Cheap Sailing Holidays

[Gwarlan]

We had a pretty disastrous flotilla holiday with one of the "cheap" UK companies.

The boat was very old, tired, leaked like a sieve and smelled mouldy. We suffered a major engine breakdown (lack of maintenance) and our flotilla crew couldn't be contacted as they were drinking. They even hired us a cruising chute knowing that couldn’t be used by a couple (the halyard had been cut too short and couldn’t be led aft). All in all it was pretty grim and it has never more clearly demonstrated that you get what you pay for.

However, the issue I’d like to raise is the level of competency required in a lead skipper and to what extent this is verified. Are these guys all 12 week Yachtmasters ?

I believe that our lead skipper demonstrated an unbelievable lack of competency sending the flotilla out into weather well beyond its capability on two occasions, effectively putting schedule before safety and disregarding the interests of his clients. Lee shores in unreliable boats in confused seas when the prior experience on one boat amounted to an hour’s lesson on a laser on another it was a weekend on the broads in a motor boat !

No experience necessary their brochure states, presumably this applied to there lead crews as well.

 

[fireball]

We've done a VF and a F with a popular sailing company based in Brighton - on both occaisions we had good boats, the last one being a Moody S31. Minor problems with the Moody when the autobilge pump didn't work and obviously had not been working as the bilge smelt a bit - all very quickly fixed by an excellent engineer. The Flot was in Croatia and we were prepared for the weather - F0 to F6/7 very quickly.
During several nights the lead crew went over all the boats checking mooring lines and moving the boats away from the wall slightly where appropriate.

We did have a gripe with the Lead Skipper as he liked his drink and couldn't get up in the morning and did seem to make some silly judgements, but the Engineer was superb - worked extreemly hard and took pride in the fleet.

 

[whisper]

Welcome to the forum.
Can you tell us where your flotilla was based and was the experience recent? Also, had you any prior experience yourself?
I've often wondered about going on one of these on a "berth only" basis but have never got around to it.

 

[gregmlucas]

Gwarlan - I've sent you a PM (private message)

Fireball - do tell, what was the company. I've convinced SWMBO to try sailing for the first time next year - using the delights of the Ionian as a carrot. If all goes well she may get hooked so I'm looking for recommendations.

Cheers,

. . Greg

 

[bumblefish]

If it was a company from Brighton then it can only be Neilson. I would like to recommend their two day boat handling course for pre-flottila people, lots of med' mooring and the sea survival course, run by two guys from the RN!

 

[Gwarlan]

The flotilla was last October and in the Ionian, we had a Attalia 32, the boat must have been nearly 20 years old. The company is "cheap" and London based and a regular advertiser in PBO.

We have had a number of yachts, and have be on numerous flotilla holidays with different operators, indeed I last used this company 10 years ago and it was excellent.

Unfortunately it was a different story this time, the boat was an utter disaster area, the window sealing was shot, there was even delamination in the interier plywood trim due to the long term soaking, the carpets and cushions were damp, all together the stuff of nightmares.

My complaints to the company have gone unanswered, they prefer to blame the weather rather than taking a step back and looking at the "product" and accepting that a yacht should at least provide some sort of shelter from rain !

There is no excuse for the level of leakage we experienced.

There Base Manager in Sivota accepted our compliants and organised an appartment due to the unacceptable condition of the boat but the company in London has been less than helpful even to the extent of being insulting in correspondance.

Just dreadful and a complete rip off. Be warned !

 

[fireball]

Brighton may be a large place, but there is one dominant company that does flotilla hols in the Med and sails from Brighton ... can't really be more specific can I?

Ionian ... great - north or south route? Not been on either myself, but tempted to do it one day (own yacht - y pay to go on one?) - the aim would be short hops in a nice breeze followed by a long lazy lunch in a bay somewhere then short hop to some nice little village quay for dinner ... hmm how long will it take to get my boat to the med!! Probably the best way to entice SWMBO ... /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

 

[Mudhook]

"Just dreadful and a complete rip off. Be warned !"

We are NOT warned. If you can't reveal the name of the outfit - that someone might be just about to sign up with - you might as well not post this stuff!

Regards, Mudhook.

 

[gregmlucas]

Thanks Bumblefish - web site now added to favourites!

 

[gregmlucas]

Mudhook, I guess that Gwarlan is just being concious of libel laws etc - and wants to avaoid being Kimmed!

Easy enough to find out who he's talking about with a bit of initiative.

 

[Sailfree]

sorry to hear of your bad experience, but thats the benifit of Scuttlebutt you can learn from others. Ask on here first.

Frequent recommendations seem to be Sailing Holidays in Greece and Hamble point Yacht Charters in the Solent , if you ask I am sure others will add their experiences relevant to your request.

I have chartered from Sailing Holidays and they were great especially when things went wrong outside their control. Of all the people booked onto the charter flight ONLY sailing holidays left a rep with us until the delayed flight took off. As we were nearly out of money they paid for decent meals (not the rubbish the charter flight company offered) and gave me a phone card to let others in UK know we were delayed.

 

[Joe_Cole]

Greg,

If what he is saying is true then he needn't worry about the libel laws! It ain't libel if you tell the truth.

onto your question...........


We had a flotilla holiday in the Ionian a few years ago, and went with Sailing Holidays who were superb. The lead crew and engineer were first class. The boats were obviously well used, but in perfectably usable condition. I would happily go with them again.
Similar circumstances as yours; I wanted to get SWMBO interested. It worked, she gave the go ahead for us to get a boat!

 

[gregmlucas]

Joe,

Yes, I've heard generally good things about Sailing Holidays and they're on my shortlist.

Sounds like your experiment was very successful if you went on to buy a boat - I can only dream (but working on it!)

Cheers,

. . Greg

 

[Joe_Cole]

[ QUOTE ]
Sounds like your experiment was very successful if you went on to buy a boat -

[/ QUOTE ]

It wasn't an experiment. It was coldly calculated, manipulative scheming followed by nagging, bribery and the odd ultimatum. But it worked /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

Actually it was the suggestion of the tutor when I went on a sailing course with Southern Sailing. I was telling him, over a drink, that I didn't think I would ever persuade SHMBO that we should get a boat. He just looked at me and said, "Easy. Take her on a flotilla holiday in Greece. I guarantee it will convince her". I learnt a lot on that course!

 

[isandell]

If you dont name the company then your post is a waste of space.

Ian

 

[fireball]

Sailing Holidays in Croatia seemed to have 2 fleets - one with large new bavarias and the other with older smaller vessels .... having not been on either I'll not pass judgement but will mention the difference of the fleet was commented on by our engineer ... /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

 

[gregmlucas]

Joe,

I'm *sure* it was cold calculation on your part, but just sold to your other half as "an experiment" - certainly thats how it is for me. I just hope my mathmatics come up with the same result as yours!

Cheers

. . Greg

 

[Gwarlan]

I think if you read the title of the post the name of the company is pretty clear !

Iike I said before, I had an excellent holiday with them in an old Jaguar 27 about 10 years ago and it was excellent !

Unfortunately it was a different story this time so its back to the normal candidates for this years fortnight.

A boat leaking is one thing, its now the company deals with it that is important and they just "bully" in their correspondance, so its in the hands of my solicitor now.

The original question was with regard to the competency of Lead Skippers, ours had no people skills and lacked motivation. He and the hostess were having domestics and this spilled over into an obvious apathy.

On the last day we were forced into (i gave them the boat back prior) a lee shore passage as a SW front passed throught. Schedule definately took priority over safety and we "had" to be off the wall for 1100 when every forecast I could find indicated the weather moderating substantially in the early afternoon.

Competency, most of the flotilla didn't have the experience to challenge the idiot and did it, net result.......a few appartments filled in Sivota with unhappy campers !

So can anyone can be a lead skipper ?

 

[Hurleyburly]

Seems to be 'you get what you pay for'.

We did a North - South Ionian cruise with Sailing Holidays 3 years ago on a Ben 361 which was less than 12 months old. Lead boat skipper and engineer were both excellent - however we did pay lots. Also found that getting water at quaint little Greek quaysides was an absolute ar$e and got quite expensive.

They also wanted €15 a head for their beach BBQ which I thought was a nice little enterprise.

I'd do it again, but only on my own boat.

 

[paulburton44]

We went with Sailing holidays a couple of months ago...We had a Ben 331 and couldn't have asked for more... Niko was a excelent lead crew, Tracy (troy) was the engineer and great, Mara was our hostess and very helpful.
All the crew were very professsional and our needs came first...
There was an old Jag with our flotilla and it did have problems, they were put up in a hotel 1 night when the boat took in a foot of water.
But there was a jag with a diferrent lead crew, they took in as much water but there lead crew did not help and they had to sleep in a wet boat...
So i think the crews do vary and they do have some very old boats with problems.....
Get a Benny and request Niko as lead and you will have a fantastic time, we did.