Buckingham 20 restoration, formerly Plant Pot

[Greg2]

Re: The plant pot

Like your battery mount....very neat. Not sure it will comply with Boat Safety on inland waterways though. Think it needs to be a vented box.

 

[waynes world]

Re: The plant pot

Like your battery mount....very neat. Not sure it will comply with Boat Safety on inland waterways though. Think it needs to be a vented box.

Details here for the BSS needed for batteries.

The below deck area will be vented either side and the batteries will be sealed also.

Another thing is I will be fitting a bilge blower which will help and to keep the bilges dry.


*
3.1.1*
*
Are*all*unsealed*or*open‐vented*batteries*ventilated*to*prevent*risk*of*explosion*through* hydrogen*accumulation?*
R*
*
Identify*the*location*of*all*batteries.*
*
If*batteries*are*stored*within*an*engine,*accommodation*or*other*non‐* dedicated*battery*space,*check*that*the*space*is*ventilated.*
*
If*batteries*are*stored*within*a*dedicated*battery*space*or*box:*
*
• check*if*the*space*or*box*has*any*ventilation;*and,*
*
• check*the*height*of*the*ventilation*provision*and*the*route*of* any*ducted*ventilation.*
*
Check*the*ventilation*pathway*from*all*battery*storage*locations* leads*to*the*outside*of*the*hull*or*superstructure.*
All*unsealed*or*open‐vented*batteries*must* be*stored*within*a*ventilated*space.*
*
Dedicated*battery*spaces*or*boxes*for* unsealed*or*open‐vented*batteries*must* be*ventilated*at*the*top*or*the*highest* point*of*the*sides*of*the*space*or*box* and*any*ductwork*used*must*run* horizontally*or*upwards.*
*
The*ventilation*pathway*from*all*battery* storage*locations*must*lead*to*the* outside*of*the*hull*or*superstructure.*
NOTE*‐*if*batteries*of*a*‘sealed’*type*are*stored*in*a*non‐ventilated*space*verify*that*storage*in* unventilated*spaces*meets*with*the*battery*manufacturer’s*recommendations*by*reference*to*presented* documentation*from*the*manufacturer.*
*
NOTE*–*ventilation*pathways*into*accommodation*spaces*having*fixed*high‐level*ventilation*or*into*canopied* areas*are*acceptable.*
*
NOTE*–*battery*covers*must*not*allow*the*accumulation*of*hydrogen*gas.*
*
Advice*for*owners*–*in*the*event*that*no*ventilation*provision*is*identified*for*unsealed*or*open‐vented* batteries*this*may*be*calculated*using*the*following*formula.**Ventilation*(mm2)*=*number*of*cells*x*capacity* in*Ah*x*1.935.*Supplementary*guidance*is*given*at*Appendix*G.*
*
Advice*for*owners*–*if*any*batteries*are*connected*to*an*alternator,*or*alternative*battery*charging*source,* having*a*maximum*charge*rate*in*excess*of*2kW*(approx.*150*Amps*at*13.8*volts)*it*is*strongly*recommended* to*install*a*fan‐assisted*ducted*ventilation*system.**Fan‐assisted*ducted*ventilation*should*be*installed*with* the*fan*motor*placed*external*to*the*duct*and*battery*space.**The*fan*should*operate*automatically*during* charging*and*the*safe*operation*of*the*facility*should*be*checked*by*a*competent*person*on*a*routine*basis.*

 

[Momac]

Re: The plant pot

I can confirm a sealed type (internally vented) battery in an unvented space is acceptable to the BSS.
I have a sealed battery in an unvented space for my bow thruster. The boat was supplied new with a standard type battery for the bow thruster and at least two BSS surveyors must have overlooked it.

My engine/domestics are in the engine bay , which does have blowers together with air supply vents - and that passes too. So your design, in terms of ventilation, looks good.
I am not sure a bilge blower will do anything for keeping the bilge dry

Excellent thread . I have been quietly keeping up.

 

[waynes world]

Re: The plant pot

I am at one of them stages when I feel I am getting somewhere again:encouragement:

A days or so ago I checked out the cold water system was running ok and no leaks etc etc. Only the cold water as I have still yet to get a water heater and we are a while of that yet. Still on deciding which to get still.

I have not yet fitted a work top so all I did was connect the taps to the Galley and heads to try it out/I left it under pressure for a while to see if there was any leaks then turned on the taps. All fine and works a treat but for one of the taps I got for some reason is not letting water through. Not to mind as i go two the same by mistake.

The water tanks fill well maybe a little slow to fill the second tank as I was told it would be. By time the first is full the second takes a minute or two to level out. I know i should have fitted 28mm pipe to balance the tanks but when i ordered them it was to late. I will either put up with 7 minutes to fill the two 75l tanks or fit another 15mm balance pipe.

I can either do that or change the balance pipe to 22mm or 28mm and use T reducers for the 15mm system.

The Gulper 220 pump is all good to drain the system, This will also be used as the shower drain. I have fitted two separate shut of taps for when I want to drain the shower or system.

Sorry no pics of that but they will come when i get them.


I ran out of expanding foam but for the Wicks own which I have had lying around for a while. I dont really want to use this as it is not, as far as I know, closed cell. I have been using Soudal gun grade which is. All that needs to be done is a few feet under each gunnel. Just me being picky i guess.


Mean while, the frame work for the seating/berths.

Using 32mmx18mm planed timber and 9mm harwood ply I set to work today.

I had a clean out as it was getting messy in there.

A quick trail to work out how its going to roughly be.

The birth length is just over six foot long.

All is screwed down but will be glued also when i am happy with it all.

As said 9mm hardwood ply was used on top. The side will be Sapele 4mm veneered ply with courtesy lights towards the bottom.

Tomorrows job is to cut out the lockers and do the storage cupboard/water heater cupboard.

There is space is for a cool box ( where the grey step is in the pic at the bottom ) as I do not think there is a need for a fridge. Saying that just in case I have made it big enough for one to fit ( 500mm wide ) if we decide to get one in the future. There is 12v power there and also gas for it from the cabin heater which will be at the bottom of the cupboard.

Oh yes there is a 250mm space between the seating and cooker which will be more storage and a fold down work top for when more space is needed.

Well then, getting there on the interior. I am tempted to go and collect the sand blaster I got a week or so ago so when I get a nice weekend I can then give it a go on the hull. If I dont then it will not be here until the first week of June.

 

[sarabande]

Re: The plant pot

Yhose bunk bases.... A few (well, quite a lot of holes might be a good idea, to let air circulate under the mattresses to prevent condensation.


How are you accessing the lockers underneath ? From the top, or from the side ? If side, then lift out doors might be better, as bottom or top hinged will make it almost impossible to stand in the cabin and access the locker space.


The boat is unrecognisable (in the nicest possible way ) from the time you collected it. I hope the refurb is giving you as much pleasure as it is us.

Did you fix the insurance OK ?



Oh yes, Dry bilges. I agree about the blower not being certain. Essential to provide a welcoming sniff test whenever you come aboard. A blower is ok to remove gas fumes, but making sure that there's air circulating from the bottom of the bilge to the outside can be done by a 63mm caravan heating pipe (cheapy stuff ) to a ventilator unit. Permanent air on the move at no cost.

 

[vas]

Re: The plant pot

W,

how are you securing the horizontal pieces of timber on the hull sides?
I mean there's the grp hull, foam, ply (don't remember how thick!) and then the beam butts on there??? doesn't seem particularly secure tbh, am I missing something?

Looking fwrd to lining and finishing trim around the windows, that will make the interior look really great!

cheers

V.

 

[waynes world]

Re: The plant pot

Yhose bunk bases.... A few (well, quite a lot of holes might be a good idea, to let air circulate under the mattresses to prevent condensation.


How are you accessing the lockers underneath ? From the top, or from the side ? If side, then lift out doors might be better, as bottom or top hinged will make it almost impossible to stand in the cabin and access the locker space.


The boat is unrecognisable (in the nicest possible way ) from the time you collected it. I hope the refurb is giving you as much pleasure as it is us.

Did you fix the insurance OK ?



Oh yes, Dry bilges. I agree about the blower not being certain. Essential to provide a welcoming sniff test whenever you come aboard. A blower is ok to remove gas fumes, but making sure that there's air circulating from the bottom of the bilge to the outside can be done by a 63mm caravan heating pipe (cheapy stuff ) to a ventilator unit. Permanent air on the move at no cost.

I was thinking a perforated ply I found a while ago which stands off about 12mm from the base. I am at the minute trying to find it. It would make it easier if i actually saved things on my laptop.

I am planing on top access for the berth lockers. Nice and easy. The lockers will have a few vents for air circulation as the cabin bilge has openings either end fro free air flow.

I got a quote from Jo at a value of £4k while under construction. Not to bad at £86.

Like the idea of the caravan heater pipe to help ventilation, will look into that. The bilg blower is just to help the air flow really. Can only help.

The rear bilge has good ventilation and as soon as I fit more vents it will be better and when I fit the caravan vent pipes

W,

how are you securing the horizontal pieces of timber on the hull sides?
I mean there's the grp hull, foam, ply (don't remember how thick!) and then the beam butts on there??? doesn't seem particularly secure tbh, am I missing something?

Looking fwrd to lining and finishing trim around the windows, that will make the interior look really great!

cheers

V.

Hi V

The sides are 6mm ply and the pic you chose was the mock up. The horizontal pieces are screwdthrough to side battens which are glued to the ply sides.

See the next pic down.

 

[waynes world]

Re: The plant pot

Forgot to ask V.

What do you use to stick down your Leatherette down ? A good 2pk adhesive ? I have used spray glue in the past but not the best to use.

 

[vas]

Re: The plant pot

Forgot to ask V.

What do you use to stick down your Leatherette down ? A good 2pk adhesive ? I have used spray glue in the past but not the best to use.

well that's the point, I'm following the system used in the 70s and leatherette is stapled on the ply after stapling a 3-5mm thick foam, so it's soft to the touch (and a blunt object wont make a mess of the panel- there's no escape if a sharp object hits it though...)

However that means the panel is at your hands, and you staple at the back.
Then you have to devise a way to hang/hook/screw the panel in place. I've used hook and sliding in place.
On the bulkheads, I just stapled with a nice handgun that can reach 2-3mm from the edge and then used a quarter circle trim approx 10mm across to cover the staples. Don't try with an electric or compressed air stapling gun they are way too bulky and wont let you go close to the corner.
BTW, if you have only one corner you can make a fold on the second side: staple the first side, then start by stapling the second side the wrong way round as if the leatherette was going upside down towards the already upholstered side. Then fit a thin strip of ply to push the leatherette to the corner and staple it in place. Then stretch the leatherette over this piece of ply and to the right direction to finish off the job. Difficult to describe, not easy to do, but definitely doable and creates a soft feel that hides all imperfections underneath. No glue whatsoever anywhere!
I must have used at least 40m of leatherette in MiToS and still counting...

cheers

V.

 

[waynes world]

Re: The plant pot

I like that idea V. Be a bit much for this wee boat with all the extra weight high up. Need to keep it down now a bit. I know its not a lot more weight.

I am going to mooch on a few DIY camper van forums and see what adhesives they are using for there linings.

 

[waynes world]

Re: The plant pot

I managed to get a little more done today. Besides trying to decide where to put the cabin heater I cut the seat lockers out to the best of my ability with a jigsaw.

As there are four lids the same I made a template for them.

I like these Boring bits for this job, but to get a better center hold at first ( aswell as i cnat see where the point is properly ) a small pilot hole does the trick.

As always when drilling with this type of drill bit go halfway through then the go through the other side. Saves busting out the other side and making a mess of a neat hole.

As the sides are curved I used a batten to help the jigsaw stay straight. I am not the best at free hand.

And hey ho

Oh yes here you can see I got a bit giddy again with the expanding foam.

Here is the cupboard and where the water heater will be going and cabin heater which is in the pic. A Propex HS2000.

I was going to fit the Propex in the bottom right of the cupboard but as there will be a cool bow/fridge there it will be a faff to do any maintenance, not just that but the exhaust and combustion pipes need to be a minimum of .75m long ( supplied in 1.2m lengths )

It will be dead space at the back right corner now as the Propex will be housed as in pic. The water heater if I still get the Morco F-11 ( considering the Propex Malaga, this will need to down low though due to the water stored in the unit ) is going in the top right and the rest of the cupboard will be storage.

I lie the Morco F-11 as it is room sealed and instant water and can have the flue horizontal so it can go to the side or forward through the sloping part of the cabin top.

I didnt manage to glue all the timber in place so thats the next job for this week after work.

 

[Bigplumbs]

Re: The plant pot

Lovely work as usual. You look like you are now on the fun part of the project

Dennis

 

[waynes world]

Re: The plant pot

Lovely work as usual. You look like you are now on the fun part of the project

Dennis

Hi Dennis, yep this is the more enjoyable part. Just to think in a month or so it will be fully lined out with carpet and galley lined.........hang on steady on lad.

Trying to cut back on funds ( got carried away with a few things ) and with the canopy costing so much there is a debate if to get one yet or not and make our own rear deck cover, thing is i can see if we dont get one now we never will.

decision decisions.

 

[Bouba]

Re: The plant pot

Hi Dennis, yep this is the more enjoyable part. Just to think in a month or so it will be fully lined out with carpet and galley lined.........hang on steady on lad.

Trying to cut back on funds ( got carried away with a few things ) and with the canopy costing so much there is a debate if to get one yet or not and make our own rear deck cover, thing is i can see if we dont get one now we never will.

decision decisions.

I'd be disappointed if you don't make the canopy yourself :encouragement:

 

[longjohnsilver]

Re: The plant pot

I'd be disappointed if you don't make the canopy yourself :encouragement:

Agreed. I believe jfm is a bit of a whiz with a sewing machine (amongst many other skills) so maybe he can provide a few pointers.

 

[waynes world]

Re: The plant pot

I'd be disappointed if you don't make the canopy yourself :encouragement:

Agreed. I believe jfm is a bit of a whiz with a sewing machine (amongst many other skills) so maybe he can provide a few pointers.

Come on guys, dont do this to me please :ambivalence:. I have looked into how they are made and a lot goes into them, when they are not done properly I honestly think they look a mess with all the crinkles and such. And get the size spot on so the zips actually pull tight.

Its not the sewing part it is the measuring of the canvas. Yes but then it is the sewing par to get it spot on......see if am a faffer already just thinking about it.

Sewing machine is another thing. We have one but not an industrial type, a few folk say we need an Overlocker ? Think thats what they call it.

All to early for this, need another coffee lol

 

[sarabande]

Re: The plant pot

re Sewing machine. You don't need an overlocker.

Loads of old steel framed machines around on the market. With all the potential sewing jobs onboard, it would be really useful to have one in the armoury. I bought a Husqvarna for £45 from the local sewing machine shop sometime ago. Built like a tank. The shop owner says that they are often taken in PX for a wizzy plastic electronic machine.

It needs straight stitch with adjustable length, and zig-zag. A walking foot is a useful extra. That's all.

I guess it takes about 10 hours experience to be make decent canvas work, including hoods, berth covers, curtains, blah blah everything.

And given your level of practical skills you would find it a fascinating area in which to save money.

If you can find a book by Don Casey called Canvas Work and Sail Repair, that takes you through the whole process.

 

[Bouba]

Re: The plant pot

Even if you did buy an overlocker it's less than 200 pounds. Take lots of pictures so we have a good reference for when we have a go. I'm already looking forward to it

 

[waynes world]

Re: The plant pot

Ok then, whilst cruising around today I have thought about it again and as you know I like a challenge I will give it a go and make my own canopy.

We have this machine at the minute

http://www.hobbycraft.co.uk/brother-ls14-sewing-machine/561344-1000

Not exactly heavy weight. I`ll give it a try on some samples when I decide what materials to try. I have read Top gun and Sunbrella are good but have pro`s and con`s as most things. If it cant cope with the amount of folds and zips etc a new machine will be bought.

This is going to be a project in itself, and infact looking forward to it.

I will research on the best frame work to go for, single hoop is best for my needs I think, mainly as the companies i spoke said that will be fine. will look into though a bit more now I am making my own.


So if anyone has suggestion on materials for the canopy pro`s and con`s please tell

 

[sorabain]

Re: The plant pot

At this rate you'll be building hull form plugs for your own fibreglass boats entirely from scratch in a few years.