A good yacht for single handing and Cruising 4 crew any suggestions?

[Boeingdr]

I presently own a Seamaster815. A lovely boat but I am thinking of moving to something a little bigger next season, or the following.
However I quite often sail single handed and find the seamaster manageable.
When not sailing alone mostly I sail with my wife and occasionally with the whole family (4).
What I am after is a boat with more room for those times we all sail but it must be manageable single handed.
Any suggestions? What is the biggest boat suitable for single handing?
I sail on the clyde, don't race and have only been sailing a couple of years.
Any comments gratefully accepted!

 

[doug748]

I singlehand a Contessa 32 which I find very good on a number of counts:
It's a steady platform at sea
Low freeboard means she is less skittish at low speed esp useful at close quarters in a wind.
Ditto, picking up moorings and grappling with pontoons.
Small enough to get round deck sharpish when needs be.
Snug below, plenty of places to brace yourself in a breeze.
Stands up to her canvas well. At one time or another we all avoid reefing esp when on our own. Last season I was near a modern boat overpressed as I was; I wa on my ear but sailing higher, faster and he was spending a lot of time facing the wrong way, despite being 4ft longer.
However....
She is not the boat for a grown up family in these modern times. I suggest you might want a quarter cabin.
I am only 5ft 7in (on a good day) If 6ft+ don't bother.
As for max size, a friend regularly singlehands his French 47 footer, including racing and cruising abroad; though I would not relish his reliance on electrical kit. Brian.

 

[Boeingdr]

Thanks for your comments Brian, 40plusft must be a handful singlehanded. Contessa 32 looks like a lovely boat, but you may be right I need to keep my 6ft eldest son happy! which is why I want to go bigger.

 

[hobiecat]

Ever thought about a Prout catamaran or something similiar. Easy mainsail and large roller genoa. Private cabins. lack of heeling means it does not take much physical effort.

 

[David_Jersey]

[ QUOTE ]
is less skittish at low speed esp useful at close quarters in a wind.
Ditto, picking up moorings and grappling with pontoons.
Small enough to get round deck sharpish when needs be.


[/ QUOTE ]

I agree with the above comments, anything (within reason!) would usually be quite manageable at sea for 1 person, I find it is the close quarters stuff that defines "ease of use" and IMO it is more useful with only 1 pair of hands to be able to use the "MK1 brute strength and ignorance" to make up for an inability to be in 2 places at once hence my reasoning of around 30 foot. Although perhaps this is more important when not in a "well padded" /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif Marina Berth or have a bow thruster /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

Depending on the boat and your usual berthing arrangements I would say around 30 foot mark.

What's the budget? and what sort of Keel? - I am guessing you don't need to dry out?

Maybe a Seamaster Sailer 29? /forums/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

 

[Boeingdr]

Thanks David, I agree close quarters work decides what is managable.
Budget depends what I am getting for the money but approx 25K max 40K.
You are correct no need to dry and I operate from a marina.
Prout cat is something I'll have to research Victor I had assumed Cats would be a handfull at close quarters...but that's only based on hearsay!
cheers

 

[chubby]

I have a 32 ft long keel heavy displacement motorsailor ( Barbary Ketch) which I often single hand yet will sleep 4 in comfort and truly separate berths which is a plus for older offspring. It doesn`t handle well in marinas regardless of how many crew you have but in other respects things happen slowly and predictably and you can let go of the wheel to attend to sails, put the kettle on, go to the heads etc without the boat going off course, so consider a long keeler about 30-33ft

 

[Signed Out]

My 35' ia sailable single-handed, but in my so far limited experience, it's getting in and out of a berth that is the difficult part- I'd suggest not going centre-cockpit; this is probably my biggest issue.
Jem.

Mind you, Club Mediterane (?) was built for a single handed transAtlantic... and is 243'!

 

[Boeingdr]

Thanks Chubby, do you berth in a marina or on a buoy?

 

[hobiecat]

Cats with twin engines so wide apart are very simple close quarter handling. Even with a single leg it is pretty easy with a bit of practice. Lighter boats can be pulled in more easily. Strong winds blowing you off a pontoon will be more difficult but I would not fancy it in a heavy mono either - especially on my own.

 

[David_Jersey]

I will not disagree with your experiances (BTW what have you got?a nd what sort of mooring do you keep her on?), but mine is a centre cockpit and causes me no problems (I won't claim I always get my berthing right - but this is down to me!), but the side decks are fairly wide and I keep them uncluttered, particularly the stern - although I am pretty nimble on my feet anyway so can scoot around quite quickly. I find being nearly halfway up the boat actually quite helpful in this respect - but I appreciate experiances vary.

OP, I won't suggest a Seadog cos you won't fit 4 adults in the cockpit in comfort - even though in many other respects she could well be ideal, especially as you have the luxury of being able to go for the Deeper (Single) Keel versions with a larger rig - I dry out all the time so had to go for the triple keeler.

You have a decent budget, plenty to choose from - Maybe spend part of the budget on a Bow thruster, if otherwise the boat ticks all the boxes, apart from size being a problem now and again. If you go for a Macwester Seaforth (36) I will be as sick as a parrot!

 

[TheBoat]

I was single handedly cruising 4 crew the other day and the spanish police were called anyway after a stern warning they let me go.

 

[Signed Out]

I guess it's a large part due to the cockpit being the greatest (in my mind) of a few issues- another thing I find that antagonises the situation is coming in with my lifting keel (she's a Bill Dixon one-off) and rudder up make steerage astern virtually impossible. I know I should probably have a bit of each down, but I have a bad habit of liking to stretch my days to the limit, timewise. My berth is on the bank side of a pontoon up a tidal channel, and has a nasty corner pointing my bow (stern in it would strike). All part of a learning process...

I've been looking into a similar market, although my budget's a bit lower, and have seen lots with potential, all with aft cockpits and full keels- long quite often, although that'll mean a change of berth. I do think a wheel makes solo easier, but for simplicity I'm heading back towards tiller.
Jem.

 

[Boeingdr]

Some really interesting replies. I must have a look at some cats and see what I think, its an area I have yet to explore.
It sounds like a suitable 33-35ft narrow beam design would be ok and may well be the best solution both at sea and berthing.
Does anyone have experience of regular singlehanded sailing of modern type beamy 35-40ft with bow thruster?
Thanks for all the replies.

 

[Aeolus]

Ha! When I saw the subject of your post, I immediately thought 'Seamaster 925'. Then I opened it and saw you have an 815. Have you looked at the 925? It's a bit more spacious, a bit stronger built, still easy to sail single-handed. And you will feel immediately at home. May depend on how often you plan to sail with 4 people - it can accommodate 4, some layouts can sleep 7 (athough I suspect they must be very good friends ;-), however on a continual basis, I'd have thought 4 was at the upper limit and it would probably be more comfortable with 3.

 

[sailorman]

UFO 31, 34 ( watch out for home builds )

Rustler 31 ( a tad slow )

Benny First 32 ( not the new euro blobby ones , mid eighties were better )

Carter 33

Sadler 32, 34

Halmatic 30

Halberg Rassey ( might be too pricey )

Hustler 32

single handed shouldn't be a problem if the boats is "organised" i often s/h my 37 footer /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

 

[David_Jersey]

Sounds a bit of a cow of a berth /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif Before changing boats why not try the change of berth, might alter how you view her??

On a general point I have also found it helps a skipper (me included) to practise berthing with someone on board whos is an emergency pair of hands to fend off ONLY, with firm instructions not to do anything unless asked to or it becomes required (of course you need crew with experiance on a foredeck - this is not always a skipper! - to know when it doesn't need someone waving a boat hook around or who pulls instead of pushes and vice versa).

I find that the helmsman does need to be fairly comfortable with what the boat is likely to do (in at least one direction, usually forward), IMO life gets easier when you can "commit" yourself with a bit of ommph from the motor, rather than holding back and losing / sacrificing steerage way. But it IS a chicken and egg situation, which on my current boat I have not yet completely mastered, haven't hit anyone (yet!)..........but have had my moments, involving 27 point turns!! (especially in Cherbourg Marina where I thought I would be manouvering in the same spot for a month, but I ended up "committing" myself with a lot of welly, safe in the knowledge that my intended berthing "targets" were only MOBO's so any collision wouldn't have "counted" anyway /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif)

 

[chubby]

on a deep water swinging mooring, another issue for deabate but I am happy with a bouy, have easy access to it by dinghy kept in racks on the boatyard jetty with about 100m to row or motor, I can get out ot the boat and off faster tan I could extract from a marina and stow warps and fenders! plus I enjoy the peace and quiet or a bouy and can come alongside if need be at the yard

 

[Signed Out]

It is a pain to enter for sure, but once in, it's very convenient and a lot more affordable than the glam marinas nearby. Quite a trade off though. I've been following that advice with regards to the sailing (luckily my dad and most friends are happy to sit back and enjoy the ride), but I've been a bit more wary with berthing, but time will tell.

Sailorman's list is very similar to what I've been looking at, the Sadler 32 being one of the most persistent ideas (anyone can say if it is tight inside/low headroom?). The 34 however seems a bit cheap inside in the pics and the accom seems no better. The UFOs seem quite similar, but a bit more sporty; a shame some home completed are pretty bad, and a lot had wheel conversion.

Rival 32/34 seem possibilities also, and looking further afield, some Scandinavians like Comfortina could be good. A bit more pricey, but good I believe is the Westerly Fulmar.

One thing I will say though, is that as great as it is to have lines all led aft (yet to do most on mine), it is not really something to base a purchase on as it is something that can be set up fairly simply.

Shame we don't have European/Scandinavian style end-on berthing here; it's so much easier alone.

Jem.

 

[ColinHuggins]

Re: Bouncing off MOBO\'s?

Huh, was going to contribute a sensible post until I read that . . .

Seriously, it strikes me that anyone doing a 27-point turn (I have myself) hasn't worked out the conflict between prop-walk and windage and whether or not prop-wash can help or hinder. So find John Goode's articles about parking and ponder awhile.

And it would seem that you are still thinking about the ends of the boat not the middle. Add stout cleats just for'ard of the beam and make fast/let go there. Pick up moorings from the cockpit, anchor too, and the tricky bits of single-handing do become possible.

But I still can't come alongside an upwind/uptide berth with any success other than entertaining the crowd!