreglass weekender, but it's just one of those things that comes in handy.
Pete
PhillM
Well-known member
Ok so the message is coming through that a do-it-yourself attitude and skills are what are needed. Ans there was me thinking that all we had to do was to buy a boat and go sailing 
I have spent last winter and since September restoring our boat to (almost) her former glory. There was no way that I could do most of the jobs myself. However, I was determined to do as much as I could. I chose contractors who were prepared to let me work alongside them and learn. I guess that I have taken about 2 months off work in the last year to work on the boat. I have learned a LOT about wooden boats (more than I would have ever through existed).
I think that I now have a tool kit that will cover most situations. I also have quite a lot of spares.
My problem is that I don’t really know HOW! (20+ years in software has not really prepared me for this – diy was always something SWMBO did at home and she isn’t interested in sailing).
I guess the RYA diesel engine course would be a good idea.
I can see that I could start an almost endless round of night school courses to become a carpenter, electrician, plumber, mechanic, rigger, sail maker, and I am sure lots of other trades as well.
Or I could buy some books and just have a go when the opportunity arises.
How did you guys learn, or did you have the skills before owning a boat?
I have spent last winter and since September restoring our boat to (almost) her former glory. There was no way that I could do most of the jobs myself. However, I was determined to do as much as I could. I chose contractors who were prepared to let me work alongside them and learn. I guess that I have taken about 2 months off work in the last year to work on the boat. I have learned a LOT about wooden boats (more than I would have ever through existed).
I think that I now have a tool kit that will cover most situations. I also have quite a lot of spares.
My problem is that I don’t really know HOW! (20+ years in software has not really prepared me for this – diy was always something SWMBO did at home and she isn’t interested in sailing).
I guess the RYA diesel engine course would be a good idea.
I can see that I could start an almost endless round of night school courses to become a carpenter, electrician, plumber, mechanic, rigger, sail maker, and I am sure lots of other trades as well.
Or I could buy some books and just have a go when the opportunity arises.
How did you guys learn, or did you have the skills before owning a boat?
Seajet
...
Personally my more intense sailing coincided with getting an engineering apprenticeship, which has come in very handy even though I later transferred to photography in an aviation engineering setting.
If you sail long enough - or more accurately, own and operate a boat - the problems encountered just lead to one learning the solutions, being a member of a club full of handy practical people is very useful too !
The trick is guaging one's activities to be fun and mild learning experiences, while hopefully not being over ambitious and having dramas.
If you sail long enough - or more accurately, own and operate a boat - the problems encountered just lead to one learning the solutions, being a member of a club full of handy practical people is very useful too !
The trick is guaging one's activities to be fun and mild learning experiences, while hopefully not being over ambitious and having dramas.
Searush
New member
I don't think you NEED to be proficient at everything before you go out. Just be prepared to work out "get you home" techniques & learn the new skills as you tackle each problem in harbour. Or are you planning world girdling trips?
Most problems start small, you need to spot them early & deal with them promptly. That won't necessarily mean at sea, but rather in your next port. Not spotting or ignoring minor issues (like chafe, odd rattles cracked brackets etc) can lead to bigger problems later if the item actually fails in service. Serious problems are often a consequence of a sequence of small failures.
My point is that it's about checking & maintaining so that failures don't come as a surprise rather than rebuilding on passage. Read a few books by cruising folk to understand how they do it.
In a typical season I don't suppose most people have more than a few minor issues & possibly one big one (but possibly not).
Most problems start small, you need to spot them early & deal with them promptly. That won't necessarily mean at sea, but rather in your next port. Not spotting or ignoring minor issues (like chafe, odd rattles cracked brackets etc) can lead to bigger problems later if the item actually fails in service. Serious problems are often a consequence of a sequence of small failures.
My point is that it's about checking & maintaining so that failures don't come as a surprise rather than rebuilding on passage. Read a few books by cruising folk to understand how they do it.
In a typical season I don't suppose most people have more than a few minor issues & possibly one big one (but possibly not).
Koeketiene
Well-known member
Being out sailing and making mistakes.
Blueboatman
Well-known member
Does anyone really do DIY anymore, beyond downloading the latest software versions of all the stuff on board and carrying a couple of spare fuel filters?
Typical question might be: I have a digital vhf for contacting the coastguard, I have weather from my mobile phone, I have a gps tracker on my hull, but should I consider buying a satellite phone in order to stay in touch?
Typical question might be: I have a digital vhf for contacting the coastguard, I have weather from my mobile phone, I have a gps tracker on my hull, but should I consider buying a satellite phone in order to stay in touch?
DJE
Well-known member
+1.
& please stop calling it safety kit.
Most of it is "emergency kit". It doesn't make you safer but it might help you survive a dangerous situation that you shouldn't have got yourself into.
ukmctc
New member
The best thing you can do is have a free RNLI safety check.
Give them a call, you'll get a visit from them and they will go through your boat aft to bow and tell you if you have done enough for your particular trip and make recomendations for you and your boat.
Best ever tea and biscuits and chat I have ever had in the sailing world. Cuts out all the Bull and just deals with you, your boat, and your journey safety.
Give them a call, you'll get a visit from them and they will go through your boat aft to bow and tell you if you have done enough for your particular trip and make recomendations for you and your boat.
Best ever tea and biscuits and chat I have ever had in the sailing world. Cuts out all the Bull and just deals with you, your boat, and your journey safety.
webcraft
Well-known member
.
A one-day diesel engine course is a good idea if you haven't done anything before. If OTOH you have serviced your own car and aren't scared of engines then you may not need this.
After that, sailing skills are paramount - particularly going out in different weathers and sea states. In particular, do plenty of boat handlindg in close quarters under sail - because when the engine does stop you don't want to have to call for help if your sails are in good order.
(And anyway it will make you a lot more confident).
- W
A one-day diesel engine course is a good idea if you haven't done anything before. If OTOH you have serviced your own car and aren't scared of engines then you may not need this.
After that, sailing skills are paramount - particularly going out in different weathers and sea states. In particular, do plenty of boat handlindg in close quarters under sail - because when the engine does stop you don't want to have to call for help if your sails are in good order.
(And anyway it will make you a lot more confident).
- W
fireball
New member
you're the only person I know who's had to abandon their vessel - I'd hope I'd have similar kit if I was crossing oceans !!
The rest is not directed at you at all .....
An emergency is only really an emergency when you don't have the knowledge or tools or manpower to deal with the situation ... not getting yourself into the situation to start with is a good idea ... you won't ever be able to guarantee it (well - you could, stay on land!) - but you can go a long way to reducing the likely hood ...
A Westerly that we looked at a few years ago had doubled up standing rigging ....
fireball
New member
20 years in software - so you did some diagnostics and problem solving - that's all you're doing on a boat - it's just a case of knowing where to start diagnosing ...
If you've got skills in logic then you can easily turn that into sailing skills ...
RupertW
Well-known member
+1 to that.
When I preferred spending my money on drinking and eating out all week before sailing weekends, I followed the advice of an article about the difference between safety and emergency equipment.
So I spent money on safety equipment:
Charts
Pilot books
Logbook
Tools
Trailing log
New jib
Engine service, fan belt and impeller
Radar reflector (ok, I know now that it didn't help much)
Brass foghorn
More anchor chain
- years later I added GPS to that list as the safest you can ever be is when you know where you are and what is around you.
I spent nothing on emergency "help me help me" equipment
Flares
VHF
Liferaft
When crossing the Atlantic years later we did have a liferaft though I'm not sure why but didn't have EPIRB, sat phone etc, so I suppose I still have the same basic concept of sailing
ukmctc
New member
you have done enough get out there and start learning...
Seven Spades
Well-known member
Here is a list of essentials
Do not leave port without all of the above or you will be in grave danger.
- Life jackets
- Life raft
- VHF
- Hand Held VHF
- Flares
- Fire extinguishers
- AIS
- EPIRB
- Radar
- SART
- PLB
- Chartplotter
- 1 Billion candlepower torch
- Jonbouy
- Danbouy
- Floating Lines
- Chocolate
- Nylons
- Condoms
Do not leave port without all of the above or you will be in grave danger.
Wansworth
Well-known member
Compass?
Seajet
...
Waterproofs too, but I suspect Seven Spades was not entirely serious in his spec's.
Wansworth
Well-known member
Yes...must be ironic.....Last week in Australian waters a family where rescued after their boat sank,possible fire,They were clinging to a large portable ice box...something else to add to the must have!
Seajet
...
Well as long as they still had cold tinnies, what's the problem ?