Anchors

[Refueler]

At least they didn't include CQR, that's progress as far as I'm concerned. Now if we can get them removed from all the RYA materials and supporting books we may finally be rid of them!

Well forgive me for saying that the CQR / Plough Anchor design has proven its worth for many years and still does. My Holdfast Plough is still my main anchor at 20lb and holds my 4 ton motor sailer nicely thank you ..AND it has proven itself in severe conditions ..............

 

[Refueler]

The problem is that CQR always was fine for people very experienced in anchoring, such as the tester. The CQR isn't rubbish because it never works, it's rubbish because making it work requires more skill than a more modern design which can mostly be flung from the bows without a second thought. Times have moved on, and holding power is not the only measure of success for an anchor. Seatbelts and airbags are only needed by bad drivers, but we can all agree those are a nice to have, so why not an anchor that takes the guesswork out of a weekend on the hook?

Total ******'s

What a load of rubbish .....

 

[Refueler]

If you want an anchor that beds in as soon as dropped instead of setting - get a big concrete block.

I read such ridiculous drivel .. I wonder how many actually anchor seriously .........

 

[lustyd]

Well forgive me for saying that the CQR / Plough Anchor design has proven its worth for many years and still does. My Holdfast Plough is still my main anchor at 20lb and holds my 4 ton motor sailer nicely thank you ..AND it has proven itself in severe conditions ..............

Horses and carts proved themselves for centuries. Times move on.

 

[geem]

Well ... let me give an example of anchor use :

Yesterday, myself and another decided to have a day on the river ......... wind was weak but reasonably steady - giving us a nice relaxed sali ........ boat ? 4 ton 25ft motor sailer.
When we decided to turn back ... wind was increasing .. and being a river - had various orientations of direction. After a while - wind was too much on the head - so time to furl headsail.

HOLY SMOLY ... furling gear decides to faiil ...

So there we were with genny flogging itself to hell and back ...

Engine on to give us steerage .... by now wind is strong ... (forget we are on river) ... and get to river centre ...

I'm up on bow pulling chain out of locker .. Holdfast Plough anchor (20lb) ready to deploy. Once boat is river centre ... depth 5m ............ I ask for engine neutral ... and wait boat to stop moving forward ... all the while genny is flogging like crazy ...
Finally - anchor dropped ... let chain run as boat with genny is paying off .... but then snub chain at 15m and make fast.

Boat comes round and holds despite the hard bottom .. and genny still up.

Now I can drop genny and look at a diesel powered run home ....

Why tell the story ? Simple. The Plough anchor has come in for a lot of criticism over the years ... but here I have a specific case to quote ... where it has proven its worth against not only wind but also the power of genny ...

When the anchor was recovered - the chain and flukes showed clearly that the anchor had not buried itself deep but sufficient in a semi hard river bottom .... indications that mud was not more than 10 - 20cms deep on bottom ...

Crew with me has a 31ft boat and having seen this is now considering changing his setup from 5m chain then all rope rode to longer chain .......

I rest my case ............ Reasonable anchor weight + chain.

And that proves what exactly?

 

[[2574]]

And that proves what exactly?

Not a lot I'm afraid.

 

[Goldie]

That’s interesting. Perhaps there was a poor batch as ours is fine and we anchor lots. We’ve had ours about 15 years.

PS. If they had the anchor glowing red hot how come the lead didn’t fall out of the tip?

No idea, I wasn’t there to watch and can only report what they told me!

 

[Refueler]

Horses and carts proved themselves for centuries. Times move on.

Re-invent the wheel ?

Or because something works - see if it can be improved .

 

[Refueler]

And that proves what exactly?

So you cannot read ? or comprehend ?

The Plough anchor (CQR / Holdfast) has been subject of discussion for many years ............. with so many alternatives put fwd as better.

The proof of the pudding as we English say - is in use and results.

I do not deny that in certain conditions other anchors can do better ... in certain conditions can do worse. THERE IS NO UNIVERSAL DO IT ALL ANCHOR ... when will you self proclaimed 'experts' understand that ??

I give an example where it proved to work in conditions that would put any anchor to its limits.

The number of online comparison tests - anyone care to actually to look at the way conducted .. the methods used ? Near all when you consider those two factors fall very short of reality.

I remember so many supporting the table of Holding based on a tractor .. rope ... anchor on sandy beach. What a joke! The catenary was ZERO ... the tractor just creating a horizontal pull against anchor alone. No catenary or rode effects at all ..

People GET REAL ..............

 

[Refueler]

Not a lot I'm afraid.

Ostrich .. head in sand comes to mind.

I did not expect the plough anchor to hold ... as I know the river is glacial and has a hard bottom with minimal mud .... but she did hold ....

I do not think any other anchor could do better .. as I have an Admiralty C14 design at 10lbs on my smaller mobo - that holds until wind gets up ...

Sorry that I do not follow the 'modern' way ... I choose to disagree ........ but that's life !

 

[geem]

So you cannot read ? or comprehend ?

The Plough anchor (CQR / Holdfast) has been subject of discussion for many years ............. with so many alternatives put fwd as better.

The proof of the pudding as we English say - is in use and results.

I do not deny that in certain conditions other anchors can do better ... in certain conditions can do worse. THERE IS NO UNIVERSAL DO IT ALL ANCHOR ... when will you self proclaimed 'experts' understand that ??

I give an example where it proved to work in conditions that would put any anchor to its limits.

The number of online comparison tests - anyone care to actually to look at the way conducted .. the methods used ? Near all when you consider those two factors fall very short of reality.

I remember so many supporting the table of Holding based on a tractor .. rope ... anchor on sandy beach. What a joke! The catenary was ZERO ... the tractor just creating a horizontal pull against anchor alone. No catenary or rode effects at all ..

People GET REAL ..............

So what have you actually told us? Your old anchor held when you had catenary so you weren't really testing the holding ability at all. You were in a river and we are supposed to be impressed? No idea why you think that's tough conditions. Maybe it was for a very poor anchor design. You gave no information on speed of the river, wave height or wind speed. You had a flappy sail. I was waiting for the impressive bit but it never happened. Like one of those films with a crap ending

 

[[2574]]

So what have you actually told us? Your old anchor held when you had catenary so you weren't really testing the holding ability at all. You were in a river and we are supposed to be impressed? No idea why you think that's tough conditions. Maybe it was for a very poor anchor design. You gave no information on speed of the river, wave height or wind speed. You had a flappy sail. I was waiting for the impressive bit but it never happened. Like one of those films with a crap ending

Wasted pixels......

 

[KevinV]

Who would have thought that an anchor thread would get heated? ?

 

[Neeves]

I queried Panope on why he was happy to score the Rocna anchor' so poorly without any comment as to why all other independent tests score it highly. His clean sand test scores Rocna near the bottom. He said in reply that he thought some binder in the sand might be clogging the anchor. I replied and said that if you call the sand clean then say because it's dirty the Rocna doesn't set you are misleading people. No reply.
I also asked him why he described anchors as set when in a straight line pull they were clearly still moving very slowly (Mantua I think), he said that if he was in a hurricane that would be good enough! I said not acceptable. Set it not moving as per other anchors that actually stopped moving. No reply from him on that one.
I told him about the new Spades having sealed lead by epoxy. He said that unless Spade sent him one he would still score the anchor down on galvanising. I came to the conclusion that his information in his videos is seriously flawed. He appears to have favourites and bias. I no longer watch his videos.

That final sentence is a real killer. If you don't send one then your anchor is ignored - no matter how good, impartial testing? - I wonder what happens if you send 2 anchors.

I had a thread on regalvanising a Spade - I sealed the lead with epoxy.

So you cannot read ? or comprehend ?

The Plough anchor (CQR / Holdfast) has been subject of discussion for many years ............. with so many alternatives put fwd as better.

The proof of the pudding as we English say - is in use and results.

I do not deny that in certain conditions other anchors can do better ... in certain conditions can do worse. THERE IS NO UNIVERSAL DO IT ALL ANCHOR ... when will you self proclaimed 'experts' understand that ??

I give an example where it proved to work in conditions that would put any anchor to its limits.

The number of online comparison tests - anyone care to actually to look at the way conducted .. the methods used ? Near all when you consider those two factors fall very short of reality.

I remember so many supporting the table of Holding based on a tractor .. rope ... anchor on sandy beach. What a joke! The catenary was ZERO ... the tractor just creating a horizontal pull against anchor alone. No catenary or rode effects at all ..

People GET REAL ..............

Interesting - one example makes an anchor perfect?

The Classification Societies, Lloyds, RINA, ABS etc test anchors of different sizes in 3 different seabed. they rate the CQR a High Holding Power anchor. RINA, Lloyds etc rate a Rocna, Excel, Spade etc as Super High Holding Power anchors - a SHHP anchor has twice the hold of a HHP anchor. The West Marine testing reported in YM in 2006 and two reviews on anchors, published in YM or YW but conducted by Voile et Voileurs came to the same conclusions. The RNLI tested Spade and carry Spade as their preferred choice of anchor for the Shannon Class lifeboats.....

A number of members here have retired their CQR, consistently to the garden as their is minimal second hand demand and bought a Rocna, Knox etc etc. These owners of the Rocna, Knox etc have not regretted their decisions and we do not see a rash of anchors for sale second hand - because the original anchor was better.

But we should ignore these consistent results and believe one persons experience in one seabed in a river. There is nothing wrong with rivers (we anchor in rivers) - but - hands up people who anchor in rivers. Apparently no other anchor would have worked - how do we know - because he says so....has he tried a Rocna, Epsilon, Vulcan, Knox.....??

And he complains when a large number of people are incredulous.

Beggars belief.

Jonathan

 

[Chiara’s slave]

Ostrich .. head in sand comes to mind.

I did not expect the plough anchor to hold ... as I know the river is glacial and has a hard bottom with minimal mud .... but she did hold ....

I do not think any other anchor could do better .. as I have an Admiralty C14 design at 10lbs on my smaller mobo - that holds until wind gets up ...

Sorry that I do not follow the 'modern' way ... I choose to disagree ........ but that's life !

The tried and tested ways are always the best, aren’t they.

 

[webcraft]