Fisher 25 or LM 27.

[LittleSister]

Banger, you are spot on. The Fisher is silly money, most are asking £24k but therd are a lot of LM27s on the market at even sillier money. Boatshed have an LM27 at £29,950. Most are asking mid to low 20s. My feeling is that the brokers are kidding their clients on by overvaluing their boats.
I have now written off the Fisher as it is just not worth the money.
At the moment, I am going to look at an lm27 with rear doors to the wheelhouse and bilge keels, trouble is it is too expensive.
At my last trawel, there are about 12 LM27 for sale.
There are a few on the market at around 16 to 19k, the one I am looking at is low 20s.

Thanks for your thoughts Banger

I'm in the market for a boat, have been looking around for a while (including at motor sailers), and can only conclude that a lot of people paid top dollar for boats 25 or so years old at the height of the boom, and haven't cottoned on to the fact they're selling boats now going on 40 years old in (what is for most buyers in that market) hard times with the economic outlook even gloomier.

I did view a couple of LM27s, both under £20k, and one of the brokers as good as told me both before and after viewing it that it wasn't worth the asking price. At one point it seemed to be being suggested to me that it should be advertised about 20% lower, but the owner wouldn't accept the advice. As it happens, for various reasons I wasn't interested in that particular boat at any price, but even if I were I'd think it ought to be much lower than that.

It appears there are currently very few people buying at that level in the market. Many of the boats have clearly been advertised for a very long time, and of all the boats I've taken any sort of passing interest in only one has been sold.

 

[Sinbad1951]

The Potter is definately a Fisher. It is on the Fisher 25 hull and was designed as a day fishing boat with small cramped accommodation. The heads is accessed via a hatch on the foredeck and is down a verticle ladder. (Try selling that to the Mrs!) It has lots of lowered deck space to allow a bunch of mates to fish from.

 

[pvb]

The Potter is definately a Fisher. It is on the Fisher 25 hull and was designed as a day fishing boat with small cramped accommodation. The heads is accessed via a hatch on the foredeck and is down a verticle ladder. (Try selling that to the Mrs!) It has lots of lowered deck space to allow a bunch of mates to fish from.

Just to confuse matters, there's a "Potter" on the market currently which has had a rather ugly cabin grafted on to it, in front of the wheelhouse.

 

[Rivers & creeks]

I'm in the market for a boat, have been looking around for a while (including at motor sailers), and can only conclude that a lot of people paid top dollar for boats 25 or so years old at the height of the boom, and haven't cottoned on to the fact they're selling boats now going on 40 years old in (what is for most buyers in that market) hard times with the economic outlook even gloomier.

I did view a couple of LM27s, both under £20k, and one of the brokers as good as told me both before and after viewing it that it wasn't worth the asking price. At one point it seemed to be being suggested to me that it should be advertised about 20% lower, but the owner wouldn't accept the advice. As it happens, for various reasons I wasn't interested in that particular boat at any price, but even if I were I'd think it ought to be much lower than that.

It appears there are currently very few people buying at that level in the market. Many of the boats have clearly been advertised for a very long time, and of all the boats I've taken any sort of passing interest in only one has been sold.

Nice motorsailers from a popular brand sell quickly and for good prices, tired tatty ones hang around longer than tired tatty MABs because the owners perceive the m/s to be worth more. It's not, it's only worth more if it's in top condition and then it will sell for a lot more than an equivalent good condition MAB. If you're on Facebook then check out the group https://www.facebook.com/groups/motorsailers/?ref=bookmarks
Or one of the many specific brand owners groups on Facebook.

 

[ashtead]

If I was 72 and buying what might be my last boat I would go with my heart and buy the Fisher even if older as otherwise you might always regret not having had one and if it's well engined it might be easier to pass on to another caring owner in the future . Clearly a longer version offers more but I am assuming that berthing fees are driving you to a smaller version although from a comfort perspective you might appreciate a longer version if longer trips feature in your plans . We sailed past a 37 off Cherbourgh going at great speed which while much larger looked a great vessel given the design and I would seriously consider if looking for a motor sailer. Just looking at the photos the LM somehow just looks less desirable to my eyes?

 

[Jcorstorphine]

That's true, I am bringing mine back from the Netherlands to the East coast so my children and grandchildren can use it, probably as a floating weekend cottage but it gets them on the water.

Hi Banger, I have sent you a PM, hope you don't mind

 

[Lucky Duck]

The heads is accessed via a hatch on the foredeck and is down a verticle ladder. (Try selling that to the Mrs!) .

The joys of learning from other's experiances

 

[AHoy2]

I have a Scanyacht 290, a development of the LM27 but retaining most of the characteristics. The layout works well for me, the wheelhouse (with doors) provides sheltered sailing with good helming visibility around and of the sails, whilst the galley-up arrangement allows the galley slave to enjoy a view out and the ability to participate in both saloon and cockpit social life. In the S290 version the galley converts to a second seated nav position if required, not an option on LMs as far as I am aware. A big plus is that the level changes between the wheelhouse and saloon or cockpit are steps not stairs so movement around the boat is easy and no cave effect going below. Deckwork and access is good, the wheelhouse height and grabrails make going forward quite secure despite what appear to be narrow sidedecks at that point, plenty of work space and lounging area forward. The cockpit is deep and secure, comfortable with six people for social gatherings and is ok for three, possibly four people when working sails. Forward visibilty from the cockpit is a little restricted when seated so requires a lookout either side or regular look-arounds, still seems better than my limited recall of the Fisher visibility.

YM gave a positive review of the S290's sailing ability placing it in the sailing rather than motor-sailer category and made reference to the LM27's similar abilty (the S290 does have a slightly larger sail area). I have not sailed in company with a Fisher 25 (or larger) so cannot make a direct comparison. Both show their long keel handling traits so maneuvering astern and tacking in heavy seas demand some attention. Neither are going to win races but my S290 has proved steady and comfortable at sea.

Appearance v. the Fisher 25? Maybe not the same instant appeal but several people have commented favourably on the LM/S290's style and appearance. The "Colin Archer" lines work for me and the low freeboard midships makes boarding and pontoon work easier whilst the raised bluff bow does not interfer with berthing visibility. Whatever you choose, a motor-sailer seems to make increasingly more sense if you want to sail uk waters in relative comfort! We remain in commission year-round and intend to celebrate the New Year at a favourite anchorage.

Edit: Agree with Colvic Watson's earlier comment, good condition motor-sailers command a premium on price, there seems to be increasing recognition of their suitability for uk sailing and few options in the smaller sizes.