Distress

[zefender]

Re: Distress satphone alternative?

I'm crossing Biscay this Summer, en famille. As well as VHF, flares set etc, I pondered about an EPIRB versus a sat phone. Provided the latter is in a waterproof container, it should be as reliable (or fallible) as an EPIRB. For about the same price, I reckoned that it would be more useful to phone someone up saying that we were sinking, rather than hope that an EPIRB signal would be picked up quickly, presumably merely indicating that we might have sunk! I opted for the sat phone. Which would you choose?

 

[ToMo]

Re: Distress satphone alternative?

Questions, always b***** questions!
Which Sat phone did you get? (currently looking to buy and getting more confused by the minute!)
When are you planning to cross the bay? & do you want company if our boats are compatable?
TôMö

 

[zefender]

Re: Distress satphone alternative?

I went for Iridium - bought the phone on ebay (new & boxed).

Crossing the bay 3rd July (ish) from Falmouth on Bavaria 40.

When are you off then?

 

[bargee]

Flares are not just for distress, remember - hand-held WHITE ones can be really useful for keeping you our of a distress situation, and no electronics can beat a dazzling burst of magnesium to say "look out you idiot, there's a small boat here". Having found one useful twice now, I wouldn't like to sail without them.

 

[bedouin]

Re: Distress satphone alternative?

EPIRB every time.

Firstly - EPIRBs are designed to be safety equipment - waterproof and shockproof. A consumer sat phone will not be as resilient. Also - the PI stands for "Position Indicating" - tells people where you are and allows them to home in on you. A sat phone would be almost useless without GPS as well.

 

[zefender]

Re: Distress satphone alternative?

Agreed(ish)

But the EPIRB will only actually tell people where the EPIRB is - hopefully I would be nearby! I don't understand the workings but I would have thought that if a phone transmits to a satellite then there would be some idea of where the signal was coming from.

My main point though is that awful moment about when do you actually press the distress button on an EPIRB. I would feel more comfortable communicating with someone as a sort of 'pan pan' , giving position etc before declaring the whole thing a 'dire emergency'. I guess it depends on the emergency. Hit by an oil tanker, one might need an autoactivated EPIRB, rather than needing to press a 'short-dial' key on a phone, but springing a leak or loss of steering/rig etc I might be more inclined to pick up the phone first. Maybe both should be carried.

 

[bedouin]

Re: Distress satphone alternative?

Ah - but my EPIRB is tied to me, so where I go, it goes (at least that's the theory). It would be very difficult to locate you from a sat phone signal - if you are lucky they may be able to pin it down to a few thousand square miles but that's not going to help much - whereas SAR vessels can home in exactly on the 121.5 signal.

I agree that the phone is a more versatile instrument for non-emergency situations, but in an emergency it is no substitute for the EPIRB.

For venturing into blue-water a long-range communication device is always recommended - I imagine that the sat phone would fulfil those requirements very well

 

[incognito]

Back to Flares...

Being somewhat old-fashioned, we wear flares!!

Meaning, we carry a small set of personal flares (Paynes) in the pockets of each of the crew's oilies.

Quite apart from the problems facing the boat, we anticipate the equally likely event of MOB.

If you go overboard, esp. at night, and your crew come back on reciprocal course from afar, or even start an immediate local search - you would only have a chance if you had personal flares. Even a personal EPIRB would be of no use, as the boat has no homing facilities!!

IMHO

 

[bedouin]

Re: Back to Flares...

Depends on the crew. As I usually sail short/single handed I don't place any reliance on being noticed if I fall overboard at night - in that circumstance the EPIRB is the only device I know to give me a good chance of survival (it has to be small enough to fit in a pocket without getting in the way).

I'm not sure how effective a flare would be in the situation you describe. The only burn for a minute or so - and while burning they could have a disasterous effect on the crew's night vision - making it impossible to see anything once it had been extinguished.

 

[vyv_cox]

Re: Back to Flares...

I really don't fancy setting off flares whilst swimming and trying to keep alive. We both have strobe lights that are kept in a dedicated pocket in the upper arm of our oilies but can be attached to the top of our hoods with Velcro. They operate for something like 36 hours on a new battery. Visible for miles, according to the blurb, and they are pretty impressive when tested. Not expensive, either.

 

[incognito]

Re: Back to Flares...

I would like to have a personal EPIRB (any EPIRB for that matter) - but don't give much for my chances of surviving in UK waters for any great length of time, not at my advanced years!!

The EPIRB needs a search vessel/aircraft equipped to locate the EPIRB, getting the rescue out to you will take time.

I haven't done a MOB, and hope I never have to, but I read a book, possibly 'Overboard', which made me think. The first line of recovery of MOB is your own boat coming back for you. To see it sail on by - despite reflections on my oilies, not hearing my shouts over the noise of wave and wind - frightening!!

I also have the strobe devices, and I hope that they would do the trick - but battery powered things have habits of stopping working in the sea, so the idea of a flare as final backup appeals to me.

I am referring to the little personal sets made by Pains, which easily fit in the pocket, cost about £25 if I remember right. [Question: Have you actually seen how these flares look at night? I have, and was most impressed].

Anyway, any and all resources are of interest to me. so eventually I shall have my strobe and personal flares PLUS a PEPIRB - (and promptly sink under their weight).

[ One thing is for sure - I don't rate the chances of getting through on my mobile to Mum!! ]

 

[bedouin]

Re: Back to Flares...

The effacacy of the EPIRB is based on the assumption that I can survive for long enough in the water to be rescued (assumed to be c 4 hours). I think that is a reasonable assumption for my sailing area. If not then I'll need to re-think my strategy somewhat.

 

[mtb]

Re: strobes

Where did you get them and how much.
Ta
Mick

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/boats
I want a big steel ex trawler / tug v / cheap or swap for tug

 

[vyv_cox]

Re: strobes

We bought them over here in Holland. I think they are the McMurdo ones. YM tested a whole raft of them last year. I don't remember the cost but they were not a lot.

 

[BlackSheep]

Hear! Hear!
As a Coastguard (MRCC Clyde) and a yottie, I thoroughly agree with all that Peter has said. I really don't see that there is an argument for or against carrying any particular method of distress alerting against another - more is better! EPIRBs, radio (voice & DSC), mobile phone, strobes, flares all have their place depending on circumstances and used together will enhance the chances of detection. All the electronic gizmos are great and do work, but the good old flare as a last resort or as a pinpoint method is still an essential aid to SAR. I would go as far to say that in UK coastal waters, unless the vis is very poor, popping up a para flare will almost always be seen by someone on shore - very rarely does a flare go unreported, even in the most remote areas. OK they may not be the best method of distress alert, but in certain circumstances they could be your only method. I keep a miniflare trigger with 3 screw-in flares in my oilies and a light stick (no no not a light sabre - not a Jedi yet!) tied to my LJ. As for being expensive - where can I buy an EPIRB or a hand held radio for the price of a few flares? Oh and mobile phones......very useful, but as a back up NOT a replacement for VHF