pvb
Well-Known Member
I think the Broads are rather over-rated. Not my choice of a destination.
Broads access
- Thread starter Portland Billy
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Slowboat35
Well-Known Member
Fred, firstly the OP quite clearly isn't the "everyone" I was referring to and an overnight at the RNSYC isn't even entering the Broads at all, is it? Unsure of the relevance of that.
Even in his 'seaine s41' he still has three bridges, one on a fixed schedule and a lock to negotiate which is a great deal more than two bridges operating as one at GY.
But each to their own.
snowbird30ds
Well-Known Member
I always find gy more convenient but have the benefit of being a stinkie and able to pass under haven at half tide or lower.
Plum
Well-Known Member
Yes, that's what I do too (airdraft 2.5m but usually allow 3m) which means not having to prebook or worry about bridge lift breakdowns. Great Yarmouth is my preferred gateway.
Www.solocoastalsailing.co.uk
fred247
Well-Known Member
slowboat 35 you obviously haven't been in a while Haven Bridge was out of action for several months last year trapping boats on either side, major repair works starting this week, and the new third crossing at GY means three bridges to negotiate going forward .
miss a bridge lift at Yarmouth and its a 24hr wait at best, miss one at lowestoft and the next is three hours, with waiting pontoons or a night in RNSYC
miss a bridge lift at Yarmouth and its a 24hr wait at best, miss one at lowestoft and the next is three hours, with waiting pontoons or a night in RNSYC
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Slowboat35
Well-Known Member
Missing GY bridges would be a pain but it's the same 24hr delay if you miss your booking at Oulton lock! Nor can one assume that the Haven bridge is the only one in the system likely to breaking down. Indeed I'd always understood that the ropiest of them all were Somerleyton and the Oulton railway swing bridges. No one can predict which will go next. All you can predict is that one will - and its less likely to be the soon to be revamped GY one!
You've also not mentioned the 3rd crossing at Lowestoft that will probably affect leisure traffic worse than Gt Yarmouth's during build as there is next to no commercial traffic requiring regular passage and both will affect us equally when finished - be you going forward or astern.
What happens with your lock booking if the railway bridge delays you substantially as it must sometimes do when trains are off schedule- do the council functionaries hang around and wait? The only time I saw it in action they were very impatient to clear off back to whatever much better things they clearly had in mind to be doing. Or do you just have to allow a sufficient time- buffer?
There are going to be interesting conflictions at both with regard to simultaneous inbound and outbound traffic requiring to pass both/all bridges. How will they manage that? Double openings fifteen minutes apart? They surely can't have both bridges up for the time it takes to transit between them. Either would be devastating for road traffic.
The "waiting pontoon" at Lowestoft, aka the floating guano storage facility is of hazardous use at low tide (when most sailing boats arrive) if they're over 1,5 m draft unless they want to sit five metres off it and wait for the tide to rise again...and maybe miss the bridge to boot.
Or have they finally got round to dredging it? I was told they never would do that corner as it "wasn't commercial".
As I said earlier, each to their own.
Greemble
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LittleSister
Well-Known Member
I am not arguing for one thing or another, but the following may be of help to someone.
Leisure vessels can moor up at the Great Yarmouth Town Quay (on the east side of the river, just below the Haven Bridge, adjacent to the Town Hall and the (green) Lydia Eva steam drifter/trawler). This is not used by large commercial craft (occasionally smaller wind-farm crew vessels moor immediately downstream). Whether this counts as 'easy' is debatable. The quay wall has projecting vertical wooden bulwarks, which without a fender board can be a challenge. There is a significant rise and fall of tide, and lines are likely to need adjusting as it does so, and the tidal current is quite strong there. There are ladders to climb the wall, and rings and bollards to tie to. There is occasional moderate wash from the RIB Lifeboat rushing under the bridge if there's an incident in the Broads, or from motorboats going through/under the bridge against a strong tide. There is, in theory, a charge for using the Town Quay, but I'm not sure anybody ever bothers to collect it. There are no facilities, but there are publicly accessible toilets in the Town Hall during weekday office hours, and the town centre is just a couple of hundred yards away. (There are numerous museums* and interesting attractions (including the Lydia Eva - highly recommended) within a few hundred yards, although the town as a whole is down on its uppers.)
I believe that the previous refurbishment of Haven Bridge was to repair the failing traffic deck, not the lifting mechanism.
I believe Haven Bridge is now operated by Peel Ports, who are now the harbour authority for GY. Bridge lifts have to be booked by the previous working day, office hours only. No booking weekends or bank holidays, but the bridge does lift on such days. It is not limited to one lift per day, and lifts are coordinated with the lifting of Breydon Bridge, just a little further upstream on the River Yare. On a visit a few years ago, having been unaware of the need to book a lift in advance, I was unable to contact GY Harbourmaster's Office by either phone or VHF (this may have been a one off, or have improved since Peel Ports took over the harbour (they're generally more on the ball than their predecessors), but Broads Control (01603 756056, VHF channel 12 or email Broads.control@broads-authority.gov.uk ) knew what bridge lift times had been previously booked.
It will be some years before the new 'Third River Crossing' bridge on the Yare in Great Yarmouth is completed. I believe it is intended there will be waiting pontoons (not connected to the shore) either side of that new bridge.
I believe that the railway bridges over the Broads rivers are operated by Network Rail staff, not the Broads Authority. All those bridges are very old, and so unreliable, and Network Rail are not very interested in making their hugely expensive replacements a priority.
[* Nelson Museum and Elizabethan House Museum just across the road from the Town Quay; Tolhouse Museum (old prison - earliest municipal building in England?) next street away from the river - another 100yds; Time and Tide Museum about 1/4 mile SE from Town Quay; Nelson's Monument, about 1km south of the Town Quay (like the one in Trafalgar Square, but if you check opening times you can climb the 217 steps inside to the top.]
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Simi
Well-Known Member
LittleSister I think you are incorrect Haven bridge will lift 7 days a week when not broken down Peel ports get paid a substantial sum to operate the bridge and during the last season have got away with very few lifts
Greemble
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All useful stuff!
I'm under the impression that both new 3rd Crossings will be operational around the same time.
Yes, the Railway bridges are operated by Network Rail and even though the company is trying not to get them properly operational (expensive even if it is older, heavy ironwork tech), they are still under a legal obligation to ensure river traffic can get through.
It's the Lock that's under the remit of the BA, the road bridge is operated on behalf of the council, by Sentinel Leisure employees.
LittleSister
Well-Known Member
That's what I said!
But bookings (not lifts) will only be taken on weekdays office hours. If you want a lift on a Sunday or Bank Holiday Monday, you need to book it by the previous Friday, during office hours.
From Peel Ports (Great Yarmouth) website - 'Bridge bookings can be made during office hours on 01493 335522. Lifts for weekends should be booked by 16:00 on Friday or on the previous working day in the case of Public Holidays.'
More info here - https://www.peelports.com/media/4198/visiting-small-craft-information-sheet-march2017-1.pdf
Slowboat35
Well-Known Member
By far the easiest (and, imo useful) place to moor in GY is alongside Lydya Eva. Her bulwarks have steel railings above them and the stanchions offer perfect attachments at the ideal height. You couldn't possibly damage her with a yacht!
If doing so they'll much appreciate the (hopefully generous) donation you slip through under the wheelhouse door with a note of thanks.
That way everyone benefits.
If doing so they'll much appreciate the (hopefully generous) donation you slip through under the wheelhouse door with a note of thanks.
That way everyone benefits.
Greg2
Well-Known Member
A variety of opinions here! ?
My tuppence worth......
We are Broads based and do regular coastal cruises and are very familiar with both Gt Y and Lowestoft access to / from sea. Noting that the OP is coming from the Thames my recommendation would be to aim for Lowestoft and a night at the Royal Norfolk & Suffolk Yacht Club. Access at all states of tide, plenty of visitor moorings, a lovely club house with good beer and food and it takes all the angst out of passage planning to meet a fixed bridge lift time. What’s not to like?
From there it is an easy hop seven miles up the coast to Gt Y for a booked bridge lift or alternatively going in via Mutford Lock. Bascule bridge has plenty of lifts during the day and the lock and rail bridge swing (if required) are easily booked.
An S41 might get under the bridges at Gt Y to head for the northern rivers but only on LW springs would be my guess. They put some timber on the underside of the bridges that reduced the clearance a few years ago. Worth saying that whilst it is nice up there the number of hire boats is significantly higher than the southern rivers and getting bashed into is virtually guaranteed. We haven’t been up there for years for that reason and becasue of the bridge clearance challenges. I would also say that we would never consider a night at Town Quay in Gt Y - moorings not great and nothing between you and the local brigandry.
If staying south then I would say go in via Mutford Lock because there ain’t much between Gt Y and Reedham, which is where you reach the Yare from the Waveney via the New Cut but having had access to a lot more places to stay/see. Perhaps leave via Gt Y with the last night being at Reedham or Berney Arms (noting that it isn’t open so need to be self-sufficient) with another stay at RNSYC before heading south. If time permits a night in Southwold is well worth it - highly recommended in fact. Perhaps better done on the way up as tides might not be favourable when leaving to head south.
My tuppence worth......
We are Broads based and do regular coastal cruises and are very familiar with both Gt Y and Lowestoft access to / from sea. Noting that the OP is coming from the Thames my recommendation would be to aim for Lowestoft and a night at the Royal Norfolk & Suffolk Yacht Club. Access at all states of tide, plenty of visitor moorings, a lovely club house with good beer and food and it takes all the angst out of passage planning to meet a fixed bridge lift time. What’s not to like?
From there it is an easy hop seven miles up the coast to Gt Y for a booked bridge lift or alternatively going in via Mutford Lock. Bascule bridge has plenty of lifts during the day and the lock and rail bridge swing (if required) are easily booked.
An S41 might get under the bridges at Gt Y to head for the northern rivers but only on LW springs would be my guess. They put some timber on the underside of the bridges that reduced the clearance a few years ago. Worth saying that whilst it is nice up there the number of hire boats is significantly higher than the southern rivers and getting bashed into is virtually guaranteed. We haven’t been up there for years for that reason and becasue of the bridge clearance challenges. I would also say that we would never consider a night at Town Quay in Gt Y - moorings not great and nothing between you and the local brigandry.
If staying south then I would say go in via Mutford Lock because there ain’t much between Gt Y and Reedham, which is where you reach the Yare from the Waveney via the New Cut but having had access to a lot more places to stay/see. Perhaps leave via Gt Y with the last night being at Reedham or Berney Arms (noting that it isn’t open so need to be self-sufficient) with another stay at RNSYC before heading south. If time permits a night in Southwold is well worth it - highly recommended in fact. Perhaps better done on the way up as tides might not be favourable when leaving to head south.
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Easticks28
Well-Known Member
pvb
Well-Known Member
I quite agree, Nothing to see here . Best to stay away
I had a boat on the Broads for a couple of seasons. There were some pretty bits, but there were also many problems with hire boats (and their crews). I wouldn't ever want to re-visit.
Greg2
Well-Known Member
Hence my comments about never venturing to the Northern rivers - a lot different on the Southern side.
Easticks28
Well-Known Member
We sail on the Northern rivers, 28' with a 'gret ol' bowsprit. Hire boatstend to keep out of the way by and large
pvb
Well-Known Member
There's not a lot on the southern side. We had a season based in Beccles and my wife complained that it was "all going and coming back".
LittleSister
Well-Known Member
I didn't have a problem with hire boats on the Yare and Waveney - there are far fewer of them there than in the northern rivers (Bure, Thurne, Ant, etc.), as Greg2 points out, and hotspots with big hire-boat yards, like Wroxham, Potter Heigham and Stalham are best avoided on Saturdays (changeover day for many).
It's also a completely different world in the winter: much, much quieter, and with its own desolate charm (provided you have heating on your boat!).
Note that the short term licence fees are very expensive relative to the annual licences. (I get the impression that's because all the RYA and other representatives on the Broads Authority's Navigation Committee are local boat owners or hire-boat company people, and have no interest at all in encouraging additional boats to visit.) A Boat Safety Scheme certificate is required for stays over (IIRC) 2 months.
Sadly, many of the riverside pubs around the Broads are fairly dire, or permanently closed, but there's some better ones within a few minutes walk.
On the plus side there are lots of free moorings: Broads Authority moorings (24 hour max per visit to each of them), and others provided by pubs to customers. There's also some interesting places to visit such as the ruins of St. Benet's Abbey and the Roman Fort at Burgh Castle. I found the Broads Authority's Navigation Rangers, Yacht Station Attendants and Broads Control (info & emergency help via phone or VHF) staff helpful and friendly.
Keeping a boat on the Broads wouldn't be my cup of tea, but I did enjoy visiting by yacht (though I wouldn't make it a habit, I wouldn't rule out going again) and I've enjoyed canoeing there numerous times.
Slowboat35
Well-Known Member
The real beauty of the broads is, as Little Sister said, the solitude which usually means out of season but with a bit of care you can overnight on some of the broads in total solitude year round. There are few finer places to spend a night than the dear old Berney Arms, one of the much loved pubs that the Broads Authority has driven out of business by their rapacious over-charging and insane levels of compliance that have made hire boats so dreadfully expensive. Is it any wonder so few people can afford to spend money in them? I know of few boating spots that match the Berney Arms' solitude, peace and vast vistas. (Except when partying hire-boats wreck the ambiance, it has to be admitted)
I've sea-sailed fairly extensively in a broads-based yacht and found the combination of stimulating day-sailing and easy access to the sea a very enjoyable contrast. Eating a leisurely supper as you motor up the river at dusk to yourmooring after a bositerous bash up from the Orwell is one of life's great pleasures.
But why does the Broads Authority seem so keen to deter visitors with those outrageous short-visitripoffs oops! taxes? The Dutch in particular would come in numbers if they weren't so savagely striped for the privilege. What a sad, unnecessary own-goal.
And for the racing types be they serious, funsters or just wanna have a go, the Yare Navigation Race is, imho, well on the way to being sailing UK's Isle of Man TT. No, perhaps more like the Targa Florio or the Mille Miglia? Crazy, quirky, highly competitive at even at a fun level and just plain British unique.
I've sea-sailed fairly extensively in a broads-based yacht and found the combination of stimulating day-sailing and easy access to the sea a very enjoyable contrast. Eating a leisurely supper as you motor up the river at dusk to yourmooring after a bositerous bash up from the Orwell is one of life's great pleasures.
But why does the Broads Authority seem so keen to deter visitors with those outrageous short-visit
And for the racing types be they serious, funsters or just wanna have a go, the Yare Navigation Race is, imho, well on the way to being sailing UK's Isle of Man TT. No, perhaps more like the Targa Florio or the Mille Miglia? Crazy, quirky, highly competitive at even at a fun level and just plain British unique.
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