LiftyK
Well-known member
Dear Neeves, you really had it in for my choice of anchor, yet I still loved reading all your contributions. Fingers crossed that you can be hauled back on board using a suitable swivel.
Anchor threads
- Thread starter Neeves
- Start date
LittleSister
Well-known member
Note Neeve's earlier post:
That thread is (now) here - Mixed anchor rode
The cruel joke being that that thread actually starts with a discussion about an article about mixed rodes in YM!
This being the YM published article under discussion there:
Best anchoring lines: 6 of the best ropes to hold your boat steady - YBW
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capnsensible
Well-known member
Take stock, it might be a fluke.
awol
Well-known member
Just read that article - it doesn't mention octoplait. Is my spare 50m redundant?
laika
Well-known member
More to the point, a penalty is a deterrent, but a deterrent is only effective if everyone understands how it will be used.
Can I add my voice to the call for an explanation so we can ensure we do not cross that same line? Having revisited the alleged post in question I’m still failing to understand what boundary has been crossed when some later posts by others in that thread are downright rude.
EDIT: answering the last question, when I last asked the mods (about a different incident) “how come you ban this but not all that other stuff?” the answer was that no-one had hit “report” on the other stuff. So obviously someone complained about neeves’s post
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awol
Well-known member
I have had posts pulled but not yet managed excommunication from a forum. I have entered into discussion with the Mods when it has happened, understood their interpretation of my posts and certainly did not always agree with them, but it is their ball and their game. If we want to play then we just have to suck it up - the referee is always right!
Tranona
Well-known member
That is perhaps because the article was not really about mixed or even rope rodes on cruising yachts as most of the products and examples were aimed at dayboats, tenders and RIBs. so you are safe to keep your octoplait.
Neeves
Well-known member
I am aware that weight is placed on members who use the 'Report' key at the bottom left of each post. Its there as a 'forum members' policing function. Whether it was used in my case - no idea.
I was misled by the article on 'mixed rodes' by the image used to illustrate hand retrieval - it seemed to be quite a large yacht. I too was surprised, which was one reason to initiate the thread, that the products quoted excluded anchor plait etc and the emphasis was on leaded rope. I had thought that as the article was in YM it was indicative they they were, possibly, adding a small yacht focus - which I thought a good move as its at the smaller sized end of the market that some people will be introduced to sailing (or that's where I started) and advice for small yacht owners would thus be invaluable. But as the article was for ribs and tenders then I was wrong (again).
I was surprised that the 'mixed rode' article was moved to the PBO section of the forum (as Scuttlebutt is not a technical forum) as there was no technical content to the article, at all. It was more about equipment choice and if you strip that out of Scuttlebutt equipment choice any technical issues - there is not much left. I suspect, as I mentioned, I'm being squeezed out - in the nicest possible way.
I was interested that those that have access to my post on PR, some found it polite and some, much, less so. Some of the other posts were downright insulting (but I did not hit the 'report' key). Normally I'd say 'sticks and stones etc etc' - except in my personal case those 'names' or 'words' have power beyond one's imagination. I was interested that PR suggested I was a 'troll' as I had been under the firm impression 'trolling' was an attack on a product or service.......?
I am not optimistic that the Mods will alter their decision, it will set a precedent -
But I remain humbled by the support.
Take care, stay safe
Jonathan
I was misled by the article on 'mixed rodes' by the image used to illustrate hand retrieval - it seemed to be quite a large yacht. I too was surprised, which was one reason to initiate the thread, that the products quoted excluded anchor plait etc and the emphasis was on leaded rope. I had thought that as the article was in YM it was indicative they they were, possibly, adding a small yacht focus - which I thought a good move as its at the smaller sized end of the market that some people will be introduced to sailing (or that's where I started) and advice for small yacht owners would thus be invaluable. But as the article was for ribs and tenders then I was wrong (again).
I was surprised that the 'mixed rode' article was moved to the PBO section of the forum (as Scuttlebutt is not a technical forum) as there was no technical content to the article, at all. It was more about equipment choice and if you strip that out of Scuttlebutt equipment choice any technical issues - there is not much left. I suspect, as I mentioned, I'm being squeezed out - in the nicest possible way.
I was interested that those that have access to my post on PR, some found it polite and some, much, less so. Some of the other posts were downright insulting (but I did not hit the 'report' key). Normally I'd say 'sticks and stones etc etc' - except in my personal case those 'names' or 'words' have power beyond one's imagination. I was interested that PR suggested I was a 'troll' as I had been under the firm impression 'trolling' was an attack on a product or service.......?
I am not optimistic that the Mods will alter their decision, it will set a precedent -
But I remain humbled by the support.
Take care, stay safe
Jonathan
Arcady
Active member
Just another vote in support of Neeves. That support has been well stated by others already, and I do believe in this case the moderators should reconsider their decision. This forum will be the worse without Neeves’ contributions.
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MapisM
Well-known member
Agreed wholeheartedly.
BTW, I'm saying this as someone who thinks that anchors are waaaaaaay overrated, because 95% of the times any anchor used with a pinch of salt is more than good enough, and in the remaining 5% I'd rather move elsewhere regardless of how good the anchor is.
So, I often found Neeves contributions worth a nomination for the "most boring topics" contest, if such thing would exist.
All that said, you are spot on, Bouba:
the asylum is getting poorer by the day, also because the views of those who think that anchors are important are as good as mine.
And Neeves certainly had something to say to those folks, so why restrict him to do so?
I really don't understand what ideas YBW editors have about the future of the asylum, if any at all.
If they couldn't care less about it - as it would be logical to infer - why not just shut the thing down for good, I wonder?
Bouba
Well-known member
To be fair to others, Neeves is a long distance yachtsman based in Australia, there are probably many times when that 5% is a matter of life and death of the vessel. But it’s not even that, we are on this forum because we are obsessive, we can’t just go boating, we have to share our experience and turn little issues into major talking points. It’s in our nature, I guess. But despite it being a personality defect we actually enjoy it? well, I certainly do.Agreed wholeheartedly.
BTW, I'm saying this as someone who thinks that anchors are waaaaaaay overrated, because 95% of the times any anchor used with a pinch of salt is more than good enough, and in the remaining 5% I'd rather move elsewhere regardless of how good the anchor is.
So, I often found Neeves contributions worth a nomination for the "most boring topics" contest, if such thing would exist.
All that said, you are spot on, Bouba:
the asylum is getting poorer by the day, also because the views of those who think that anchors are important are as good as mine.
And Neeves certainly had something to say to those folks, so why restrict him to do so?
I really don't understand what ideas YBW editors have about the future of the asylum, if any at all.
If they couldn't care less about it - as it would be logical to infer - why not just shut the thing down for good, I wonder?
I agree about the future of the forum, experts like you and Neeves are it’s life’s blood. We have lost so many others to this new moderating regime that it’s becoming anemic
Neeves
Well-known member
Agreed wholeheartedly.
BTW, I'm saying this as someone who thinks that anchors are waaaaaaay overrated, because 95% of the times any anchor used with a pinch of salt is more than good enough, and in the remaining 5% I'd rather move elsewhere regardless of how good the anchor is.
So, I often found Neeves contributions worth a nomination for the "most boring topics" contest, if such thing would exist.
All that said, you are spot on, Bouba:
the asylum is getting poorer by the day, also because the views of those who think that anchors are important are as good as mine.
And Neeves certainly had something to say to those folks, so why restrict him to do so?
I really don't understand what ideas YBW editors have about the future of the asylum, if any at all.
If they couldn't care less about it - as it would be logical to infer - why not just shut the thing down for good, I wonder?
Many of the yachts I used to see on a Friday afternoon/evening and those same yachts on a Sunday afternoon/evening (they disappeared due to Covid and are slowly returning) appeared to think that sails were over-rated (if not completely unnecessary) - as they rushed off to the weekend on a buoy (or home). But I would not deny them their investment in a yacht nor pleasure in using it any way they wanted. They certainly did not use an anchor - so you are correct - desperately over rated. I have state of the art Musto wet weather gear - bought 30 years ago - invaluable in races from HK to Manilla and in 20 years in Oz, almost never used - but when it is needed - it is a godsend.
Every one to their own. It would not do if we were all the same.
When life returns to near normal - try the Western isles of Scotland for a month - then post again about your experiences with anchors.
We all use our yachts differently and have different needs. I live in hope that there are others with the same ambitions as we had - sharing our experiences might be of help and save money and divorce proceedings. I will guarantee you background will be equally invaluable - but on different topics (that I might find fascinating (or not).
Take care,
Jonathan
Poey50
Well-known member
I think it would be very unwise of mods to get involved in public discussion of their decisions - that way madness lies. The rules aren't difficult to follow - just avoid starting - or being drawn into - personal criticism. Ideas can be robustly challenged without name calling.
That said, I read all of Neeve's posts, indeed look forward to them and have changed my anchoring practice as a result.
That said, I read all of Neeve's posts, indeed look forward to them and have changed my anchoring practice as a result.
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doug748
Well-known member
Indeed, plus it was little more than an advertising plug.
I'm with MapisM my eyes glaze over reading the average anchor piece, there seems to be more and more about less and less. A recent thread had nearly 100 posts on how to attach a length of rope to an anchor chain. However, if that makes for contentment, fine by me, not as if we were overburdened by new posts just now.
.
Neeves
Well-known member
I seem to be living in a parallel universe
It seems decisions are changed and the Mixed Rode thread has returned to Scuttlebutt (or it has here in Oz). If this is an accepted practice.......
I have mentioned, repeatedly, reading threads is voluntary - if anchor threads bore - give them a miss. There are plenty of fascinating threads on exhaust elbows, osmosis, corroding keels, keel bolts (both of which I don't read, I wonder why), rigging or pubs in obscure locations and even Coppercoat, prop AF and even AF. Plenty to read without looking at an anchor thread. Even better - start a thread on your own successes for which we can learn.
Jonathan
It seems decisions are changed and the Mixed Rode thread has returned to Scuttlebutt (or it has here in Oz). If this is an accepted practice.......
I have mentioned, repeatedly, reading threads is voluntary - if anchor threads bore - give them a miss. There are plenty of fascinating threads on exhaust elbows, osmosis, corroding keels, keel bolts (both of which I don't read, I wonder why), rigging or pubs in obscure locations and even Coppercoat, prop AF and even AF. Plenty to read without looking at an anchor thread. Even better - start a thread on your own successes for which we can learn.
Jonathan
dom
Well-known member
Ahh, while the concept of rosary bead threads very much exists over here, you'll find the Apostle's Creed a bit different: less 1-2-Both switches and more AWB vs MAB.
Perhaps best to ask JM before introducing a new anchor bead?
Snowgoose-1
Well-known member
If enough contributors click report on thread the mods have little choice but to take action of some kind. Problem is we all see the world in different ways. I think it will be all forgotten in short time. Neeves perhaps now knows what the boundaries are. I like his posts.
Neeves
Well-known member
I'd have to check back who raised it but I was intrigued by the comment that 'possibly' Rocna were subject to an 'unfair' bad review since the use of underwater vid.
I made the investigation and wrote the original report on concave, roll bar anchors clogging for Practical Sailor and stand by the report (my views have not changed and the risks are there) but reports of this failure mechanism have been notable by their absence.
As many will know I'm not a fan - but I also like to think I'm fair and balanced (despite the current brouhaha) and it might be time to give it all an airing.
I'm not inclined to initiate something quite so contentious if I were to post a thread and it were to be moved to PBO (noting my excommunication). Such a thread would be contentious as underwater video is well accepted, praised - so much so - it is sponsored. Underwater vid is a medium with which the printed media cannot compete - and debating its accuracy and influence could be interesting.
Noting of course that many find anchor threads as dull as growing grass or paint drying.
I don't agree that a 'picture is worth a thousand words' as pictures (today) can be manipulated and pictures are chosen to support whatever the author wants to say.....the integrity of the author is as important as the picture.
Ignoring the specific - video is an interesting medium - not really discussed here with a view on its persuasive nature.
The Mods might now be having nervous palpitations - but I'm patient - as PBO would be the sensible window
Jonathan
I made the investigation and wrote the original report on concave, roll bar anchors clogging for Practical Sailor and stand by the report (my views have not changed and the risks are there) but reports of this failure mechanism have been notable by their absence.
As many will know I'm not a fan - but I also like to think I'm fair and balanced (despite the current brouhaha) and it might be time to give it all an airing.
I'm not inclined to initiate something quite so contentious if I were to post a thread and it were to be moved to PBO (noting my excommunication). Such a thread would be contentious as underwater video is well accepted, praised - so much so - it is sponsored. Underwater vid is a medium with which the printed media cannot compete - and debating its accuracy and influence could be interesting.
Noting of course that many find anchor threads as dull as growing grass or paint drying.
I don't agree that a 'picture is worth a thousand words' as pictures (today) can be manipulated and pictures are chosen to support whatever the author wants to say.....the integrity of the author is as important as the picture.
Ignoring the specific - video is an interesting medium - not really discussed here with a view on its persuasive nature.
The Mods might now be having nervous palpitations - but I'm patient - as PBO would be the sensible window
Jonathan
doug748
Well-known member
Oh God.
Sorry......Good, great ?
.
Sorry......Good, great ?
.
Neeves
Well-known member
Be assured - it was nothing personal.
If I don't like an anchor I have 'technical' reason for my dislike - I've made measurements and found 'whatever' wanting.
I was given an anchor and my review was not very complimentary - the anchor maker said the the editor 'But I gave him the anchor free of charge'. My honesty and beliefs sometimes gets me into trouble
Jonathan
