KompetentKrew
Well-known member
Same price at Drogaria Sergio Roque, which is where I've always got mine filled.
Where exactly is the place near McDonald's, please?
Gas rage!
- Thread starter lustyd
- Start date
Where exactly is the place near McDonald's, please?
lustyd
Well-known member
My experience is trying to swap cylinders over several years in any and all outlets along the most popular cruising ground in the country. This is also reflected on inland waterway forums and caravanning forums. No, maybe it's not universal, but very close to it based on the evidence. Every marina, chandlery and shop on the south coast this summer laughed when I asked and said they hadn't seen full cylinders for many months and didn't expect more.
If you want to gamble your summer cruise fair enough, I'd prefer some certainty
If you want to gamble your summer cruise fair enough, I'd prefer some certainty
Whaup367
Active member
Harbour has four full 7s and three full 6s available. No 4.5s or 3.9s atm, unsurprisingly.
Appreciate that this isn't much use if you are the other end of the country but hope it demonstrates why not everyone sees things as a total disaster.
Appreciate that this isn't much use if you are the other end of the country but hope it demonstrates why not everyone sees things as a total disaster.
lustyd
Well-known member
I’m confused. You’re confirming that there are no small cylinders yet saying it’s not a disaster. To those about to leave on a cruise who need gas that could be the difference between hot food and cold food for several weeks.
Ink
Active member
For the vast majority reading these posts, the issue is not 7, 6 or 3.9kg bottles but specifically 4.5kg Butane in its traditional shape/size.
As you now agree your harbour doesn't have any. Replicate that from the south to North of these islands and you begin to understand the problem.
Ink
Whaup367
Active member
I understand the problem. It's the proposed solution I have concerns about.
Restocked this morning, BTW, but still no 4.5s. There are half a dozen full 907s there, though, so if I was reliant on a small cylinder I, personally, would pick one of those up to tide me over. Inconvenient and pricey but not a disaster.
Switching to smaller or larger cylinders doesn't seem to be an option for some (many?) but dismantling the nationwide distribution network seems an overreaction, virtually guaranteed to cause bigger problems.
Restocked this morning, BTW, but still no 4.5s. There are half a dozen full 907s there, though, so if I was reliant on a small cylinder I, personally, would pick one of those up to tide me over. Inconvenient and pricey but not a disaster.
Switching to smaller or larger cylinders doesn't seem to be an option for some (many?) but dismantling the nationwide distribution network seems an overreaction, virtually guaranteed to cause bigger problems.
Mister E
Well-known member
Gaslow sell refillable bottles that are the same size as the 907.
We are stuck with Calor as the main supplier unless someone wants to start a new company.
Moaning will not help but it will make us feel better.
We are stuck with Calor as the main supplier unless someone wants to start a new company.
Moaning will not help but it will make us feel better.
lustyd
Well-known member
I can only assume you have some skin in the game with Calor. As a consumer, why should I pay considerably more for gas? Calor have ruined the distribution network already, we're discussing getting a suitable replacement!
There is no reason shops, marinas, chandleries cannot stock both.
Whaup367
Active member
Nope, the only skin I have in the game is as a customer.
There's more to the distribution network than 4.5s.
Good luck with your campaign. I would advise you not to put to much time and effort into it but I don't think you value my input ?.
There's more to the distribution network than 4.5s.
Good luck with your campaign. I would advise you not to put to much time and effort into it but I don't think you value my input ?.
Pete7
Well-known member
Really? Whilst the hose is rated at 20 bar, do you feel the hose secured with a jubilee clip can stand the the vapour pressure of a Butane gas cylinder with a mix of gas and liquid inside it? I did wonder what the pressure of Calor gas's blue butane 4.5Kg and red Propane 3.9Kg cylinders is, but Google doesn't come up with much. However, generic information suggests butane has a vapour pressure of gas and liquid of 128psi at 30'c. Propane is really scary, we are talking dive cylinder pressures if the internet is to be believed.
So What sort of pressure are you thinking of putting through that decanting rig?
Pete
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jdc
Well-known member
Tosh about propane and butane vapour pressures: Butane is about 2 bars and propane about 9 bars. Dive cylinders on the other had are about 200 bars.
The mixture of gas and liquid also has nothing to do with it. So, provided you're using a Fulham nozzle, no issue, you can use jubilee clip.
The mixture of gas and liquid also has nothing to do with it. So, provided you're using a Fulham nozzle, no issue, you can use jubilee clip.
Pete7
Well-known member
Ok that's better, still 9 bar isn't to be sniffed at. I am aware of dive cylinders pressures after a life time of diving, hence the query of gas pressures in calor cylinders.
How do I measure the pressure of the LPG cylinder?
Whaup367
Active member
FWIW: Stopped on the way home today to have a quick look at a boatyard that we're thinking we might like to use in the future... they had three or four 4.5s and a couple of 3.9s available for exchange. I'm not even looking for a refill at the moment, just checked the stock at a few places that I happened to be over the last few days.
sailaboutvic
Well-known member
Since posted I have decanter and filled 4 X 907 bottles without any problems .
The only thing I found is once there more gas in the 907 then the one it's being filled from it tend to stop filling .
So I'm finding the last bit of the bigger bottle I having to connect to my boat and use up that way .
Any suggestion?
Pete7
Well-known member
Used to have the same problem decanting diving cylinders to make nitrox mixtures. You just have to accept it and using the last bit of gas directly the way to go. Might be worth putting a pressure gauge in the line so you can monitor the gas pressure as the large cylinder empties.
Boathook
Well-known member
The last bit is always slow so I sometimes give up. Don't forget that you are transferring a liquid. I do end up tilting the donor bottle as it empties to get the liquid to flow but there is always some left. I wonder if it is trapped by the valve thread being 'proud' in the donor bottle.
sailaboutvic
Well-known member
How do you mean tilt? Mine is held up side down .
jdc
Well-known member
It's not difficult but you have to realise that the recipient bottle must gave a lower pressure of vaporisation, and that is dependent of the temperature of the liquid - which has just come from the donor bottle!
Our technique is to put the donor bottle in the airing cupboard or the sun and the recipient bottle in the fridge for a few hours before starting filling. When transfer stops, disconnect and put the recipient in the fridge again for an hour, then reconnect all and restart filling.
Our technique is to put the donor bottle in the airing cupboard or the sun and the recipient bottle in the fridge for a few hours before starting filling. When transfer stops, disconnect and put the recipient in the fridge again for an hour, then reconnect all and restart filling.
Bodach na mara
Well-known member
This is the first sensible description of the transfer process that I have seen. The system in use for large scale transfer of LPG I think must involve pumps operating on the liquid phase of the fuel. Expect the liquid to flow under gravity ignores the need to displace the vapour phase of a volume equal to that of the liquid flowing. The description of the process in an Australian website suggests that this is done by venting the vapour to atmosphere!
sailaboutvic
Well-known member
That's where I'm going wrong .
Bigger fridge required and convert front bunk to airing cardboard ?