Boat sinks in Jersey

[Portofino]

Re: Pershing 62 sinks

From the parts I’ve seen,was the hull foam core?

Yup as PYB ^^^ says these days Ferretti Group stuff all 6 ? brands are built in a uniform way using “ modern technology “we are told , and I think we all would do the same if we ran the group too. I,am not being critical just factual - I hope ?

As well as foam core for the hull sides the keel area is Vac bagged too .
The tell take give away is the displacement.
If you compare like for like models Lengh wise ( Ok take any diff in beam into account too ) the modern stuff is miles lighter .somthimg like a 25 to 30 % difference or maybe more .
Resultant propulsion systems are smaller too so € saving s all round .
Vac bagging and coring is quicker ( less labour bill ) you can get them out of the plug faster - so start another - pop em out faster etc .

I suspect the owner was oblivious to the nitty gritty of the build process , let’s face it at a boat show amongst all the glitz n glamour today’s new buyers arn,t interested in the behind scenes stuff - generally , more wowed over by the size of the mid cabin ,or the ice maker or plotter screens etc s - and with a Pershing the relative superiority ,regarding performance of the Arnesons compared with somthing more mundane from Poole or Plymouth

 

[Lower Limit 1909]

Re: Pershing 62 sinks

Bow watertight bulkheads.



Given it's neither 'rocket science' not presumably very expensive to add in the grand scheme of things why do so few boats (and Pershing 62s apparently) not have them?

 

[Portofino]

Re: Pershing 62 sinks

Bow watertight bulkheads.

View attachment 68404

Given it's neither 'rocket science' not presumably very expensive to add in the grand scheme of things why do so few boats (and Pershing 62s apparently) not have them?

It’s not commercially viable , there’s no market pressure from the target audience.
Target audience as said above are more interested in the cantilevered electronically magically disappearing Bang and Olufson mega zillion inch TV in the cockpit ,or the dissapearing patio doors into the floor , the salesperson @ the boat show ,who went to great lengths to point out .

My monies on there was so much up selling of unnecessary tech @ the helm , - multilevel touch screens , all beeping and and just when you ( the driver ) thought he,d “ done one “ another beeped up or flashed —- so eyes down
Two pairs of eyes down tryin to sync the mobile device(s) ( the owner was assured was worth an extra 2k ) to the nav kit , as an example.Or as others have said the preprogrammed route plotter function actually took the boat spot on to the buoy .

Basically the excessive shed load of tech distracted them from basic seamanship .

After all they could not have been adequately “watching “

Pershing will blame the helm , not the boat , and if requested sell an exact replacement in a heartbeat .

Can,t see anytime soon a piece of flat black plastic glued to the bow s of new Pershing s with even more tech nicked from Mercedes Benz - mimicking there distrontic / active cruise control / kinda collision avoidance system - nah !

 

[petem]

Re: Pershing 62 sinks

Bow watertight bulkheads.

View attachment 68404

Given it's neither 'rocket science' not presumably very expensive to add in the grand scheme of things why do so few boats (and Pershing 62s apparently) not have them?

It seems to me (from photos) that the damage to planing hulls that end up with the vessel sinking are often way more extensive than the frontal area that a collision bulkhead would save them from. In fact, for most planing boats that section won't even be in the water for much of the time. And then there's the potential catastrophic damage from having your stern gear ripped out.

 

[ari]

Re: Pershing 62 sinks

Bow watertight bulkheads.

View attachment 68404

Given it's neither 'rocket science' not presumably very expensive to add in the grand scheme of things why do so few boats (and Pershing 62s apparently) not have them?

Simple, because so very few boats crash into things and sink.

 

[Boatbore]

Re: Pershing 62 sinks

If you make a big enough hole or several...........it will sink. Collision bulkhead or no. Look what happened to Leonardo di Caprio and Kate Winslet.......one minute you’re larking about on the bow of a ship, the next you’re fornicating in someone’s car in the hold, and finally you end up floating on a bit of wood with a big diamond in your pocket.......collision bulkheads are over rated !

 

[Bathdave]

Re: Pershing 62 sinks

Update

The skipper has had his commercial licence suspended after an investigation.

https://jerseyeveningpost.com/news/2018/01/22/shipwreck-skippers-licence-is-suspended/

Interesting too that he had managed to keep his name out of the press and social media, although most in the boating community know who he is.

 

[Whitelighter]

Re: Pershing 62 sinks

It looks in remarkable condition for somethings that's been dragged 25km along the sea bed. And as others have said, how can it have had any buoyancy? I smell a rat!

Remarkable condition???

It's got no suoerstrhcture, no windows, all the heavy bits fell out, the back 1/3rd is missing.

It's just a lump of bloody plastic and we keep getting told that stuff last forever (literally)
The only rat you are smelling is the one that pissed in it on the beach

 

[PowerYachtBlog]

Re: Pershing 62 sinks

Damn Jez. Take a military metal truck fill it with a bit of air, and drag to rock at stone under the sea hitting every thing in its course to make down coast 50 nm for about a month.
You might not find nothing left of it.

I think for all that happened it still is in remarkable condition. You would expect that the hull would not be 2/3 intact, considering the trip it made.

I don't know may be you imagined her to wash up in St.Tropez with a full arsenal of Russian blondes offering you champagne, and telling you I am Pershing I can withstand even Jupiter hurricane winds and the vacuum of space....

 

[Whitelighter]

Re: Pershing 62 sinks

Damn Jez. Take a military metal truck fill it with a bit of air, and drag to rock at stone under the sea hitting every thing in its course to make down coast 50 nm for about a month.
You might not find nothing left of it.

I think for all that happened it still is in remarkable condition. You would expect that the hull would not be 2/3 intact, considering the trip it made.

I don't know may be you imagined her to wash up in St.Tropez with a full arsenal of Russian blondes offering you champagne, and telling you I am Pershing I can withstand even Jupiter hurricane winds and the vacuum of space....

I'm not sure how you saw this as me having a pop at the build,

Its foam filled plastic

its unlikely to have dragged across the bottom - more likely once the engines fell out/ripped out/got nicked it had a degree of neutral buoyancy.
Im not surprised its in that condition because plastic (OK GRP) is pretty indestructible, much more so than the flimsy sheet metal truck.

Are you going to say next time a plastic bottle washes up that it in remarkable condition?

 

[Bathdave]

Re: Pershing 62 sinks

Investigation report now published

http://www.ports.je/SiteCollectionDocuments/P6T2 collision and sinking Report - Nov 18.pdf

Doesn't reflect well on skipper ....

 

[Bathdave]

Investigation report just published

http://www.ports.je/SiteCollectionDocuments/P6T2 collision and sinking Report - Nov 18.pdf

Doesn't reflect well on skipper, guess it was 'lucky' it was a buoy he hit rather than another boat

 

[Deleted member 36384]

It reads to me that the skipper, being very experienced and knowledgeable of the area, has treated the departure and subsequent pilotage with a degree of familiarity and relied on that. Clearly got lost, caused by complacency perhaps. The video images at the black are interesting as they show the departure when from late twilight to dark before the collision. As usual it's not just one thing, but a series of things: the displacement speed and high bow, turning to avoid the fishing boat placing himself off track, the brighter than required navigation console, late evening light, looking into the west setting sun sky where the buoy was.

 

[dom]

It reads to me that the skipper, being very experienced and knowledgeable of the area, has treated the departure and subsequent pilotage with a degree of familiarity and relied on that. Clearly got lost, caused by complacency perhaps. The video images at the black are interesting as they show the departure when from late twilight to dark before the collision. As usual it's not just one thing, but a series of things: the displacement speed and high bow, turning to avoid the fishing boat placing himself off track, the brighter than required navigation console, late evening light, looking into the west setting sun sky where the buoy was.

I’m not sure; in fact I wonder if he was well out of his depth:

“The skipper advised that this was his first full darkness sea passage. He had returned to St Helier on two previous occasions in fading light. He also stated that he had made a number of night time passages but on other vessels.”

​

Worse:

“He holds an RYA Commercially Endorsed Yachtmaster Offshore Certificate of Competence (CoC) for power driven craft and sailing vessels fitted with auxiliary engines. The certificate was issued on 2nd August 2004 and revalidated at five year intervals.”
​

Amazing RYA finds such sloppy practices acceptable, can’t imagine a CAA certed pilot coming into Heathrow on his first nightime flight!

 

[RichardS]

Amazing RYA finds such sloppy practices acceptable, can’t imagine a CAA certed pilot coming into Heathrow on his first nightime flight!

I'm not sure what sloppy practice the RYA is finding acceptable?

Richard

 

[capnsensible]

I’m not sure; in fact I wonder if he was well out of his depth:

“The skipper advised that this was his first full darkness sea passage. He had returned to St Helier on two previous occasions in fading light. He also stated that he had made a number of night time passages but on other vessels.”

​

Worse:

“He holds an RYA Commercially Endorsed Yachtmaster Offshore Certificate of Competence (CoC) for power driven craft and sailing vessels fitted with auxiliary engines. The certificate was issued on 2nd August 2004 and revalidated at five year intervals.”
​

Amazing RYA finds such sloppy practices acceptable, can’t imagine a CAA certed pilot coming into Heathrow on his first nightime flight!

Yeah, after all no one in history has taken a driving test and sometime after had a car crash.

 

[dom]

I'm not sure what sloppy practice the RYA is finding acceptable?

Richard

As it’s night exactly 50% of the time (ex twilight for the pedants ) one would think the RYA would make it an integral part of a commercial qulification to captain large offshore vessels. At least I would have!

Imagine a pilot on his final approach thinking, “Golly gumdrops, what do all those colours mean?!”

 

[Praxinoscope]

I must admit to being a bit surprised that the skipper holds a commercially endorsed Yachtmaster Offshore Certificate of Competence when he also advises that this was his ‘first full darkness sea passage’, surely to reach a Commercially endorsed YM he would have been expected to have undertaken several full darkness passages as skipper?

 

[Deleted member 36384]

I’m not sure; in fact I wonder if he was well out of his depth:

“The skipper advised that this was his first full darkness sea passage. He had returned to St Helier on two previous occasions in fading light. He also stated that he had made a number of night time passages but on other vessels.”

​

Worse:

“He holds an RYA Commercially Endorsed Yachtmaster Offshore Certificate of Competence (CoC) for power driven craft and sailing vessels fitted with auxiliary engines. The certificate was issued on 2nd August 2004 and revalidated at five year intervals.”
​

Amazing RYA finds such sloppy practices acceptable, can’t imagine a CAA certed pilot coming into Heathrow on his first nightime flight!

The statement is contradictory. The investigators should have established the facts around his night experience, because clearly he had lost his visual references on a late evening passage. This type of light is well known to confuse perception and reduce contrast compared to full night or full day. Other statements suggests he was familiar with the area. The requirements for the Yachtmaster means he would have had to skipper at night, offshore etc.

I agree with your point though, if this really was his first full night passage, then the process for checking and validating pre assesment in his case could not have been good.

 

[capnsensible]

The pre requisites necessary to being examined for a Yachtmaster Offshore Certificate of Competence are quite explicit on the RYA website. As are the extra requirements to be Commercially Endorsed.

https://www.rya.org.uk/courses-training/exams/Pages/yachtmaster-offshore.aspx

Clearly the Sipper of the boat had demonstrated sufficient capability during his exam to pass and be awarded his certificate of competence. Otherwise he would not have one.

Passing the buck here to the RYA process of training and certification is, in my opinion, bonkers. Who blames the DVLA for car crashes.........