Expired UK Passport?
- Thread starter Graham376
- Start date
billskip
Well-Known Member
So when your dual citizenship other passport expires are you going to renew it? or do you think you will be able to persuade them of your rights?
Anyway good luck with your experiment, I would have thought the exit woud be more restricted. Of course they may not let you leave the UK without a valid UK passport should you wish to leave.
I know in Venezuela if you are Venezuelan and have multiple passports you can only leave Venezuela on a Venezuela passport.
Good luck
pretzel_logic
Member
The UK doesn't have exit immigration so that wouldn't be an issue. At least not from airports. And there is no restriction on which passport you can use in order to leave anyway.So when your dual citizenship other passport expires are you going to renew it? or do you think you will be able to persuade them of your rights?
Anyway good luck with your experiment, I would have thought the exit woud be more restricted. Of course they may not let you leave the UK without a valid UK passport should you wish to leave.
I know in Venezuela if you are Venezuelan and have multiple passports you can only leave Venezuela on a Venezuela passport.
Good luck
There is a passport check to ensure that you can enter the country you're going to but not traditional immigration.
As stated, the problem will come at Calais at the ferry.
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syvictoria
Well-Known Member
If travelling to the EU, it's recommended that you exit on the EU passport.
newtothis
Well-Known Member
Right to abode is not right of entry.
That's exactly what is changing... the new law expressly forces UK citizens to enter the UK on British passports. Rocking up at Calais with your non-UK passport that gives a place of birth in the UK will gain you a firm 'No', no matter what driving licence your flash at them. You'll be left to enjoy Calais while you await the issue of your new UK passport.
syvictoria
Well-Known Member
Maybe you're right, but my reading of the matter suggests that there isn't actually any change to the law, and the Home Office's response when questioned has not been to quote chapter and verse, but instead to "strongly advise".
Will British dual nationals really be forced to have a valid UK passport from February?
All that said, I'm probably being overly optimistic!!
billskip
Well-Known Member
Plenty of rubber boats just along a bit, regular crossings....All that said, I'm probably being overly optimistic!!
Dellquay13
Well-Known Member
I am probably wrong, and don’t have skin in this particular game, but I thought the recommendation was to exit the UK border with your UK passport but present your EU passport on entry to the EU?
It avoids a mistaken Schengen event being logged. The reverse order used on return again stops you being questioned about your Schengen rights.
It means that each territory can record movements of their legal citizens, deters erroneous immigration statistics and helps control the blood pressure of the Daily Mail staff.
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ithet
Well-Known Member
That's exactly what I did last week for Leshuttle. UK passport to UK border control when leaving, Irish to French passport control 100 yards later. Reversed procedure at Calais.
pretzel_logic
Member
Well it is really once citizenship has been established. UK citizens have an absolute right of abode and an absolute right of entry. In fact what happens is that UK citizens are completely exempt from all Immigration control - once their citizenship has been established. That has not and is not changing.
The difficulty, as has been said, will be getting the transport operators to take you and that will be the sticking point. Once the person actually reaches the border then it's a relatively simple check to clarify if the person is a UK citizen if they don't have the required documentation and once that's done they are then exempt from immigration control.
Presumably if someone sails across themselves - by yacht for example - then they could reasonably enter on their expired UK passport once they reach the UK (I'm not too sure how it works sailing to and from France these days - i.e. whether you need to check out of France - haven't done it for years). There might be a discussion with Border Force on their arrival but realistically they can't refuse a UK citizen entering their country. But it's a niche situation really.
Obviously the best method for dual citizens is to have a current UK passport as it avoids all these problems which has been said.
I do feel that syvictoria may experience issues as when they travel by ferry, since the ferry check in procedure occurs prior to the immigration and I'm not sure whether they'll allow them to travel once they see that there is no current UK passport or ETA with foreign passport. It will be interesting to see!
Failing that then just get an Emergency Travel Document assuming they are currently out of the UK. If they are in the UK then just get a Fast Track passport.
westernman
Well-Known Member
Very expensive - several thousand euros, and that does not include the extra for luggage.
syvictoria
Well-Known Member
Electronic travel authorisation (ETA): guide for dual citizens
Had a notification that the above page has been updated again today which prompted me to re-read it. The important section with regards to this thread is:
Had a notification that the above page has been updated again today which prompted me to re-read it. The important section with regards to this thread is:
st599
Well-Known Member
You have to check in to the UK using the SPCR form - which requires you to input passport details, then await clearance to enter the UK.
TiggerToo
Well-Known Member
why should someone sailing in be treated any different from anyone travelling by air, car, ferry or train?
I will not comment on what I think of all of this, as it will earn me a ban from this forum
Baggywrinkle
Well-Known Member
There are 2 checks you need to get through.
One is the carrier, who will want to be sure they are not going to be fined and forced to repatriate you. They can refuse to carry you if the paperwork doesn't confirm to their own interpretation of what is required.
The other is customs and immigration, who in the departure country make the decision to let you out (have you overstayed, or are you a "person of interest") and in the arrival country (UK) decide if you are permitted to enter. (Passport, Citizenship, ETA, VISA, "person of interest" etc.)
Since the "B" word happened, many UK nationals now have an EU and a UK passport. Dependent on the "new" passport country, and because the U.K. is no longer in the EU, each EU country can now decide if you are required to renounce your old citizenship in order to be granted your new one. (Citizens of two EU countries are allowed to retain both citizenships/passports regardless of country specific rules) ... but since the UK left the EU there could now be people with expired UK passports who are no longer UK citizens and who still have 2 physical passports.
What does the UK do?
The easy answer is ensure that any potential UK citizen with dual passports has a valid U.K. passport. Then they know that the UK citizenship has not been renounced.
The rule does/did exist that allows UK nationals with expired passorts to travel home - my ex-wife did just that before we had dual citizenship - so you could, for example, as a Spanish citizen with renounced UK citizenship, board using a Spanish passport plus ETA, but gain access to the UK using an expired UK passport.
I totally agree it is a mess.
As a yachtsman heading back to the UK with an expired UK passport, the carrier is irrelevant. You would certainly be let out of the EU on an EU passport, and in the UK if you present an expired UK passport with a copy of a UK birth certificate, entry is pretty much guaranteed too IMO.
We need some people to try this to find out how it all works, Reminds me a bit of the red diesel issues - pot luck based on the mood of the official you encounter on the day.
st599
Well-Known Member
They shouldn't - it should be Border Force's staff working out if someone has a valid passport and should be allowed in to the UK, not the Skipper of a yacht with the help of an 84 page booklet.
Ray Purchase
Well-Known Member
An expired passport from any country is useless. What's the fuss about.
Fr J Hackett
Well-Known Member
What’s the situation arriving by yacht clearing in by SPCR form then leaving by plane or ferry and leaving EU flagged boat in UK for collection and return to EU later?