3500 hours .... is that considered excessive for a 12 year old motorboat?

[Bbroomlea]

Thinking about this a little more I think the hours thing is daft. 3500 hours in 12 years is about 5.5 hrs a week, less than an hour a day.

Its had regular use, regular servicing, new diesel every few weeks and looked after I suspect quite religiously given down time costs money in business.

Its probably as good if not better than something sat doing nothing in a marina and getting serviced once every so often

The price alone is tempting for a very late model F42.

If I was in the market and has a service history on vital fluid changes the hours would not bother me. Lets face it, if the engines have got this far then they are probably ok!!!

 

[Rocksteadee]

If this is the boat I think it is, it has been owned by an RYA school that I have trained with and taught for.
That goes in its favour, the school is one of the best in the area, it would have been fastidiously serviced, repaired as soon as required, looked after as normally has an instructor onboard, not thrashed. It is there to train on so couldn’t afford to have it out of service.

Relating to cars I have bought high mileage and low mileage. The low mileage I have always had problems where things break., at great expense. The high mileage things wear out at normal maintenance costs.

As said previously, the biggest killer of engines is not being used

 

[Momac]

I am not sure the year of manufacture makes much difference to value once boats are more than 10 years old.
It's more about condition ,and hours does come into it.

 

[Switch]

Aren’t these engines basically truck engines - to put things into perspective, a 12 year old truck driven for 3500hrs at an average speed 50mph will have only driven 175,000 miles (14500 per annum) I think many truck drivers would be laughing their heads off at some of the ‘doom monger’ comments posted here.

 

[jrudge]

Aren’t these engines basically truck engines - to put things into perspective, a 12 year old truck driven for 3500hrs at an average speed 50mph will have only driven 175,000 miles (14500 per annum) I think many truck drivers would be laughing their heads off at some of the ‘doom monger’ comments posted here.

Apples and pears.

A truck is probably cruising at 20 % power compared to a boat at 70%. Lack of use, salt water etc.

The market thinks it is high hours. That is all that matters!

 

[Switch]

Apples

A truck is probably cruising at 20 % power compared to a boat at 70%. Lack of use, salt water etc.

The market thinks it is high hours. That is all that matters!

You state lack of use as a negative in the marine world but the boat in question has had high use. That in essence is the contradictory nature of the high/low hours debate.

 

[Portofino]

Aren’t these engines basically truck engines - to put things into perspective, a 12 year old truck driven for 3500hrs at an average speed 50mph will have only driven 175,000 miles (14500 per annum) I think many truck drivers would be laughing their heads off at some of the ‘doom monger’ comments posted here.

No they are not derivatives of truck engines .
That’s the point see my post #40 .

Whilst regular use and mitigates against marine ageing , which ever way you turn this the cylinder bores and piston rings , cam lobes , oil pump , crank bearings , are perceived by the market to be waiting for a revision and all the bills that come with that .
Ok you could do some forensics on the oil used and service history , in fact you would be mad not to see that before a viewing and if that’s satisfactory ( pity no mention in the add ? ) then oil analysis .
Which brings me to round to this point ....... wouldn’t it be nice ( because it’s had a commercial life ) to see a detailed chronological oil analysis every 400 hrs to alleviate any further buyers concerns ?

A guess it’s needs a boroscope and compression testing , again same Q wouldn’t it nice to expedite a sale if an independent engineers report with compression results of every cylinder and pics of the bore were there in plain sight before you started the buying process .

The price has to reflect this , the prospective buyers gonna have go to the hassle of this stuff , or should .

So at the moment what’s it got going for it ?

 

[Switch]

No they are not derivatives of truck engines .
That’s the point see my post #40 .

Whilst regular use and mitigates against marine ageing , which ever way you turn this the cylinder bores and piston rings , cam lobes , oil pump , crank bearings , are perceived by the market to be waiting for a revision and all the bills that come with that .
Ok you could do some forensics on the oil used and service history , in fact you would be mad not to see that before a viewing and if that’s satisfactory ( pity no mention in the add ? ) then oil analysis .
Which brings me to round to this point ....... wouldn’t it be nice ( because it’s had a commercial life ) to see a detailed chronological oil analysis every 400 hrs to alleviate any further buyers concerns ?

A guess it’s needs a boroscope and compression testing , again same Q wouldn’t it nice to expedite a sale if an independent engineers report with compression results of every cylinder and pics of the bore were there in plain sight before you started the buying process .

The price has to reflect this , the prospective buyers gonna have go to the hassle of this stuff , or should .

So at the moment what’s it got going for it ?

It’s the cheapest 2007 F42/5 on the market by far - that’s what it’s got going for it.

 

[Portofino]

It’s the cheapest 2007 F42/5 on the market by far - that’s what it’s got going for it.

Then add back quotes from VP for a short block x2 , plus labour plus a whole load of “ while we are in there “ and “ while the heads off “ = ballooning bill(s) ..

The hrs will still be recorded somewhere but at least at resale it can be safe to say fully reconditioned motors .
But do the maths add up ?
Hassle hasn’t been factored in .

 

[Switch]

Then add back quotes from VP for a short block x2 , plus labour plus a whole load of “ while we are in there “ and “ while the heads off “ = ballooning bill(s) ..

The hrs will still be recorded somewhere but at least at resale it can be safe to say fully reconditioned motors .
But do the maths add up ?
Hassle hasn’t been factored in .

Perhaps, but back in the real world it would be good to hear from anyone who’s had to go through the process you’ve just described on D6’s for real.
Anyone???

 

[MRC]

You buy it cheap and then sell it cheap when finished with it.

Pay more for a lower hours boat and sell for more when finished

no saving over buying a lower hours boat in my opinion, plus possibly a wider market to sell to if lower hours.

 

[Portland Billy]

I got a new Squadron 65 in 2015 which has C18 1150hp Cat engines. Five seasons later (though this one far from finished for me ) I've done 960 hours. The boat has fin stabilisers and we tend to potter along at c10 knots for much of the time though do at least 20 mins every 2 hours at 18 knots or so. The crucial thing is the amount of fuel the engines have burnt and my boat has a screen showing lifetime cumulative fuel use since new. If the D6's you're looking at do too then IMHO that's much more important than actual hours. Even if the seller has a spreadsheet showing fuel fills etc then that would be interesting. Notwithstanding the above, and as others have said, engine hours are still seen as one of the main gauges of an engine's wear so have a disproportionate effect on resale values. I'm hoping that with the technology starting to record cumulative fuel burn, that this will start to become an important factor - it's actually a much better indicator of the amount of work an engine's done!

There are plenty of Onan generators with daft hours.

I suppose like your 6000 hour boat

- it is probably not operating under stress
- it will not have continual stop start cycles
- compared to others it has had comparatively little time to rot / rust
- all the moving bit move regularly so won't seize up

It is still wearing. Would I buy it. No. Does it have life in it - probably - you just don't know how long. Will you be able to sell it? At the right price you can sell anything!

Interesting discussion. The boat in question is a 2007 model (a fairly late model for that type). Having a quick look on the internet this boat looks to be the cheapest on the market (I know someone will find a cheaper one but I've only had a quick look) but it's probably the cheapest 2007 model by some margin. I'm just raising the point that the age of the boat has been largely ignored because of the high engine hours. Age has to play some part in the correlation, newer boats are more expensive than older ones of the same model. To my mind at least, the asking price does not seem so unreasonable compared to similar aged F42/5's with much lower engine hours but it does look expensive compared to older boats with lower engine hours. So, a potential buyer has to decide on an older boat with fewer hours or a newer boat with high hours. I don't know the answer to that in this case.

If this is the boat I think it is, it has been owned by an RYA school that I have trained with and taught for.
That goes in its favour, the school is one of the best in the area, it would have been fastidiously serviced, repaired as soon as required, looked after as normally has an instructor onboard, not thrashed. It is there to train on so couldn’t afford to have it out of service.

Relating to cars I have bought high mileage and low mileage. The low mileage I have always had problems where things break., at great expense. The high mileage things wear out at normal maintenance costs.

As said previously, the biggest killer of engines is not being used

 

[mbroom]

Is 3500 hours considered excessive for a 2007 boat with D6 engines on shafts ?

I am a bit flabbergasted by some of the replies. I have a sailboat (wonderful American terminology...) which has cruised the Atlantic and Mediterranean. The engine was new, but now has 900 hours on the clock after 2 years use. I do all my maintenance, and it seems to be in superb condition. Will it disintegrate at 3500 hours, or are motorboat engines of a lesser quality?

 

[kashurst]

I am a bit flabbergasted by some of the replies. I have a sailboat (wonderful American terminology...) which has cruised the Atlantic and Mediterranean. The engine was new, but now has 900 hours on the clock after 2 years use. I do all my maintenance, and it seems to be in superb condition. Will it disintegrate at 3500 hours, or are motorboat engines of a lesser quality?

no, your yacht engine will probably last forever if you look after it and don't run it all day at full throttle.
a planing motorboat engine is a very different thing. The reason people worry about hours on planing motor boats is that the engine(s) are always heavily loaded - load could 70% to 80% of the rated output while the boat is planing. People say they are like lorry engines which last a seriously long time, but a lorry doesn't spend all its time driving up a 1 in 10 hill all day every day.

How long will a planing boat engine last ? depends on too many things, could be 2000 hours could be 20,000 hours.
Problem is no-one knows so people get wary. This particular boat has been used (I think) as a teaching boat so the engines are probably great. Well looked after, used most days,probably most of the time doing mooring exercises so probably had a very easy life. The gearbox clutches may need replacing, lots and lots of gear changes on a school boat - not rocket science and a lot cheaper than rebuilding an engine. So its buyer beware. At the right price arguably a good boat. £135K seems too much to me.

 

[BruceK]

I am a bit flabbergasted by some of the replies. I have a sailboat (wonderful American terminology...) which has cruised the Atlantic and Mediterranean. The engine was new, but now has 900 hours on the clock after 2 years use. I do all my maintenance, and it seems to be in superb condition. Will it disintegrate at 3500 hours, or are motorboat engines of a lesser quality?

No they are not, yes they are stressed more, the driving point to the argument is at this age a boat goes by market value and regardless of whether the market is correct in it's assessment or not, it all boils down to perception and desirability.
Personally I'd see this boat as a bit of a plus but then I'm stupid enough not to bother about resale values. Some wear their boats like it's investment jewellery, but personally I think they've chosen a poorly for a boat is neither.

 

[mbroom]

Thanks for informative and well written replies

 

[MapisM]

Nothing to add to the previous replies, aside from saying that I agree with them.

But if you don't mind me asking, 900 engine hours in 2 years on a sailboat?
I would have thought that the whole point of carrying around a mast and all other associated malarky is to avoid using the engine...

 

[mbroom]

Try sailing in the med... I hate motoring, but wind here is effing useless most of the time, especially when you have deadlines to meet.

I suspect a Merry Fisher would have been cheaper....

 

[Momac]

I am a bit flabbergasted by some of the replies. I have a sailboat (wonderful American terminology...) which has cruised the Atlantic and Mediterranean. The engine was new, but now has 900 hours on the clock after 2 years use. I do all my maintenance, and it seems to be in superb condition. Will it disintegrate at 3500 hours, or are motorboat engines of a lesser quality?

I expect your engine ,probably 40hp could be rebuilt ,if required, for a relatively modest sum.
Much bigger cost risk with two 400hp engines.

 

[mbroom]

So

I expect your engine ,probably 40hp could be rebuilt ,if required, for a relatively modest sum.
Much bigger cost risk with two 400hp engines.

So 400hp engines need rebuilt after a few hours?