AIS System - Where to Start?

[dankilb]

Upon reflection, it is hard to beat @KompetentKrew's find of the Black Friday deal on the Ocean Signal - as that gets you B+, NMEA 2k and wifi out (inc. GPS aerial).

If you didn't have another way to multiplex NMEA (and I like the idea that, at times, only the AIS could be drawing power with all other instruments off but still outputting to phone/tablet) then you'd need to add Onwa's separate wifi/2k box (£170).

The total of the Onwa AIS, plus wifi and GPS aerial, is more than the Ocean Signal on offer.

 

[Refueler]

I presume most people buy AIS once in their life, and being used to marine prices, they prefer to buy in reputable chandlery than non-name brand from one person business.

A rather unfair slight on a good business. Your bias is not appreciated.

1. Onwa is a recognised brand - not no-name.
2. Alan may not be size of Garmin or Raymarine - but I can personally vouch for his honest and dedicated Customer Service. To say he goes the extra mile is an understatement.

I agree that most prefer to buy once ..... but tech evolves and living in the past is not always good ...

Sorry but after 50 odd years - I tend to not put the words Reputable and Chandlery together !! As to Marine Prices ..... they have only evolved that way through general lack of market resistance. Why should a Caravan / RV shop sell same gear at less price than a Yacht Chandlers ??

 

[Refueler]

Upon reflection, it is hard to beat @KompetentKrew's find of the Black Friday deal on the Ocean Signal - as that gets you B+, NMEA 2k and wifi out (inc. GPS aerial).

If you didn't have another way to multiplex NMEA (and I like the idea that, at times, only the AIS could be drawing power with all other instruments off but still outputting to phone/tablet) then you'd need to add Onwa's separate wifi/2k box (£170).

The total of the Onwa AIS, plus wifi and GPS aerial, is more than the Ocean Signal on offer.

585 Megadeal .... or 850 usual price ...

mmmmmm lets see ... Onwa £499 ... WiFi (NMEA2WiFi or NMEA4WiFI) about £50 .... so all that's needed now is a VHF antenna ... say another £50 .... that's £599 all in - WITHOUT need for megadeal or special Black Friday etc.

No need for GPS antenna - that's already supplied with the Onwa ... as with most other Plotters ...

 

[GHA]

Transponders? Yes that is built into the system but not used very much.
However they can function as transponders - therefore they are transponders.
Only place I have seen it it used is Mejillones, Chile. As you cross into port limits you receive a happy little welcome message from the Armada.

Does get used maybe much more than people on here are aware of. .
Listening to Gib Straits VTS on 22, high percentage of the calls from VTS are to ships to "check your AIS for email address & send an email with vessel data".
AIS transponders getting used a lot down here.. ?

 

[PaulRainbow]

A rather unfair slight on a good business. Your bias is not appreciated.

1. Onwa is a recognised brand - not no-name.
2. Alan may not be size of Garmin or Raymarine - but I can personally vouch for his honest and dedicated Customer Service. To say he goes the extra mile is an understatement.

I agree that most prefer to buy once ..... but tech evolves and living in the past is not always good ...

Yet you buy old tech kit working on outdated systems ???

 

[dankilb]

585 Megadeal .... or 850 usual price ...

mmmmmm lets see ... Onwa £499 ... WiFi (NMEA2WiFi or NMEA4WiFI) about £50 .... so all that's needed now is a VHF antenna ... say another £50 .... that's £599 all in - WITHOUT need for megadeal or special Black Friday etc.

No need for GPS antenna - that's already supplied with the Onwa ... as with most other Plotters ...

Sorry - a slight correction / apology for leading the discussion off-topic - but I was musing on the cost of the B+ transceivers/transponders (e.g. Onwa KS200A) not the plotters incorporating AIS. I agree the plotters seem particularly keen value. The standalone transceiver is also good value - as illustrated by the fact it’s close to a ‘mega deal’ price at it’s current RRP.

I’d be keen on their splitter for my setup, but I’ll have to email Aves as there doesn’t seem to be UK availability.

FWIW, I’m drawn to the Onwa/Aves brands and what they’re offering. (For my own needs, already having 2k and plotter in my setup, I just need to add AIS to my ‘network’ as cheaply/simply as possible)

 

[PaulRainbow]

585 Megadeal .... or 850 usual price ...

mmmmmm lets see ... Onwa £499 ... WiFi (NMEA2WiFi or NMEA4WiFI) about £50 .... so all that's needed now is a VHF antenna ... say another £50 .... that's £599 all in - WITHOUT need for megadeal or special Black Friday etc.

No need for GPS antenna - that's already supplied with the Onwa ... as with most other Plotters ...

The KS200 costs £489.60 with the external GPS antenna, plus £170 for the NMEA0183 to N2K/wife box, that's £659.60

The previously posted "megadeal" costs £584.95, with built in 0183/N2K, wife and an external antenna.

 

[Klausen]

young or old wife?

 

[slawosz]

A rather unfair slight on a good business. Your bias is not appreciated.

1. Onwa is a recognised brand - not no-name.
2. Alan may not be size of Garmin or Raymarine - but I can personally vouch for his honest and dedicated Customer Service. To say he goes the extra mile is an understatement.

I agree that most prefer to buy once ..... but tech evolves and living in the past is not always good ...

Sorry but after 50 odd years - I tend to not put the words Reputable and Chandlery together !! As to Marine Prices ..... they have only evolved that way through general lack of market resistance. Why should a Caravan / RV shop sell same gear at less price than a Yacht Chandlers ??

Oh, I had no I’ll intention. Alan from Aves is great and it’s a pleasure to bussiness with him. My comment was regarding:

Blimey - I will never understand why people would pay such prices for 'Add-on' gear .... 'bargain' ???????

It’s my just my answer. Once in 10 years purchase and anxiety to try new things. But it’s just my opinion. I will always recommend Onwa equipment to anyone as I already did few posts above. Also I shop for most things on eBay or 3d print tools or non-critical equipment. Like my Onwa - vesa to mount adapter.
People seems to trust big brands and as I wrote above are ’happy’ to spend money on those.

 

[Refueler]

Yet you buy old tech kit working on outdated systems ???

Your opinion ... despite fact that Onwa is one of the first to offer next generation connectivity - leaving N200 in the bilges where it belongs.
The reason I chose the KP39A instead of one of the later models - Alan offered me a deal that was hard to resist !! No regrets at all.

Old tech kit ?? Consider that the guy who designed / built and markets the NMEA4WiFi units are streets ahead of the commercial items at a fraction of the cost.

The world is far bigger than just pumping out Garmin ....... like most mainstream brands - they tend to get lost in Proprietary Encoding / Licencing and protectionism - while rest of world moves on and evolves.
It happened with Video, Music, Computers, Radio Control, and we are seeing it with boat gear .....

 

[Refueler]

The KS200 costs £489.60 with the external GPS antenna, plus £170 for the NMEA0183 to N2K/wife box, that's £659.60

The previously posted "megadeal" costs £584.95, with built in 0183/N2K, wife and an external antenna.

You can pick and choose parts / units / kit to support your position .. as can I ..... it proves nothing as you are arbitrarily making sure YOUR choices fit your argument.

 

[PaulRainbow]

You can pick and choose parts / units / kit to support your position .. as can I ..... it proves nothing as you are arbitrarily making sure YOUR choices fit your argument.

I quoted a direct comparison.

 

[PaulRainbow]

Your opinion ... despite fact that Onwa is one of the first to offer next generation connectivity - leaving N200 in the bilges where it belongs.

"next generation connectivity" ??

Old tech kit ?? Consider that the guy who designed / built and markets the NMEA4WiFi units are streets ahead of the commercial items at a fraction of the cost.

The world is far bigger than just pumping out Garmin ....... like most mainstream brands - they tend to get lost in Proprietary Encoding / Licencing and protectionism - while rest of world moves on and evolves.
It happened with Video, Music, Computers, Radio Control, and we are seeing it with boat gear .....

Yes, old tech kit. We moved on from NMEA 0183 years ago. If you choose to live in the past that's up to you.

Bodging a few bits of kit together, where one might "talk" to to the next, doesn't come close to a proper, fully integrated, system where everything onboard can communicate and share data.

If your installation suits your needs and budget that's great, but stop slagging everything else off as if yours is in some way superior (it isn't) and give it a rest with trying to push Onwa down everyones throat.

 

[slawosz]

Bodging a few bits of kit together, where one might to to the next, doesn't come close to a proper, fully integrated, system where everything onboard can communicate and share data.

If you installation suits your needs and budget that's great, but stop slagging everything else off as if yours is in some way superior (it isn't) and give it a rest with trying to push Onwa down everyones throat.

I generally agree that there is several people on the forum that are Onwa fanboys, including myself. However, I am bit upset seeing how this discussion is going. We lack context, which is yacht size.
OP has Contessa 26, rather small yacht and little budget. And I think this is what attracted so much Onwa discussions. And I know that

Yes, old tech kit. We moved on from NMEA 0183 years ago.

how advanced became marine electronics. And I know you are an expert, and probably fit several sets of newest gadgets per month, but there is huge market where people don't need the newest gear. And this is where Onwa fits perfectly. Even NMEA 0183 can be still used to talk to other devices, providing there is very little of them. I have perfectly working radio that uses 183 for getting GPS. If someone has small budget, or doesn't need new kit Onwa is a perfect choice and can live with 'outdated' kit.

However, if there is a lot of good equipment on board, but the yacht lacks AIS transponder, the modern box that will be easy to configure and use with the current kit will be a good choice. Or there is huge budget for new electronics - say 5k.

 

[slawosz]

"next generation connectivity" ??

Onwa is using OneNet in this device: KM-12 (New!) - ONWA Marine Electronics Co. Ltd.
But again, for weekend sailor as myself, with one week summer cruise, Onwa is more than enough. On my 24 feet Sadler 25 I barely can fit plotter anyway. For someone who bought newish (max 20y) bigger cruiser, having half of equipment using N2k etc, cheap Onwa plotter is not.

 

[andsarkit]

I generally agree that there is several people on the forum that are Onwa fanboys, including myself. However, I am bit upset seeing how this discussion is going. We lack context, which is yacht size.
OP has Contessa 26, rather small yacht and little budget. And I think this is what attracted so much Onwa discussions.

I have the same boat as the OP and went the Onwa KP39A route . It makes perfect sense on a small low value boat when I wanted a plotter and AIS. There is no room to mount large screens and there is no need for connectivity as all the instruments are within a few feet when in the cockpit or at the chart table. I have made a mount and extension cable so that I can either have the plotter at the chart table or under the sprayhood as required.
UK support from Alan at Aves is excellent and the unit has had no problems in the 3 years it has been fitted. If you have a larger boat and budget then there are much better options out there but none of the big name electronic suppliers cater for the financially limited small boat owner any more.

 

[slawosz]

I might already add it it but here it is:
For those who are more adventurous, there is AIS receiver for Rasbery PI, for 50 quid: dAISy HAT - AIS Receiver for the Raspberry Pi

 

[PaulRainbow]

I generally agree that there is several people on the forum that are Onwa fanboys, including myself. However, I am bit upset seeing how this discussion is going. We lack context, which is yacht size.
OP has Contessa 26, rather small yacht and little budget. And I think this is what attracted so much Onwa discussions.

I don't disagree.

And I know you are an expert, and probably fit several sets of newest gadgets per month, but there is huge market where people don't need the newest gear. And this is where Onwa fits perfectly. Even NMEA 0183 can be still used to talk to other devices, providing there is very little of them. I have perfectly working radio that uses 183 for getting GPS. If someone has small budget, or doesn't need new kit Onwa is a perfect choice and can live with 'outdated' kit.

However, if there is a lot of good equipment on board, but the yacht lacks AIS transponder, the modern box that will be easy to configure and use with the current kit will be a good choice. Or there is huge budget for new electronics - say 5k.

Again, i don't disagree with any of that. There are many different systems one could fit, that may depend on the boat, the budget and what the owner wants. The installations that i am asked to do vary enormously.

It's fair to say that NMEA 0183 still works fine for smaller installations such as your own and i still fit such installations, nothing wrong with that. With bigger, more complex or integrated systems, NMEA 0183 makes no sense whatsoever. Anyone who says that 0183 is better than N2K in such an installation is deluded (not you).

 

[PaulRainbow]

Onwa is using OneNet in this device: KM-12 (New!) - ONWA Marine Electronics Co. Ltd.
But again, for weekend sailor as myself, with one week summer cruise, Onwa is more than enough. On my 24 feet Sadler 25 I barely can fit plotter anyway. For someone who bought newish (max 20y) bigger cruiser, having half of equipment using N2k etc, cheap Onwa plotter is not.

Ethernet based networks have been around for decades, but have been mostly proprietary, typically being used to connect radar and fish finders. The Onenet standard from NMEA has been around for 2 years, but so far we're not seeing any of the big brands taking it up.

A downside will be if each component has to be connected to a router there will be more cable to install, or fit multiple routers. Time will tell.

Time will tell.

 

[slawosz]

Ethernet based networks have been around for decades, but have been mostly proprietary, typically being used to connect radar and fish finders. The Onenet standard from NMEA has been around for 2 years, but so far we're not seeing any of the big brands taking it up.

A downside will be if each component has to be connected to a router there will be more cable to install, or fit multiple routers. Time will tell.

Time will tell.

I wonder if it would work to create your own protocol. So to design a device with N2k and ethernet ports. You connect N2k, the device is smart and knows the type of input and you then you have a central hub. The end devices would still get N2k output. I am not sure if this is nonsense for you @PaulRainbow or not - I know people are reading N2k by arduino and I could create arduino prototype of something like this.