Anchor Set Up for (Very) Small Yachts?

[Little Rascal]

Thanks Vyv, I'll have a read.

I do want something pretty beefy in spite of being only little. I'm keen to do some 'proper' anchorages (Aberdaron for instance...)

 

[Ubergeekian]

I seem to remember being told to beware of cheap CQR copies in the past, but I can't remember the reasons why...?

Real CQRs have proper hot forged shanks, which makes them jolly strong and, more to the point, jolly tough. You can practically tie them in a know before they'll break. Copies are generally cast, which is simpler, cheaper, weaker and brittler.

It's not necessarily a deal-breaked, though. S-L themselves made cast plough anchors, which you can identify by fractional weights. So, for example, the equivalent of a 20lb forged CQR was a 19 3/4 lb copy. If you are tempted to buy one from eBay, always ask precisely what weight is shown, and preferably get a photograph.

My Jouster (21', 1 ton) has had an anonymous plough of about 15lb (I think) for as long as I've had her. It has never failed me and has held in some very strong winds.

If I was buying for your boat I'd probably go for a second hand genuine CQR if I could find one. Regalvanizing a 25lb one I bought recently is only going to cost me £30 including collection and delivery. Failing that I would probably go for a Delta. Mansons and Spades sound great but are a bit scarily expensive. I wouldn't touch a Rocna until this business about quality control and materials used has been cleared up.

If you are interested in an almost brand new S-L 20lb CQR, used twice, PM me. I'm raising funds to upgrade my ketch from a grotty Danforth rip-off to a nice new Fortress.

 

[Little Rascal]

Revisiting this thread to see if anyone has any opinions on these cheap anchors?

I'm considering a 6kg Delta-type or a 9kg Plough type. Would a 10kg delta be overkill on a 19 footer? I'm planning on using it in anger!

 

[BAtoo]

Jimmy Green recommendations here:-
http://www.jimmygreen.co.uk/p/technical/anchor-size-guide

http://www.jimmygreen.co.uk/p/technical/anchor-chain-warp-size

I would go for octoplait as its so much easier to stow.

Length for east coast doesnt need to be huge, I think I've got about 20m chain and 35m warp on my 31ft'er.

I'd get a suitable bucket/bin for it all - maybe a 5 gallon plastic can with part of the top cut away, launch from the cockpit so you are not lugging it far then wander forward with the warp.

On my Squib - Europa without a lid - my anchor is a 4kg grapnel with 18m 10mm nylon warp so something similar for lunch anchor?

 

[Seajet]

Little Rascal,

you are right in your instinct to stick with rope; the idea of carrying all chain on this size boat makes me cringe.

On my 22' version of your boat, I use a 7.5kg Bruce - which I can recommend heartily - with 4 metres 1/4" chain & 40 metres 14mm nylon warp, that has coped with everything I've ever tried inc sitting out severe gales at Studland.

The Anderson has a well under a lid in the foredeck, big enough to take the anchor & flaked down warp; if your locker will only take the anchor, then something like a washing up bowl with warp flaked down & shackle ready seems like the best solution; like the Europa, the A22 likes any weight to be carried up front.

On longer trips I carry a folding grapnel; both as a kedge - it will hold on rock in emergency, which the Bruce is unlikely to - and to use when deliberately anchoring as an angel, lowered halfway down the bower warp to lower the pull on the Bruce and take the shock out of waves, works well.

I don't know about your Europa but the A22 can 'sail the anchor' in light wind over tide conditions, putting the keel across the anchor warp; the angel prevents this, or if just stopping for lunch a bucket trailed astern is another cure, though it stretches the boat out to full scope.

 

[vyv_cox]

Revisiting this thread to see if anyone has any opinions on these cheap anchors?

I'm considering a 6kg Delta-type or a 9kg Plough type. Would a 10kg delta be overkill on a 19 footer? I'm planning on using it in anger!

I'm amused to see that the Delta copy is said to be made of 'similar materials' to the original. Well, I suppose they are both steel of one sort or another. There seem to be quite a lot of these around at present. The ones I have looked at are crudely fabricated from mild steel. Anyone who has been following the 'bent Rocna shank' saga should be aware that those are something like 50% stronger than mild steel. So don't expect too much from these copies. Deltas are well made from a manganese steel that has good resistance to lateral loads.

As for a Plough - the original is pretty poor, so expect a copy to be worse. The one good thing that can be said for a genuine CQR is that it is made by forging, so is exceptionally tough and pretty strong. The copies are cast, from steel or maybe iron of questionable quality. The opposite of tough.

 

[maby]

70 metres on a 5/1 scope for rope and chain only allows for 14 metres depth!
Out here, we have that depth 30 metres from shore!

He's an east coast man, same as us. Round here we have to look hard to find 9m - and that's only at springs!

 

[jwilson]

Hi all,

I'm starting to look at the anchor set up for my Hunter Europa. She's 19 feet and 680kgs designed displacement. Having read lots of old threads on the subject I'd welcome any views on specifics...

I currently have a cheap 8.5lb Danforth as a 'main' (lunch) anchor and an 8lb grapnel as a 'kedge'.

I have about 25-30m of chain from a previous boat but my foredeck has no pipe or chain locker, just a small well (which takes the danforth nicely.) This makes the chain rather a pain to handle on the fordeck (in a bucket). The grapnel has 2 metres of heavy chain on it.

I want to upgrade the set up to cover all(?) seabed types plus something that will allow me to overnight at anchor with reasonable confidence. I do intend to anchor as much as possible...

I'm thinking of getting a longish warp and using the danforth/grapnel as a kedge but buying another (larger?) anchor as a bower, probably also on a long warp/chain combination. Then I'll bring along the chain rode for more serious cruises.


So my questions are:

- Which bower anchor to augment what I have already? (It won't be a super duper expensive one, so what are the cheaper options?)

- What size/weight for the bower anchor?

- What type/size of anchor warp? I'm thinking 45m of 10m nylon braid from Barry Edwards? But is this stretchy enough?

Cheers!
Jon

I'm not a regular East Coast person but conditions there surely mostly mud/sand bottoms. For that a slightly bigger Danforth is very good (alloy Fortress even better but very expensive), with just a small bit of chain and lots of warp.

The problem with using the cockpit as the holding pen for your anchor kit is that it is OK for getting it down in nice conditions: when the weather has worsened and you need to get it up the only place to be is on the foredeck, and you then REALLY need a way of losing the retrieved warp and chain into a safe stowage (ie not falling off the deck and getting wrapped round your keel, rudder and prop). If it won't all go into your anchor well you have a problem - and you may need to modify things forward.

In my foolish youth I used to cruise quite extensively Bristol Channel from upper end down to N Cornwall and up into the Irish Sea - in a similar sized boat, and soon learnt that a lot of permanent weight high up forward was bad news, but that you also needed a good anchor. I used a Danforth of about 10 Kg as stowed at the bows as main anchor, with about 10M chain led down through a hawse pie to a chain locker in the bilges. Then massive length of nylon warp (15 metre Bristol Channel tidal ranges). Also two other anchors stowed below aft as spares, plus a maybe 5Kg cast lump of lead as an anchor chum - something I thought really useful when most of the length was warp.

My other two anchors were a small CQR, and a big Fisherman, which was for the odd rocky/weedy bits. Throw away the folding grapnel that probably came with the boat - I did.

 

[PetiteFleur]

A Fortress is very good if you can get one at a good price, (FX-7)with about 20m of ¼" chain + 12mm Octoplait. My first boat was a Vivacity 20 which had a genuine CQR + ¼" chain which always worked well. So well in one instance that when I had to anchor at Burnham when it blew to F6 overnight, the only way i could raise the anchor was to pull up as tight as possible and wait for the tide to rise. The bow was at water level before it popped out! My experience with Plough look-a-likes is that they are rubbish. A Manson is very good but pricey - a 10lb Manson should be fine.

 

[Little Rascal]

In my foolish youth ...

I'm still in mine!

As Seajet says weight up front isn't a disaster in an Oliver Lee designed boat. The narrow stern and full forward sections is what makes it so balanced... and also means wet feet with a cockpit full of people...

However for practicality I will have the anchor in a bucket because my anchor well is pretty small and designed for a Danforth type. The 4kg Danforth fits nicely though.

Yes, I'm east coast based but intend to trail elsewhere hence the longer rode...

Vyv: I totally understand the concern over materials but the price is appropriate to the boat - no way I can justify the real thing. I was wondering if going for an oversize anchor would go some way to mitigating the risk of failure? I appreciate neither are ideal but which would be worse do you think: a cast plough or welded 'delta'?

Also regarding size/weight: I do intend to be anchoring overnight with it and sailing in less sheltered waters, so would a 6kg delta be up to that? A 10kg would give peace of mind but I don't want bigger than I need either. Perhaps the 7.5kg Bruce would be the best compromise. How does it do in mud Andy?

 

[vyv_cox]

If it has to be one of them I would suggest the Delta is probably better for setting, holding and remaining in one piece. Whether that piece will be bent or not I leave to you to find out.