Anchor locker leak horror

[Tim O]

Ok so....Ive started stripping the linings from the forecabin in order to insulate the hull and replace vinyl. On removing all the cushions and trim i noticed damp seeping through at the base of the forepeak bulkhead which separates the cabin from the anchor locker.

Probed a little more and found about the bottom 10 inches of the triangular ply bulkhead were damp and in places soft when pushed with a screwdriver......above this seemed fine and solid. It seemed this probelm may have been going on before I bought the boat as someone had bunged a load of silicone sealant into screw holes holding some wooden trim on to the bulkhead as if t stop the seepage.

So...immediately investigated the anchor locker to find:

Rain water has obviously been dripping in over the sill of the hatch cover.....not a problem per se as you expect anchor lockers to take some water in

The drain hole was blocked by piles of rust flakes from the anchor chain which is seriously corroded and will probably need replacing....again not a problem per se as the anchor locker is GRP lined and SHOULD be watertight

BUT obviously it appears that where the floor of the anchor locker meets the ply bulkhead (which would correspond to the approximate line of dampness on the inside) there must be a crack or hole allowing standing water to seep through.

SO....removed all the chain and cleaned the locker out as best I could and put some neoprene tape hatch seal to try and stop rain getting into the locker for now at least.

What are my options for sealing the interior of the anchor locker....?

Im thinking just slap on some more GRP to the bottom few inches of the anchor locker (taking care not to seal the drain hole!!)but how clean and dry does the anchor locker have to be to bond with a new layer? Also it's cold now....if I get in there with a fan heater to dry it out? Will GRP cure in these temperatures?

Is there another product that will do this...a friend suggested stuff you can use to emergency seal cracks in flat roofs which can apparently be applied to damp surfaces?

As to the bulkhead...I'm thinking as its only the bottom section affected its probably not dire from a structural point of view....I was thinking of drilling a couple of holes to allow any water trapped behind (presumably there's an enclosed space behind there probably full of water!) to drain out...then letting it dry out and seeing how bad
it is......could I cut the affected wood out and fit another piece in?

 

[William_H]

Epoxy will be your friend in sealing off the bottom of the anchor locker. Possibly with glass cloth or perhaps just a filler in the epoxy. Paint on just epoxy frst then add filler to build up the coating. Just how clean and dry it has to be is a difficult question. Just do your best. Yes it will need heating with a blower to dry and warm the structure. As for the cavity under the anchor locker yes I have problems with a similar cavity. It just seems to get water in it and the only access is through a hole in the bottom of the anchor locker. Hard to reach and hard to seal again after siphoning the water out. But f course my boat is probably very different to yours. good luck olewill

 

[sarabande]

Every anchor locker should be designed to let the inevitable water out either through the hull back to the ocean, or down into the bilges where it can be dealt with as normal. I don't see any practical reason why one might want to keep water in the locker, and that water will almost certainly be a major contributing factor to your chain rusting.

Sealing the lid against rainwater is the priority, and making sure it stays shut against nasty weather another one. Can you post a picture ?

 

[John the kiwi]

I think you have to man up and cut out the soggy Plywood until you reach sound wood and then start to rebuild it.
The worst part of a task like this is the dread anticipation of what you might find when you rip into it.
Be Brave.
My experience is that once you start a job like this and get back to sound material, the heart rate comes down and it isn't such a big deal!
Sometimes replacing a large area of ply is easier than messing around and trying to do "keyhole" repairs.
You don't need to be a craftsman joiner to scarf in a new piece of ply and cover it with lots of epoxy and cloth. A bit of reading and You Tubing and common sense will see you right.

Cutting out the soft area may also give you access to remedy the original problem of what sounds like insufficiently sized drains in the anchor well.

Good luck.

 

[ghostlymoron]

You need to make sure that the bulk head and floor of the locker is completely dry before you seal the surface or you'll trap water inside and encourage further problems. The important thing is to have adequate drain holes as trapped fresh water will cause rot. I had a problem with the threshold of my Mirror Offshore where the drain holes had become blocked with moss, this caused the lovely mahogany beam to become spongy. I treated it with a Ronsons product that penetrates and hardens soft timber with excellent results. You could try the same but make sure the locker drain is clear and the lid is a good fit or the same thing will happen again.

 

[Neeves]

If you get rainwater in your anchor locker I cannot see why you will not get seawater in there as well, if seas break over the bow. There are very few yachts that keep a dry bow, and they are usually not sailed! Seawater will of course corrode the chain more quickly than rainwater.

As mentioned you need to ensure any water does not sit in the locker in the future - even if only to reduce the rate of corrosion of the chain.

China lockers should be self draining - but commonly the drain holes are too small.

If you are going to re-build the internal of the locker it would be worth putting in a draining false floor, better a grate. This will keep the chain out of the water - if it only drains slowly.

Jonathan

 

[macd]

+1 with our antipodean friends.

A good repair demands aggressive treatment, and compared to fiddly bits of repair here and there may well be easier, as well as stronger. Once everything's cut out, you will need a steady flow of warm air for a considerable period.
Don't worry unduly about preserving any drain hole if it would be fiddly to do so: repairing and then cutting a new one may well be easier.
Be very aggressive at getting rid of those silicone bodges. Nothing will stick to that infernal stuff if even a trace of it is left.

 

[Neeves]

Nothing like a bit of back scratching - +1 for Mac, particularly silicone

But I would not try to make the hatch more water proof - it is very unlikely you will be successful. Accept that you will get water in there - a breaking sea carries a lot of power and I simply do not see you making anything watertight. The chain will carry water anyway - focus at repairing what you have and allowing water easy and quick exit - then look at the hatch.

I have a friend who recounts how he kept his trash in the anchor locker - on arriving 'somewhere' he noticed the yacht was a bit bow downi. He opened the hatch to find the locker full of water. A teabag had escaped from the trash, blocked the drain hole.

Jonathan

 

[ghostlymoron]

Nothing like a bit of back scratching - +1 for Mac, particularly silicone

But I would not try to make the hatch more water proof - it is very unlikely you will be successful. Accept that you will get water in there - a breaking sea carries a lot of power and I simply do not see you making anything watertight. The chain will carry water anyway - focus at repairing what you have and allowing water easy and quick exit - then look at the hatch.

I have a friend who recounts how he kept his trash in the anchor locker - on arriving 'somewhere' he noticed the yacht was a bit bow downi. He opened the hatch to find the locker full of water. A teabag had escaped from the trash, blocked the drain hole.

Jonathan

LOL!

 

[Tim O]

Can anyone explain simply in practical terms (not chemistry!) What the difference is between epoxy and GRP resin and what are the merits of epoxy over GRP for this particular job?

My concept is.....if you think of the base of the anchor locker as a triangular bowl with a crack/hole somewhere that it shouldn't have, I'm just going to line that bowl up to a depth of say 6"" with another layer of epoxy or GRP which will fill the hole and bond to the original GRP lining (bowl).

The current surface is painted with what looks like bilge paint, now stained with rust, and wet and slightly sandy and rust flaky! Should I flush the whole thing out with freshwater, then dry it out with a fan heater? Would a heat gun risk catching fire or melting the GRP? Will epoxy or GRO adhere to bilge paint or do I need to strip that off too?

The current drain hole is about half inch diameter stainless through hull exiting on starboard bow about ten inches above water line......would it be ok to drill a bigger hole (say 1") on both sides and use bronze or stainless through hulls?

What do other people's boats have?

Can't get to boat now till Monday or I'd post photos!

 

[sarabande]

Wash and sponge the locker clean first. I suspect that if you use a heat gun on bilge paint you will have to deal with some nasty fumes, so lots of ventilation please. Bcs the substrate is not very flat, it will be difficult to scrape the bilge paint off, so after cooking it, you might need a wire brush to remove the particles.

Heat will make the GRP go a bit sticky, but with care nothing much will happen.

The drain hole at 1/2 in dia sounds a bit small but OK to drain a relatively small locker. Does it drain from the lowest part of the locker ? A couple of larger holes will let water in, which may not be desirable...

How are you going to seal the surface round the drain ? Epoxy putty springs to mind, but wipe the area with acetone first.

 

[Seajet]

One point I'd make; I'm a great fan of limber holes allowing water from one compartment to another being closeable; racing dinghy captive bungs are a good way of doing this, cheap too.

If a boat were to have a trim problem, say a mooring snag holding the bow down or collision damage at one end or the other, a limber hole might well sink her - but not if the bung is only opened now and again when the owner is draining compartments...

 

[Boathook]

Allow the wood to dry as much as possible. You will still need to remove some as I suspect that the laminates would have separated. The drain hole does seem small and a bigger one can be 'covered' by a s/s shell vent (Force 4 parts 850415 or 850427). Other places will stock / obtain as well. Epoxy does cure at temperatures down to 5C but takes a long time. If it gets colder it stops but restarts once it warms up again I have found. I would not recommend this on something structural though.

 

[Keith-i]

GRP can be either epoxy based or polyester. Epoxy is better at gluing/ sticking but is more expensive. Epoxy will bond well to polyester. Polyester does not bond as well to epoxy. You need to clean off any loose or friable coatings then probably best to apply an epoxy coating. In an ideal world you'd clean all the bilge paint off but as this is not a structural repair I can't see it being that critical.

 

[simonfraser]

taste the water, if it is even slightly salty it will never dry properly.
or just wash it out with fresh, cut out all the rubbish wood, rinse it again ?
it will dry quickly as long as you dont have another leak ....

my anchor locker drain holes are at least 1" in diameter on a 7.5m boat, lid has a hole in to lift it up, as long as it drains properly its not an issue.

 

[Tim O]

Just to add some perspective the boat is a Colvic Countess 33.

Not sure a bung would be useful as the locker drains directly to sea.

Maybe two one inch ho!es would be too much? Letting water in when she pitched into every wave?

Was thinking if I put a bung of some sort in the drain while I'm glassing/epoxying, with something to stop it sticking to the bung I can just pull that out after and the hole should be fine??....or glass over the hole then drill through with half inch drill bit from outside?

Or were you asking about sealing any new drain hole?

 

[sarabande]

If the present hole and fitting is OK, I'd keep it, and avoid additional holes. I was concerned about using acetone round the fitting to ensure the fitting is properly bonded to the new epoxy/GRP. The bung suggestion sounds fine.

Making sure the hatch is a firm fit is important with a seagoing boat like the Countess - fine, tough boats.

 

[Tim O]

So mine is a 10m boat with one half inch drain hole.....it's quite a big locker ....lying down on deck you can just reach the bottom. There are two hatches one to starboard is biggest with main chain rode, one to port is a well containing secondary anchor with chain and rope rode. This one drains into the main locker

 

[Tim O]

Glad to hear something positive about my boat!.....has been getting me down recently just problems coming thick and fast.....hadnt factored this one in at all and was hoping to relaunch end of November.....

 

[sarabande]

If you really feel that you can't stop the ocean getting into those lockers, then yes, consider another drain. Neoprene seals sound like the best route, possibly with a strongback to clamp them down ?


You might try a PM to Single, who also has a Countess, to chat through the issue with him. He's pretty technical.