Advice on Small (5-5.5m) Simple Boat for South of France

[EME]

I dont know the staff at that marina at all but normally when quoting 'larger' there is an expectation of that to include a fender allowance in that number (10cm x 2 is frequently quoted) but that is easily checked with the marina.

 

[captainhooked]

I dont know the staff at that marina at all but normally when quoting 'larger' there is an expectation of that to include a fender allowance in that number (10cm x 2 is frequently quoted) but that is easily checked with the marina.

Thanks, hopefully that's not the case here, or my boat would have to be 20cm narrower still!

 

[Bouba]

The width is a killer...this is probably the most boat that you could fit into your berth
https://www.boat24.com/en/powerboats/drago-boats/drago-boats-drago-fiesta-540/detail/545426/
It might be available in your budget.....it’s a bit of a drive to go see...but traffic is light this time of year

 

[ylop]

Downsides of this is that it's more spartan/rustic than the fibreglass boat though I suspect if you put cushions everywhere on it it would not be a million miles away. As mentioned previously the ruggedness of this appeals to me, I would not be worried about damaging it, if my kids are driving it when they are older I'd be less worried also. It looks good for being able to jump in and out of sea at front of it which is somthing we'd be doing a lot of. It probably needs a lot less maintenance than the other boat also so cheaper in that regard.

I think the whaly is a reasonably sensible choice. They are quite heavy and the v hull is not as steep as some British rib makers but probably similar to the med rib market. Not sure how much extra you are paying for the “drop nose” version but for fit young people jumping in that might not actually be that important - it’s useful for divers and rescue boat duties.

BUT I’d want to understand your width limit - if that is because you need to squeeze between two fancy expensive fibreglass boats then whilst your boat is robust theirs is not… if you end up needing loads of fenders you’ll need storage space for them etc - a rib could be better for boating bumper cars! But these style of boats aren’t all bad. If you are thinking of buying in France then I think FunYak are French and have a similar range of boats. Whaly have done a better job of marketing - at least in the uk.

 

[captainhooked]

The width is a killer...this is probably the most boat that you could fit into your berth
https://www.boat24.com/en/powerboats/drago-boats/drago-boats-drago-fiesta-540/detail/545426/
It might be available in your budget.....it’s a bit of a drive to go see...but traffic is light this time of year

Thanks for that. It's not that much of a drive, some of the other boats I was looking at were in Scotland, that would be a long way to Antibes!

I'm not that keen on anything with a cabin/storage space, just something with as much deck space as possible would be good.

 

[captainhooked]

I think the whaly is a reasonably sensible choice. They are quite heavy and the v hull is not as steep as some British rib makers but probably similar to the med rib market. Not sure how much extra you are paying for the “drop nose” version but for fit young people jumping in that might not actually be that important - it’s useful for divers and rescue boat duties.

BUT I’d want to understand your width limit - if that is because you need to squeeze between two fancy expensive fibreglass boats then whilst your boat is robust theirs is not… if you end up needing loads of fenders you’ll need storage space for them etc - a rib could be better for boating bumper cars! But these style of boats aren’t all bad. If you are thinking of buying in France then I think FunYak are French and have a similar range of boats. Whaly have done a better job of marketing - at least in the uk.

Thanks for that, the Whaly comes with the drop nose as standard. I'm actually pretty terrible from an agility point of view for climbing onto boats from the sea so I wouldn't mind somthing with ease of access!

In terms of trying to find boats to fit the max dimensions I have (5.5m x 2.15m wide) and max out the space I have the main options I can find are these:

(1) Karel Ithica 550: https://www.boat24.com/en/powerboats/karel/karel-ithaca-550/detail/507912/
This is of a similar style to the Jeanneau Cap Camarat mentioned earlier but fits within my narrower width requirements. They seem to be Greek made (not sure if the Greeks have a good reputation for boat building)
Seems to be about €40k new and equipped (maybe I can get it cheaper from the Greece and not from Switzerland) Can't see any 2nd hand ones

(2) Whaly 500R: Plastic boat as mentioned : Whaly 500R dark grey for sale and in stock available to view Probably more like €25,000 new and closer to 1/2 price second hand, here's one up the coast: https://www.leboncoin.fr/ad/nautisme/2764576112

Downsides of this is that it's more spartan/rustic than the fibreglass boat though I suspect if you put cushions everywhere on it it would not be a million miles away. As mentioned previously the ruggedness of this appeals to me, I would not be worried about damaging it, if my kids are driving it when they are older I'd be less worried also. It looks good for being able to jump in and out of sea at front of it which is somthing we'd be doing a lot of. It probably needs a lot less maintenance than the other boat also so cheaper in that regard.

Not sure how much less comfortable it's likely to be than a fibreglass boat. There's mention of people getting wet in it in choppy seas which would not be great. But overall it's likely to be by far the cheaper option and appeals a bit in terms of that, ie if it turns out I don't use it much I'm more comfortable with a €12k 2nd hand boat than a €40k new one.

(3) I also found this not too far away in Italy: https://www.boat24.com/en/powerboats/silveryacht/silveryacht-525/detail/566367/
It looks reasonably nice and seems pretty cheap at €17k, more like Whaly money. I'm not sure I'm that keen on having the steering at the back, kind of prefer being closer to the middle of the boat. Again not sure if it's likely to be more comfy than the Whaly in choppy seas. The swimming access looks ok if not great.

(4) Another boat in Italy: https://www.boat24.com/en/powerboats/mingolla/mingolla-brava-16-honda-bf40e/detail/509775/ New for €21k, possibly looks a bit cheap.

(3) Other options: The pontoon boat looked good but can't find anything in the correct size range. Likewise with RIBs they tend to be too wide for the most part. Something like this fits the dimensions but the interior space looks rubbish: https://www.boat24.com/en/inflatabl...ider-500-strongan--kommission-/detail/565147/

I could not find anything suitable in the inboard diesel range either. This looks ok dimensions wise: https://www.boat24.com/en/powerboats/maya/maya-gozzo-55/detail/606100/ But it does not look suitable for jumping in and out of.

Any further advice would be much appreciated, I think I need to make a decision quickly enough on this.

Also if I buy a boat from a dealer in Europe are they likely to be able to transport it to south of France for me? My EV does not have a tow bar and while I'm pretty optimistic by nature, I suspect me trying to tow a boat from Netherlands for example to bottom of France might be a bit ambitious!

 

[Portofino]

The “ Gozo “ style diesel inboard would be my choice.
There’s a ladder at the stern just like the rest .

They will deliver from Piedmont to Salis negotiate that in . About 3/4 hrs on a recovery vehicle .
It will retain it’s value better and the machinery will be more economical , safer ( less lugging petrol cans about )
I know there’s a garage very near Salis across and down a bit opposite the sailing school but nether the less .
This boat will get you around the Cap ( more crucially return ! ) in better comfort than those others .

Or you could as I linked above contact Stratton marine in Blakeney ( Google them ) and have a Yanmar diesel open made for circa £21 K + a few med bit like Bimini and ladder etc .
They too could arrange del .

 

[Grubble]

What do the local boat rental companies rent in that size category? If they have anything suitable I would ask if they have any for sale. And as for a diesel inboard, why on earth would you want to lumber yourself with some smelly, noisy, dirty thing in a small boat that is going to cost nothing to run anyway? Petrol outboard is the obvious choice, the bigger the better for watersports.

 

[Portofino]

What do the local boat rental companies rent in that size category? If they have anything suitable I would ask if they have any for sale. And as for a diesel inboard, why on earth would you want to lumber yourself with some smelly, noisy, dirty thing in a small boat that is going to cost nothing to run anyway? Petrol outboard is the obvious choice, the bigger the better for watersports.

Christ !
Let’s break this down ,
The rental Co rent 8hitty little sub what ever Hp 8 is it OB s which can’t plane , they go at D speed .
20 yrs personal experience permit me to add personal experience as I have already said above ^ in the op chosen port ( for what ever reason ) means in a 5.5 M boat he won’t be planing around Cap D Antibes except in the hand full ( that’s less than 5 for clarity for the thicko s on here ); days pa , which if you read his response to my posts he acknowledged the sea conditions.

Little built in 10 -20 Hp diesels are all you need to do D speed in comfort in waves and get back from the Lerins and the always sheltered W side of the cap ,

A petrol OB is a cop out as left damp requiring Uber maintenance E 10 malarkey eating pipes and none stale fuel dangerously having to be humped or worse still if French bye laws working against him humping petrol necessitating him having to run into port VB with a southerly wind ( waves ) will kill the experience.Dead in 5.5 M vessel !

‘ water sports “ pull the other one he won’t be planing in those seas in a 5.5 M .

Go back under your stone .

We have a house in Antibes btw . If you read and digested my posts you would / should have grasped my intimate knowledge or the area .

He’s doesn’t need a planning boat @ 5.5 M in those seas . So your biggest Hp advice is suicide advice .




Sure at 15 M + then that’s a wholly different kettle of fish . Don’t ask me how I know that btw .

 

[stelican]

Thanks, hopefully that's not the case here, or my boat would have to be 20cm narrower still!

Have you looked around where you are berthing to see what is popular.

 

[captainhooked]

Have you looked around where you are berthing to see what is popular.

Thanks, there seems to be a variety of boats, lots of small old wooden ones, some newer bigger Bowrider type ones with 100+hp engines. I'd say most are on the older/smaller side of things.

 

[captainhooked]

Christ !
Let’s break this down ,
The rental Co rent 8hitty little sub what ever Hp 8 is it OB s which can’t plane , they go at D speed .
20 yrs personal experience permit me to add personal experience as I have already said above ^ in the op chosen port ( for what ever reason ) means in a 5.5 M boat he won’t be planing around Cap D Antibes except in the hand full ( that’s less than 5 for clarity for the thicko s on here ); days pa , which if you read his response to my posts he acknowledged the sea conditions.

Little built in 10 -20 Hp diesels are all you need to do D speed in comfort in waves and get back from the Lerins and the always sheltered W side of the cap ,

A petrol OB is a cop out as left damp requiring Uber maintenance E 10 malarkey eating pipes and none stale fuel dangerously having to be humped or worse still if French bye laws working against him humping petrol necessitating him having to run into port VB with a southerly wind ( waves ) will kill the experience.Dead in 5.5 M vessel !

‘ water sports “ pull the other one he won’t be planing in those seas in a 5.5 M .

Go back under your stone .

We have a house in Antibes btw . If you read and digested my posts you would / should have grasped my intimate knowledge or the area .

He’s doesn’t need a planning boat @ 5.5 M in those seas . So your biggest Hp advice is suicide advice .




Sure at 15 M + then that’s a wholly different kettle of fish . Don’t ask me how I know that btw .

Thanks again for all the advice on this, I really appreciate it.

I'm somewhat conflicted on what to do here. My initial inclination was to go with somthing cheap and simple (such as the plastic Whaly) and upgrade if I get a lot of use out of it/want somthing better. Seems like a newish 2nd hand Whaly might be around 13k.

I had a look at the diesel inline boats Portofino was suggesting but this seemed to be the only one I could find relatively local: https://www.boat24.com/en/powerboats/maya/maya-gozzo-55/detail/606100/
It just doesn't look great in terms of access in/out in with a ladder which is really important, most of the others have a flatter section at the back to climb in/out of. Seating options are not as good as other boats and I prefer a wheel in middle of boat to tiller at back. It's also pretty much the only diesel I can find anywhere that fits the dimensions.

I'm also thinking it makes sense to buy somthing that might be easy to sell on if we don't get as much use out of it, and so going with somthing more popular/standard might make more sense. There's hundreds of more standard motorboats with outboard so I'm thinking that might be an easier boat to move on later if needs be.

I was looking at somthing like this, which is probably more comfortable than the Whaly and only a few thousand more, and it's new: https://www.boat24.com/en/powerboats/silveryacht/silveryacht-525/detail/566367/
It only comes with a 40hp motor

I was also looking at somthing like this which is a bit bigger so maxing out my dimensions, just under 20k used: https://www.boat24.com/en/powerboats/ranieri-boat/ranieri-boat-soverato-545-grey/detail/616182/
This also has the potential to add a more powerful outboard, a lot of the 5.5m boats I've rented locally are more like 100hp+ than 40. Now as Portofino has mentioned it's often choppy in the immediate vicinity of where I'll be keeping the boat so potentially having a bigger motor becomes pointless.

That said I'm hoping that by going out later in the day (I go for walk around the Cap D'Antibes about 6-7pm in the evenings in summer and the sea seems way calmer than a few hours earlier) so I could maybe still get a bit of speed going without it being too uneven. I'd also (and this might be completely unrealistic) thought if I had a more powerful engine in theory I might be able to go up and down the coast where there are loads of nice spots.

The likes of Cap Ferrat, Villefranche Sur Mer etc are about 20km as the crow flies, is this a realistic distance you could take on with a 5.5m boat with 100hp outboard? Obviously it would not be fun if I was bouncing around getting soaked. Likewise I liked the idea of the option watersports (and they do do this from the beach beside us) but again it may not be that realistic.





If the long trips/watersports were not an option then I'd probably be fine with either of the above boats with 40hp.

So I'm not really sure how to proceed here. Like I say I'm probably be leaning towards getting one of the boats above but whether or not it's worth getting a powerful outboard is not unclear

 

[Sticky Fingers]

Done that route Antibes to Villefranche a few times albeit in bigger boats, if the conditions are benign then the 5,5m boat will be fine but if it blows up a swell during the day it’s going to be very uncomfortable. I’d be looking at a rib if you want to do this s a matter of routine.

Out of Antibes and turn south / west you get to Salis (where your route starts), only a few nm and very sheltered anchorage, ideal for an evening at anchor and a picnic / waterski / swim / whatever.

 

[captainhooked]

Done that route Antibes to Villefranche a few times albeit in bigger boats, if the conditions are benign then the 5,5m boat will be fine but if it blows up a swell during the day it’s going to be very uncomfortable. I’d be looking at a rib.

Out of Antibes and turn west you get to Salis (where your route starts), only a few nm and very sheltered anchorage, ideal for an evening at anchor and a picnic / waterski / swim / whatever.

Thanks for that, I appreciate it. I'm actually going to be keeping the boat at Port Salis so that'll be starting point for any trips.

On the rib front I hadn't seen a lot of suitable ones, my boat can me up to 5.5m long but only 2.15 wide so that seems to rule a lot out.

I believe they are meant to offer a more comfortable ride (might not be the worse as both my sons and I are a bit prone to seasickness) but they also look less comfortable in terms of on board comfort/seating etc so I was leaning more towards a hard boat.

Here's probably the best I can find: https://www.boat24.com/en/inflatableboats/gala/gala-a500l-zwart-valmex/detail/587075/

But it looks like it might only have seating for 4/5 and that's with someone at the front possibly getting blasted by water. Also think it might be tricky to have bimini on a RIB and hard to climb in/out for swimming.

 

[Bouba]

Thanks again for all the advice on this, I really appreciate it.

I'm somewhat conflicted on what to do here. My initial inclination was to go with somthing cheap and simple (such as the plastic Whaly) and upgrade if I get a lot of use out of it/want somthing better. Seems like a newish 2nd hand Whaly might be around 13k.

I had a look at the diesel inline boats Portofino was suggesting but this seemed to be the only one I could find relatively local: https://www.boat24.com/en/powerboats/maya/maya-gozzo-55/detail/606100/
It just doesn't look great in terms of access in/out in with a ladder which is really important, most of the others have a flatter section at the back to climb in/out of. Seating options are not as good as other boats and I prefer a wheel in middle of boat to tiller at back. It's also pretty much the only diesel I can find anywhere that fits the dimensions.

I'm also thinking it makes sense to buy somthing that might be easy to sell on if we don't get as much use out of it, and so going with somthing more popular/standard might make more sense. There's hundreds of more standard motorboats with outboard so I'm thinking that might be an easier boat to move on later if needs be.

I was looking at somthing like this, which is probably more comfortable than the Whaly and only a few thousand more, and it's new: https://www.boat24.com/en/powerboats/silveryacht/silveryacht-525/detail/566367/
It only comes with a 40hp motor

I was also looking at somthing like this which is a bit bigger so maxing out my dimensions, just under 20k used: https://www.boat24.com/en/powerboats/ranieri-boat/ranieri-boat-soverato-545-grey/detail/616182/
This also has the potential to add a more powerful outboard, a lot of the 5.5m boats I've rented locally are more like 100hp+ than 40. Now as Portofino has mentioned it's often choppy in the immediate vicinity of where I'll be keeping the boat so potentially having a bigger motor becomes pointless.

That said I'm hoping that by going out later in the day (I go for walk around the Cap D'Antibes about 6-7pm in the evenings in summer and the sea seems way calmer than a few hours earlier) so I could maybe still get a bit of speed going without it being too uneven. I'd also (and this might be completely unrealistic) thought if I had a more powerful engine in theory I might be able to go up and down the coast where there are loads of nice spots.

The likes of Cap Ferrat, Villefranche Sur Mer etc are about 20km as the crow flies, is this a realistic distance you could take on with a 5.5m boat with 100hp outboard? Obviously it would not be fun if I was bouncing around getting soaked. Likewise I liked the idea of the option watersports (and they do do this from the beach beside us) but again it may not be that realistic.


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If the long trips/watersports were not an option then I'd probably be fine with either of the above boats with 40hp.

So I'm not really sure how to proceed here. Like I say I'm probably be leaning towards getting one of the boats above but whether or not it's worth getting a powerful outboard is not unclear

That route could take across the wake of cruise ships upto 30,000 tons.....those wakes will look like mountains in a five meter boat

 

[Grubble]

The likes of Cap Ferrat, Villefranche Sur Mer etc are about 20km as the crow flies, is this a realistic distance you could take on with a 5.5m boat with 100hp outboard? Obviously it would not be fun if I was bouncing around getting soaked. Likewise I liked the idea of the option watersports (and they do do this from the beach beside us) but again it may not be that realistic.

20km each way is an awfully long way to go in a small boat - things can get very uncomfortable very quickly and you don't want to be literally miles from home when they do. Again I really can't understand the point of a diesel engine in such a small boat, when realistically you aren't going to be doing any kind of distance in it. It seems to be diesel=good, petrol=bad taken to an absurd level.

 

[markc]

I'm not sure I would fancy doing Antibes to Villefranche in a sub 5.5m boat that often. I would if the conditions were very calm and I could make good progress. However, there is so much to do in the immediate vicinity around the cap and the islands, that there's no need for longer trips. I agree with Bouba... waves can look very big when you are in a smaller boat, and they dramatically affect the speed you can travel at.

 

[DAW]

I dont know the staff at that marina at all but normally when quoting 'larger' there is an expectation of that to include a fender allowance in that number (10cm x 2 is frequently quoted) but that is easily checked with the marina.

This applies in many of the marinas on the CdA, and is enforced to varying degrees. The rates quoted by the marina are based on the size of boat, not the size of berth they will put it in. It's also possible that not all of the 5.5m berths are the same width ... as an example, in Beaulieu the berths on the 19m quay where I'm based vary in width from 4.6m to 6.2m, so the maximum acceptable boat size depends which one they allocate to you. You should definitely check with the capitainerie in advance of any purchase that the boat you want to buy will be accepted on the berth they are able to allocate to you.

 

[Bouba]

I'm not that keen on anything with a cabin/storage space, just something with as much deck space as possible would be good.

That’s fine....except that open boats aren’t good at eating breaking waves, which is why people are saying get a RIB.....there are some boats that have a small cuddy cabin with a flat roof so that it’s comfortable to sit on

 

[Portofino]

My post #2 and the ops post #19 shows the size . There’s a lot of chaffe on here about this fenders etc , but the reality is he’s limited to cat B .
The ops knows the sea states his up against .

It’s just the heat of the beaches ( and crowds ) the ability to “ get out “ find your own space to take a dip with min hassle .

Every boats a comprise .

@ the op I wouldn’t mark down climbing out of a ladder lots do and I have many old folk cope amicably.Remember agility, swimming , walking etc is the prime reason you are there . Bungalow leg etc etc .

It may be helpful if AGAIN post a few pics to help posters advise further .