kieronriley
Well-Known Member
does anyone know if i can i copy my old c map chart onto an sd card for my new plotter Thanks. Kieron
C map copy
- Thread starter kieronriley
- Start date
Norman_E
Well-Known Member
Basically its not possible, because its encrypted with a program designed to prevent copying. If you could copy chart cards there would be cheap knock offs all over ebay.
AntarcticPilot
Well-Known Member
+1. Also, different makes of plotter use different data formats, and the formats are not publicly available. There is a corpus of work reverse-engineering Garmin's data format, but not for other manufacturers; Garmins' is only available because they sell into a range of much larger markets than yachting (e.g. motoring, hill-walking), and there is a large enough body of special interest users to make it worthwhile.
Refueler
Well-Known Member
If you have access to an old DOS machine there are old utility programs that actually create an exact copy disk to disk ....
I can remember 'seeing' a 5.25" copied to a 3.5" ....... that 3.5" when put in the slot - showed itself as a 5.25" size and content.
No I cannot pass on such utilities !
Lucy52
Well-Known Member
"rawwrite" should do it but that doesn't mean it will work in another plotter.
AntarcticPilot
Well-Known Member
I'm not sure, but the original C-map chart the OP has may be on a "special" card, which incorporates hardware copy protection. This was certainly the case for the original C-map chart I had on my C80 plotter (CF format, I think, but needed a specific PC adapter to be used in other machines) - upgrades did away with that requirement.
If I were looking for such utilities, I'd look on a Unix type OS such as Ubuntu!
Mistroma
Well-Known Member
I know that hardware copy protection was part of the specification for SD cards. I don't think that was the case for CF cards but the ones with C-Map were designed to be difficult to copy.
Refueler
Well-Known Member
Find it hard to believe Hardware CP for any SD Card normal, mini or micro. But a CF card being physically much larger I can believe.
But I can say that I have cloned CF cards that were supposed to be impossible - for my own back-ups. The problem is though - you have two cards with same ID coding. Second - I( will not pass on how here or via PM.
Just for the thread .... and I do not recc'd it ... but various chart card formats can be reset ... a particular chart format ... you can take an old card that works and then delete ONLY the chart files, taking care not to touch system files on the card ... then copy across another areas files to the card ... it will work. The protection looks for the 'CP code' embedded in the card. Formatting will destroy that coding.
Mistroma
Well-Known Member
I was remembering things from somewhere around 2010-2013 but did a quick check. Although inclusion of the copy protection feature was mandatory it became optional in 2018. It was rarely used and I had missed the announcement of the change 3 years ago.
You can find some information here: Content Protection | SD Association
I still don't remember CF-cards having hardware copy protection as part of the specification and it makes sense that they might be easier to copy. I only say might as the SD CPRM wasn't used very much and it's possible that any protection used a similar method to a CF card. I think it was quite expensive to use the SD CPRM option.
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Zing
Well-Known Member
A common problem. No one has cracked it yet I believe.
AntarcticPilot
Well-Known Member
All I know is that the ORIGINAL CF card on which the charts for my C80 came (in 2007) also came with a strong warning that any attempt to use it in a card reader other than the supplied one would result in it being destroyed. This was obviously removed at a later date, when updates would no longer fit on the original CF card, requiring the use of third party cards.
I think Navionics used a custom card with non-standard innards. I don't know the nature of the non-standard modifications; I suspect it was probably something very simple and easily circumvented if you knew what it was; perhaps a required voltage on an unused address line.
Updates on a standard CF card obviously included software DRM.
JumbleDuck
Well-Known Member
There were some SD (I think) cards for plotters which had a different pin-out from usual and were destroyed if you even put them in a normal reader ...
Mistroma
Well-Known Member
I agree that the CF cards had protection but I suspect it wasn't based on modified hardware. I could be wrong but think it was software based as I said already. They wouldn't advertise a simple hardware mod. and that would explain lack of documentation. I still think a software approach would be more cost effective.
Having said that, I vaguely remember modified floppies that might have had holes punched/marked with a laser to generate specific errors. I never found out if that was true but they were copied by simply using interrupts to catch the code after loading and decrypting (it was self-modifying). So physical modification to the storage medium wasn't unheard of, even when dinosaurs ruled the earth. Still not fool proof though for many reasons.
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AntarcticPilot
Well-Known Member
If it was software based, why the warning that using a card reader other than the one supplied would destroy the card?I agree that the CF cards had protection but I suspect it wasn't based on modified hardware. I could be wrong but think it was software based as I said already. They wouldn't advertise a simple hardware mod. and that would explain lack of documentation. I still think a software approach would be more cost effective.
Having said that, I vaguely remember modified floppies that might have had holes punched/marked with a laser to generate specific errors. I never found out if that was true but they were copied by simply using interrupts to catch the code after loading and decrypting (it was self-modifying). So physical modification to the storage medium wasn't unheard of, even when dinosaurs ruled the earth.
Mistroma
Well-Known Member
Sorry, I was talking about the CF card. I imagine they could modify a reader more cheaply. But hardware mod. not ruled out as I said, just less likely. I still don't remember hardware copy protection being part of the specification for CF cards, only for SD cards. But it was a long time in the past and I lost interest in that level of detail decades ago (& moved to completely different things at similar level of detail).
Graham376
Well-Known Member
I used to have a C Map card reader for use with computer, no other cards could be read in it. IIRC they use a different format and the reader was specific to that.
Refueler
Well-Known Member
Years ago - I worked with an ex Professor of Computer Tech ..... he laughed at the brands claims of 'possible' malfunction / damage of any cards in non brand readers. As he said - its not reading that can do any damage - its WRITING to them. His argument was based on the format used to write ... some formats did not trigger need to format card first.
Having worked in Saudi for 5 years - CR was technically in force there - but in practice never exacted. I have shoe boxes full of discs of some of the most serious protected programs all copied using the old DOS utilities. Regardless of format system .. they would take the raw data of the original card and write exactly same to the receiving card. Even if the receiving card was not same size - as long as it was at least as big as or larger capacity - it would recreate an identical copy.