Centre cleats, lassoos and mooring.

[jonjo]

Rather than intrude on another's singlehanding advice thread I thought I'd fire off a discussion here about shorthanded mooring techniques that involve a single line and a centre cleat.

I want to believe in this because I do a lot of single handing and many here enthuse about the process. However in the past I know that disputes have arisen because folks argue from the perspective of their own boat. So I will start by saying I can imagine how a two handed crew can lassoo a pontoon cleat from the deck and with that line attached mid boat the motor can be used to stabalize the yacht before anyone steps ashore.

I can also picture a singlehander driving something like a Moody Halberdier with a low centre cockpit and then managing to lassoo the pontoon end cleat from the helm or else a quick hop onto the pontoon from the helm position while the boat is only 80% into the marina berth.

However in my case, the helm is right at the extreme stern end of my 35' yacht and it takes a second or two to vault past my large diam racing wheel. Also the throttle control is down at ankle level. My main priority when mooring is to first kill all forward speed because a modern plumb bow would have an unforgiving bump with the pontoon.

I also arrive at finger pontoons that are rarely more than 3/4 the length of the hull so I cannot picture the basic geometry of hooking a pontoon cleat using a mid cleat attached mooring warp from the helm position.

Can anyone explain the process for a boat like mine?

 

[exfinnsailor]

Single Handed

Suppose you could try backwards .. We have a Beneteau 323 and have found that it goes rather well in reverse ( Thanks to FullCircle ) .. You can also see where you are going and having a sugar scoop transom we can step off .. We have also learnt that the more fenders you have the safer it is .. We should have called the boat Fender City .. We fitted fixed ones when we had a marina berth .. That helped when we were learning .. We also learnt that practice is the key .. If you only go out and come back once every couple of weeks you loose the touch .. Better to get someone on the pontoon and spend a day trying all the different ways of getting it wrong until you find the best way for your boat .. Read in one of the mags about using other peoples fenders when you come into an unknown berth .. Nothing wrong it said just leaning on them while you get yourself sorted ..

 

[Ludd]

single handed cowboy technique!

From my boat (nab 35 cc,long keel) the geometry of centre cleat,cockpit winch ,as you say,works ok. If I had to do it with your(probably)more manoeuvrable boat,I think I'd come in stern -to. Would that work for you?

 

[peterb]

However in my case, the helm is right at the extreme stern end of my 35' yacht and it takes a second or two to vault past my large diam racing wheel. Also the throttle control is down at ankle level.

Come in backwards. Have loop prepared on stern cleat, pontoon side. Stop boat, drop loop over pontoon cleat, ease engine forward until warp is tight then leave engine running. The forward push by the prop and the pull back on the line will tend to turn the boat towards the pontoon, and the boat will just sit there.

To demonstrate, berth boat normally but backwards (with shore-based assistance if necessary). Run engine ahead, then loosen all warps except stern breast rope. See what happens.

 

[HoratioHB]

Having written a long diatribe on this in the other thread, in reality quite often the single handed lasoo may just not work, especially, as you say, if the jetty cleat is in the wrong place or the helm position is not suitable. However if it is a marina or a fuel jetty you can normally get in touch by radio or by sailing past and get someone to take your shore line for you. BUT as I said before they always seem to know better and want to do something else. I have found that a firm instruction followed by screaming, weeping begging and threats of violence can sometimes solve the problem!!!!!!!

 

[shmoo]

I am afraid I don't try to lasso, but actually get off the boat, from just by the centre (mine's not a cleat but a fairlead - same effect) with the motor still idling in forward gear and the wheel temporarily locked by dropping in the auto-pilot clutch (AP inactive). I get the center line onto the first pontoon cleat, hoop, bollard I pass, even if it is the one on the outer end of the finger.

Once the center line is on, short and tight, the turning moment brings the bow round towards the pontoon/finger and against the very big bow fender. The stern can't go round very far as the center line is on and short. The boat can't go too far forward into the pen for the same reason. OK its all very skewed and off center looks to onlookers as if I screwed up but now I can sort it all out at leisure.

Added this pic to make things clearer. 1) is the moment of attaching center line and 2) is a moment or two later.

 

[mortehoe]

EXACTLY .... Festina lente

Step off the boat and effect the pre-prepared either bow or centre cleat loop onto the pontoon cleat. No haste is required (engine in forward gear and tiller/wheel locked off) to step back onto the boat to pretend that you are in a Dutch lock and use their single rope technique to secure the bow warp and thence the other warp and the springs ... and then the adjustments made at an equally leisurly pace

N

 

[boatmike]

Most people have ignored the second part of your question. Not uncommon on here for people to give easy answers when there are none! The centre cleat works OK even from a stern position if you lead the line back to the cockpit, back in and then put the engine in forward gear when hooked on. You need sufficient room though which often isn't available. With a short finger pontoon it's no use at all though and the only thing you can do is have a line prepared from the bow rather than centre cleat and come in very slowly, hop off and secure it. Difficult though! If it's your home pontoon, I have in the past rigged a pick up line on the pontoon with a loop that can be caught from the cockpit with a boathook and dropped over a centre cleat but that ain't easy either! It's all part of the experience of single handing I am afraid!

 

[shmoo]

I am not suggesting the center cleat method above is an easy answer, but it is a feasible one. And whether the question is answered depends on how short you call short.

My current mooring is a hammerhead shared unequally with a larger boat. My share of it, allowing a small margin for safety, is about 6m and I bring my 11m boat in to it in the way I describe above. The center cleat (fairlead in my case) ends up about half a metre down the pontoon from the end pontoon cleat. I think that is pretty tight.

 

[Daedelus]

OK. So how do you work it in places like Cherbourg where there isn't a cleat at the end of the pontoon but only a whacking great chunk of what looks like scaffolding pole bent round the end of the pontoon?

I really would like to know I'm not just trying to stir it.

 

[shmoo]

only a whacking great chunk of what looks like scaffolding pole bent round the end of the pontoon?

Just to stop the boat I have put the center line right round the end of the finger before now, if the available securing jobbies were all full of big knots. You only need to stop the boat and bring the bow in.

 

[jonjo]

Thanks shmoo, I understand the geometry of mid cleat mooring for the first time. I had thought the helm was pushed one way or another after the line was attached. Anyhow definitely an option for me when there is another crew member on board.

Reversing in. Hmmm I get the concept but the trouble with so many marinas is that their piles were driven into the mud when the average boat was 32ft long and now 10 or 15 years later the turning space to enter a finger berth leaves no margin for error. I prefer to point the bow into a finger berth while I watch the counter swing of the stern towards the boats on the next jetty.

@Boatmike. Yes indeed I can think of many pontoon berthing situations where the single line + motor technique won't work. But it just happens that my new berth is on a cheap hammerhead with poor buoyancy and the swmbo hates jumping onto it, so time to make a lasso.

 

[maxi77]

Our prefered technique onto normal pontoons or fingers is to drop the eye (which has some plastic pipe spliced into it to hold it open) with a boat hook over the best cleat for the task. On the present boat the line is made secure on a midships cleat but I have also used the sheet winches for the same task. This can usually be done with one or two people on board without too much hassle.

In traditional harbours we simply put a line on the ladder from the midships cleat till proper lines a rigged.

In general holding oneself on with a spring is far less stressfull than having people jumping and catching lines whilst the poor helmsman tries to see what is happening.

 

[Wunja]

pretend that you are in a Dutch lock and use their single rope technique to secure the bow warp and thence the other warp and the springs

Please can you describe this technique?

 

[boatmike]

OK. So how do you work it in places like Cherbourg where there isn't a cleat at the end of the pontoon but only a whacking great chunk of what looks like scaffolding pole bent round the end of the pontoon?

I really would like to know I'm not just trying to stir it.

Well yes, that's what I had in mind with a bow line. In Cherb. (just got back a couple of weeks ago) I still managed single handed getting a 37ft cat with 16ft3in beam in by simply positioning the boat right and stopping her on engine before stepping ashore and tying up. A bow line back to the loop on the end of the finger is the first line which will stop you moving forward, followed by a bow line to the pontoon forward. Frankly it's easy in Cherb cos its sheltered with very little tide movement. Most people make a right cods of it cos they aim at the "ole (or the boat next door!) and come in at an angle either too slowly (and drift) or too fast (and expect crew to leap off the bow and stop the boat). It's not difficult to master parking if you practice and lines ashore can be done at leisure once stopped. When the centre cleat and lasso technique is handy is when alongside a pontoon with wind, tide or both.

 

[robp]

OK. So how do you work it in places like Cherbourg where there isn't a cleat at the end of the pontoon but only a whacking great chunk of what looks like scaffolding pole bent round the end of the pontoon?

I really would like to know I'm not just trying to stir it.

In Cherbourg, if you can get in where they don't have a pile at the pontoon end of the berth, I have gone in astern with two good fenders on the sugar scoop, gently pinned the boat against the pontoon and stepped off with engine still running astern. Just rig all warps/springs and adjust back (foward) off the pontoon.

In fact I do this in Chichester if alone and the wind or freeflow current has other ideas!

 

[andymcp]

I haven't gone for a single-handed mooring attempt yet in our boat - combination of lack of confidence and unfriendly conditions when I have had the chance. But the problems I imagine I will encounter are similar to those described here.

When we arrived into Craobh last week we tried to plan through an approach upwind into a finger pontoon with a boat in the neighbouring berth. We knew the breeze would blow us off, although the prop kick would work to push us into the pontoon. As a relatively beamy boat, we can't afford for the stern to swing out on a centre spring led aft as per Schmoo's picture, so tend to have the loop round the centre cleat, quickly wind it round the aft cleat on the finger pontoon, then pass it to the helm to pull the stern in. The boat is stopped, the stern is held fast and everything else can be slowly sorted from there.

The equivalent (as yet untested) plan for single-handing is to slowly approach the pontoon with helm locked ahead, drop a loop over the cleat on the way in (length of rope from mid-ship cleat guessed in advance after taking a look at the pontoon), put the helm round to point boat away from pontoon with slow ahead power. The beamy stern should rest against pontoon stopping the bow pointing too far out, rest of the ropes arranged at leisure. The parts that worry me are i) having the boat in gear with nobody at helm when putting loop round pontoon cleat ii) degree of swing of bow out from pontoon (not tested yet).

Having read this thread, I am wondering whether astern is the way to go. I guess that's the plans for the next day on the boat sorted - berthing practise!

 

[shmoo]

put the helm round to point boat away from pontoon with slow ahead power. The beamy stern should rest against pontoon stopping the bow pointing too far out,

This may work, but I have my doubts. I think the turning moment between the cleated centre line and the prop thrust (and, initially at least, the forward momentum of the boat) is quite large. Large enough, I suspect, to overwhelm the small effect of the rudder at low speed. In short, I think the situation I describe above with the diagrams more or less pertains whatever direction the rudder is pointing in. Would have to try it to see. We have lots of fenders and are not at all shy about using all of them so I can be quite casual about this!

<edit> Having just written the last sentence: why don't you just fend your stern really well and let it swing out and rest against the other boat in the pen? A well fended "lean" against another boat is not a collision, its a routine move</edit>

 

[doug748]

If I had a boat that went backwards welll, l I would follow the advice and use reverse whenever I could.
Failing that I would improvise your own bow Protector from vee fenders, acrylic fabric and closed cell foam. It would need to be secured to the bow in the area of the anchor fairlead and have long lines taken back to the region of the shrouds.
Motor in against the head of the berth, adjust throttle and helm, and step ashore.
My long pointy bow prevents me from doing this but I believe it would be better than the mid cleat method I now use. It solves the "plan B" dilemma of what to do if you miss the cleat and also the problems of short pontoons and loop ends.
You might feel you look a bit daft at first but make it work, and suddenly many boats would be doing the same - a business opportunity for someone!

 

[jonjo]

Failing that I would improvise your own bow Protector from vee fenders, acrylic fabric and closed cell foam... Motor in against the head of the berth, adjust throttle and helm, and step ashore.

It does not work, I have tried. Even at 1kt there is too much inertia to de-accelerate 5 tons of yacht in a 10cm foam crumple zone. Any slower and the wind will take charge.

I also tried with two large dock fenders bolted to the pontoon, similar problems plus at slow speeds you just bounce off.

Driving into a bow fender as part of a departure routine is a useful technique however.