Blue water cruising boat . . .

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NZJohn

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Hi there

My wife and I looking to buy a second hand blue water cruiser. This is not an area we are that experienced in. So we are looking at 37-42 feet that is easily sailed short handed. Speed isn't the highest priority for us and it doesn't need to be in the modern mould of looking like an up-market caravan in the interior. Comfort at sea and safety are our two biggest priorities. Our budget is in the up to £90k range.

Two boats we are looking at are an Oyster Heritage 37 and Trident Warrior 40. Thoughts and opinions on these please? Also other boats we should add to our list.

Thanks in anticipation.
 
Hiya. Are you in NewZealand now? I believe that boats are quite hard to find on the market there? I've seen a lot of yachts being bought up in Greece etc in the Meditteranean and being delivered onwards to their new home over the past few years. Is that your plan?

Personally I have delivered a yacht for an Australian from the Canaries to Pacific Panama and one for a New Zealander from Antigua to Tahiti as part of their plans to slow time get the boat home. My point in mentioning this is that both were Bavaria yachts, one a 44 and the other a 46. Much maligned on here, but I found them highly suitable and capable vessels for long distance and easily handled by a small crew.

I've no experience of the Oyster, but I took a warrior 40 from the Canaries to Antigua and back. Very comfortable but lacked a bit of ventilation in tropical waters. Nice and easy to handle.

Good luck with your search!
 
As far a blue water capabilities are concerned the majority actually sailing are actually the mass produced boats which are designed for comfortable living in warm climates and are entirely capable if sailed to their strengths, but can also be sailed more sportily if you want to.

The boat you want will be far more based on your dream of the kind of boat you would like than the capabilities as boats of all kinds from 18 foot GRP 1960s boats to huge steel ice-breakers are able to do the warm water oceans and bad weather perfectly well. Basically if your image is bashing through storms then that is one kind of boat to meet that image and if your dream is an idyllic island anchorage you will get another type but both will get your across the oceans to get there.
 
NZJohn said:
Just to clarify - NZ'er but long term UK resident and citizen these days
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Understand. Hope someone has experience of the Oyster and responds. The Warrior, I reckon, would certainly fit the bill. In either case, when buying older yachts, it's the engine that needs a lot of care and maintenance....in my experience! That's what always seems to be the weak link.
 
Each to their own....I am in the camp that prefers a moderate AWB for benefits of speed, and interior and exterior comfort, and because I greatly prefer an aft cockpit, and because it's easier to fit an extra couple of crew in whenever you need/want. I reckon the boat can handle anything; it's true that it's harder on the crew in strong winds.

However I did also look carefully at options around what you suggest, and figured that an early 2000s/late 90s Moody would be a good all-round option at the price you indicate If we wanted to look at Oyster, Najad, HalbergRassey then it seemed to me that the price bracket pushes you back by 10-20 twenty years, to boats probably in need of a significantly refit, with kit you struggle to service due to parts availability and to 1970s internal layouts that are a significant step back in terms of comfort. But perhaps you find a good 1990s rather than 1970s example.

Don't forget to look at water and diesel tanks.

Other options? Westerly? Victoria 38 in Guernsey looks excellent?

there's also an interesting Bruce Roberts 45 currently for sale in Bangor? But there seems to be advantage if you (like me) are quite new to boatowning in a production boat. Lots of fellow-owners around and lots of experience to share. If I was buying a one-off I would be test-sailing...imagine if you whack 90k down on a pig that turns out to have intolerable weather or Lee helm.
 
Would your budget stretch to a Malo? The 36’s are sub-£90k, might the slightly larger ones be within budget, post-offer? I read an old article by Nigel Calder on why he picked one as a blue water yacht - it all sounded well thought through.
 
I have a Heritage 37(not the one for sale)! My wife and I have not been blue water but we have cruised her from the East Coast to South Brittany, NW Scotland and the Netherlands so write with some experience. Also you can grasp the feel of the yacht by following the blog of the "Florence".
A competent, comfortable but a little unexciting sailing performance. We seem to be usually going at 5.8 to 6.2 knots whatever the wind above f2. Will occasionally slam upwind in a blow and with
about 5ft. draft makes some leeway. Against that tracks steadily downwind, is dry with a very comfortable motion. Self steering may struggle in gusts on a broad reach.
A 35 hp.motor gives sufficient power to motor into a strong headwind. Steerage astern is challenging.
Accommodation for 2 for a long voyage is comfortable although storage is a bit limited. Workable galley for use in seaway.
Easily worked sail plan. Very strongly built.
Unlike the HR and Moody no attempt was made to cram the accommodation by having a cabin under the cockpit floor so it is deep and safe. Spacious heads.
With thorough preparation (and if not in my 80s!) I would not hesitate to take her blue water cruising.
I hope I have given a balanced opinion for you.
 
I concur here with some of the comments regarding an AWB (Average White Boat) being more than capable but of course you have to ensure that all the rigging etc is all good (as in any boat) and be aware that if you are caught out in really bad weather (which can be mostly avoided with decent planning and technology, bet even that is not infallible) a classic "blue water boat'" will fare better.

Things like fuel tanks and water tanks are important but can be mitigated (extra fuel cans/water maker).

But, you have to work out how much time you actually spend sailing vs how much at anchor, coast hopping, in a marina etc, as that is where an AWB will easily trump a blue water boat.

Anyway, as this is YBW I am pretty sure this thread will soon descend into an argument!
 
Coopec - Yeah Hans Christians are kind of a Marmite boat. I'm pretty neutral but a friend who is a professional sailing instructor loves them - especially the canoe stern in a following sea
 
Thanks for all the replys ! Very helpful - keep-em coming.

Kurrawong_Kid. Thank you for you views on OH - they seem ot be boat - apart from the srorage issuse that people speak highly of. Did you have any issues re the ingress of water the rudder?
 
NZJohn said:
Coopec - Yeah Hans Christians are kind of a Marmite boat. I'm pretty neutral but a friend who is a professional sailing instructor loves them - especially the canoe stern in a following sea
Click to expand...
Though some long term cruisers prefer a decent size lazarette and big transom so instead of cutting into the waves it has so much buoyancy aft it rides over them, istr Moitessier changed his tune on this on a later boat.
 
capnsensible said:
Hiya. Are you in NewZealand now? I believe that boats are quite hard to find on the market there? I've seen a lot of yachts being bought up in Greece etc in the Meditteranean and being delivered onwards to their new home over the past few years. Is that your plan?

Personally I have delivered a yacht for an Australian from the Canaries to Pacific Panama and one for a New Zealander from Antigua to Tahiti as part of their plans to slow time get the boat home. My point in mentioning this is that both were Bavaria yachts, one a 44 and the other a 46. Much maligned on here, but I found them highly suitable and capable vessels for long distance and easily handled by a small crew.

I've no experience of the Oyster, but I took a warrior 40 from the Canaries to Antigua and back. Very comfortable but lacked a bit of ventilation in tropical waters. Nice and easy to handle.

Good luck with your search!
Click to expand...

I always find your posts interesting as you have actually done it rather than armchair sailors like me..... ?

However I am interested to know your thoughts about this opinion at smaller sizes. Your Moody 33 has a displacement of 4763kg according to sailboat data. A Bavaria 32 from 2000 has a displacement of 3750kg.

So I wonder if the AWB argument makes less difference as the size increases as a bigger boat will probably be easier in bad weather?

Sorry to the op for a bit of thread hijack!
 
NZJohn said:
Coopec - Yeah Hans Christians are kind of a Marmite boat. I'm pretty neutral but a friend who is a professional sailing instructor loves them - especially the canoe stern in a following sea
Click to expand...
I think the canoe stern in following seas argument is a bit of a myth. There are so many other factors that make a seaworthy boat that a canoe stern alone is a tiny aspect. I have never seen any evidence that a canoe stern is a must have detail on a bluewater boat
 
NZJohn said:
..............and it doesn't need to be in the modern mould of looking like an up-market caravan in the interior.
Click to expand...

Surely no one would want the comfort and convenience of a modern boat. ?

When you’ve found your ideal boat, don’t forget to add a budget for a replacement windlass, winches, clutches and other deck hardware, cooker, fridge, freezer, upholstery, headlining, heads, sink, electrics, electronics, batteries, engine, gearbox, stern gear, rudder bearing, steering gear, running rigging, standing rigging, mainsail, headsail, off-wind sails, sandpaper, varnish, disinfectant, bleach and a ton of air fresheners to try to neutralise the nasty smells below deck ?
RJJ said:
No it won't
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Oh yes it will ? (cabin fever - but at least it’s big, bright and airy) ?
 
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