From disspointing to infuriating and beyond

[capsco]

I think when you, as a non Italian National, buy an Italian flagged boat all the original documentation is retained by the Italian registry.
Anyway Jez if you don't want it let me have the details, I might buy it.

 

[Whitelighter]

Pm'd you the details

 

[capsco]

Reply sent.

 

[CMJ]

Gutting this isn't working out for you Jez as the price seems unbelievably low - but when you don't have a good feeling about the broker (and there're big issues with the boat that bother you), I'm beginning to understand where you're coming from.........although if it was me - I'd still go for it!

 

[Lloydroberts]

Imho(for what it's worth)there's an offer I'd be grasping with both hands, MM's offer of help.

A highly educated man with vast knowledge of boats speaking to the broker in his mother tongue, what could be better?

If MM is willing to do that, surely that's the next step.

 

[Whitelighter]

I have already emailed MM - we have spoken by email before , in fact I sent him the contract before I signed it.

 

[ian38_39]

Really do feel for you here Jez as I boat from the same camp,"Can't afford it but I'm dammed if I am going to let that stop me".
Having just been through probably the most stressful period of my life, allied to a distinct lack of sleep for a month or so, I have ended up with what I perceive to be a bargain. So it may be worth seeing it through.

If this is not a wood composite and given that it is normally above the waterline I can't see why it would not dry but then I am no GRP expert. For what it is worth what I would do is, providing the paperwork can be produced and that was another issue when I bought from Croatia, buy the boat use it for the season then get it out of the water and covered so no external water can get in, let it dry and then sit back and think how clever you have been to buy the boat you have for so little.

If it has any timber products inside then walk away, chalk it down to experience and hope they don't sue.

 

[Lloydroberts]

All the best, I hope it all works out and you get the right result(for you).

 

[jrudge]

I was not really agreeing with the comments re just buy it ... but having looked at the price of Azi 42s of that vintage ... I probably agree!

http://www.boatshop24.co.uk/boats-for-sale/azimut/azimut-42

The broker does not seem a nice person to deal with, but he is representing the seller...

 

[Flynnbarr]

I wonder if all the people encouraging the op to buy will make him an offer on the boat in a couple of years time when/if it hasn't dried out and he has patches on inside from attacking it with a multimaster.
Think the op wants it in Spain,they will be fun holidays,taking apart parts of the interior,fibreglass and itchy dust in sweltering temperatures.
He may come to hate it,do not underestimate the task unless you send it somewhere to be done professionally,more transport costs to and fro and how long will op be without a boat?
I had major problems with a boat,ended up hating the sight of it and wished I'd had an escape costing me only 3k.
Good luck with whatever you decide I recognise what you are writing and feeling.

 

[BartW]

Jez I feel with you ! and understand the frustration,
boat buying shoudn't be that much stress on so many levels

... I might buy it.

wow what a wonderfull solution of this situation !
good luck to both of you !

 

[jfm]

Absolutely. There is no way they'd get the balance before I had originals.
That was added to the MOA

That's a very important point in all this Jez and is the route to a solution, whether you want to buy or walk away.
Are you saying it was added to MoA after the version you posted above? Because it sure isn't in the version you posted above. Please can you post the version that contains this (save-the-day) amendment clause? It will create a solution

 

[lionelz]

I Hope all goes well for you, I know you advised me when I was buying my boat, so I really hope it goes well for you. 3k is a lot of money but far less that 60k plus any repairs that may have to be done. As for him tasking you to court, whilst I know nothing about the law, why would he do that? a lot of time and effort on something that he may not win and across the continent, he IMO just playing hard ball to pressurise you. He is desperate to sell as well.

 

[Whitelighter]

The terms were agreed by email. Ive just pinged the marine lawyer acting for me.

 

[Greg2]

Blimey, what a horrible position to find yourself in Jez, particulary when you have done what you can to cover everything. Really not sure what I would do and it is very easy to offer advice when you aren't the one up to your ar!se in alligators trying to drain the swamp. FWIW the suggestion about specialist advice on the moisture issue sounds sensible as long as the paperwork can be sorted but I fully get your feelings on the matter now and with the pressure of timescales it can't be easy. Perhaps pressuring you on time is a bluff?

 

[rwoofer]

I wonder if all the people encouraging the op to buy will make him an offer on the boat in a couple of years time when/if it hasn't dried out and he has patches on inside from attacking it with a multimaster.
Think the op wants it in Spain,they will be fun holidays,taking apart parts of the interior,fibreglass and itchy dust in sweltering temperatures.
He may come to hate it,do not underestimate the task unless you send it somewhere to be done professionally,more transport costs to and fro and how long will op be without a boat?
I had major problems with a boat,ended up hating the sight of it and wished I'd had an escape costing me only 3k.
Good luck with whatever you decide I recognise what you are writing and feeling.

+1, been in the same position and with the stress that came with it I would have loved a 3k out.

Jez, can't really help other than to say whatever decision you do make, you should be able to post-rationalise the saga and sleep easy again.

 

[Vitesse]

This is a pretty horrible situation and I can only imagine the upset and stress.

I wonder what the broker has told/promised the owner. The deadline seems artificial, unless I've missed something.

 

[jfm]

The deadline seems artificial

It is written clearly in the contract as the date Jez must pay. Apart from that, yep it is artificial.

What follows is wrriten without seeing the email exchanges referred to above. They're critical and could change things big time

Despite my first para above, if you breach a contract only by performing it a bit late, the losses you are liable for (in a case like this) probably amount only to the mooring fees and if you're merely a few weeks late it is hard to imagine the other side will bother claiming those losses. So Jez you could delay a bit if you need to in order to get a lender-acceptable survey/valuation done. But once it becomes apparent you are not going to complete at all rather than merely delay, you're sue-able on the grounds you have failed to perform. Seller can sue you for (a) the difference between €70,750 and what he ultimately net sells the boat for (b) his mooring fees in meantime (c) incidental costs and lawyers. Broker can sue you for your commission share € . It will be easy for them: sue in Italy, which is the contractually agreed jurisdiction.

You may not be paying 3k to walk away - it could be much more and then you might wish you bought the boat.

I can see the point about the lender not funding, which is fairly major. There is a basic schoolboy point in bank-financed transactions that the lender's conditions for advancing the money must be things in your control or conditions precedent to completion of the contract. So if lender insists on VAT invoice, which isn't in your control, the contract must require seller to produce it on completion failing which buyer has right to walk away. Saying that now is stable door/horse bolted, I realise - unless the mails save the day on that, as I said. Anyway, if you were to decide to continue buying the boat Jez you'll just have to do everything you can to satisfy the lender's conditions and not worry if that takes you a week or two past 26/6

By the way Jez, I feel for your situation and am sad for you that it is difficult stuff. I could write posts that just go on about that but as you know my DNA is realpolitik only and I don't bother with the rest. So I'm being realistic, and of course feel free to ignore if you prefer. Best wishes. I've sent you a PM too

 

[jfm]

Jez can you clear some inbox please? I'm trying to send you something a bit important! Ta

 

[Hurricane]

Jez can you clear some inbox please? I'm trying to send you something a bit important! Ta

I think he is in a work phase at the moment and has shut his mind to all this.
I'm sure he will get back to this in a couple of days after he finishes this working phase.
For his benefit, please keep trying to send him your PM.