Would you file a passage plan?

[DPH]

Following last years ruling that all boats should file a passage plan with the coastguard would you actually bother if you’re just port hopping from down to Cornwall?

Am I missing something? I believe the coastguard don’t actually do anything if you fail to close the passage plan.


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[hlb]

You got wrong end of stick. You only need a plan in your head. Or maybe on bit of paper if going a long way and not to sure of way. Then they only want to know about plan, if accident. Best not to have plan. Cos if you had it would be a duff plan cos you had accident. Dint yer!

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Haydn

 

[Observer]

I think you're a bit mixed up (or I am).

There is no requirement that I know of to file a passage plan with anybody. There is a general requirement in Solas Chapter V, regulation 34, as follows:

1. Prior to proceeding to sea, the master shall ensure that the intended voyage has been planned using the appropriate nautical charts and nautical publications for the area concerned, taking into account the guidelines and recommendations developed by the Organization.*

2. The voyage plan shall identify a route which:

2.1 takes into account any relevant ships' routeing systems

2.2 ensures sufficient sea room for the safe passage of the ship throughout the voyage

2.3 anticipates all known navigational hazards and adverse weather conditions; and

2.4 takes into account the marine environmental protection measures that apply, and avoids, as far as possible, actions and activities which could cause damage to the environment.

This regulation applies to all vessels regardless of size at all times if "proceeding to sea".

There has been some debate about whether a passage plan is necessary for all passages. The answer, imo, is "yes" - but the type and extent of the passage plan can vary widely. In familiar waters, my plan for Portsmouth to Cowes is Mk1 eyeball (unless, say, there is thick fog) and I wouldn't write down anything. For a slightly longer hop, say Portsmouth to Lymington, I might note down the relevant waypoints pre-programmed in my GPS in case I decided I wanted to be lazy and set a route. For a longer trip in unfamiliar waters I would do the job more fully. Reading and noting information from relevant pilots, noting VHF channel numbers etc. The extent of the plan in any case would be dependent on existing knowledge and perception of hazard.

For the full text of Solas Chapter V see <A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.mcga.gov.uk/publications/SITE/safetyofnavigation/index.htm>http://www.mcga.gov.uk/publications/SITE/safetyofnavigation/index.htm</A>

The safety scheme encouraged by the Coastguard is quite different. It consists simply of a call (usually VHF ch 67) to the local (to departure point) coastguard at time of departure advising them of name and type of vessel, souls on board, destination and ETA. I believe that they log this information and (if applicable) pass it on to other coastguard stations on your intended route. I'm not sure what they do after that.

I have used this on several occasions - if a coastal hop is an appreciably long distance and/or if the weather conditions are adverse. For example, I did so on a passage from Weymouth to Portsmouth when it was blowing westerly 6 with gale warning. If it had been a flat sea with lots of other boats around, I may have felt it unnecessary. We all have to make our own decisions on what's sensible in any given circumstances.

I should emphasise that as a matter of courtesy (if nothing else), the local coastguard should be called to notify them of safe arrival at destination. The CG66 scheme facilitates these safety calls.


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[hlb]

Ey. I'd watch it if I were you. Thats nearly as long as H1.

To put you in the picture. Using the safty scheme is about as much use as a chocalate fire guard. Unless you have informed Friends or others of your ETA.They ring coast guards and coastguards look up your VHF message. If no phone call. Nothing gets done. I leared all this from the coast guard, cos I forgot to radio them when in Guernsey. So rang the Guernsey CG and asked them to let Brixham know. They said, i need nt have bothered.

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Haydn

 

[Observer]

Yes, possible breach of copyright - except I did acknowledge the source.

Your info on safety scheme (think I knew it actually) does call into question the point of the exercise - although, to be fair, it's hard to see how they could do much more. I suppose there is some advantage in having logged details with CG so, if worried relation calls, CG have some basic information to hand and perhaps an idea where to start looking.

I was slightly more interested in provoking discussion on the passage plan issue as it seems to me that many people are living in the belief you must have a full written PP as soon as you stick your nose out to sea.


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[hlb]

I dont have a plan, when I've arrived. Never mind when I set off!!

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Haydn

 

[BrendanS]

I've posted this many times, but still relevant. Spoke to RYA legal on behalf of my club, when trying to ascertain responsibilities for club cruises.

Legal guy put it this way: as an example, the raggies head off round the Isle of Wight for a huge race every year. 95% of them have skippers who know the route, and possible dangers, and safe havens. Passage plan would consist of checking tides and weather. The other 5% have never been round the island before, so passage planning should consist of getting charts out, and doing some real planning, with notes.

It's all in the context of knowledge and experience.

<hr width=100% size=1>Err, let me know if Depsol enters the forum, I'll go and hide

 

[Jools_of_Top_Cat]

so how would that stand up in court, I did not look at a chart as I know the waters your honour.

So could you tell the ladies and gentlemen of the jury why you grounded on the brambles causing a hazard to shipping.

Not tying to be an arse, but when would someone know it was safe to go without a good check, seems very wishy washy to me this.

<hr width=100% size=1><font color=blue> Julian </font color=blue>

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[BrendanS]

Common sense.

If you don't know where brambles bank is, you should have looked at chart first

If you don't know when it's safe to pass over brambles bank, you should have looked at both chart and tide tables and made some calculations

In your example your guilty, and would be prosecuted if you caused an accident. Pretty simple really

<hr width=100% size=1>Err, let me know if Depsol enters the forum, I'll go and hide

 

[ccscott49]

C'mon Haydn, Tuuts told me she makes you file a passage plan, when you go to the pub, from the house, with waypoints and everything, so to be sure you can find your way home again, unless of course Harry is with you, he knows his way home!!

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[hlb]

He knows the chiropodistis coming next week. So he's weight training!!

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Haydn

 

[DPH]

Thanks for clearing that up. What you say about the passage plan makes sense and is how I understood it last year.

My confusion arose after attending a VHF course in March. The instructor mentioned that if going out of the Solent then you must file a passage plan with the coastguard. I did say at the time that I thought a passage plan was just a plan of your route considering conditions etc but he really was adamant that the coastguard needs informing of your route. Obviously he was referring to the safety scheme that I hadn’t heard of before. Nice to know that this is not compulsory!


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[jhr]

But but but

My understanding is that you don't need to make a passage plan when the trip is within designated areas such as the Solent, Poole Harbour etc.

So, in theory, you don't need to make a passage plan to take a 16' open sportsboat from Lymington to Bembridge in a F6, whereas you do need to make one to go out to Studland from Poole, in your F46, on a calm Sunday afternoon.

Ridiculous examples, of course, and no doubt if you ended up on the Brambles and caused a hazard you would probably be clobbered for being negligent whether you'd made a passage plan or not, and serve you right for being a twit.

Yes, it's all a bit wishy washy but I suppose the alternative is much tighter statutory regulation and I know which I'd prefer...............

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[longjohnsilver]

Brambles Bank

I keep on hearing about this place, presume it's somewhere between Soton and IOW, where exactly is it?

Just curious as I'm not likely to hit it coming out of Exmouth!

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[hlb]

Re: Brambles Bank

The Brambles bank is a few yards east of Thorn Reach. Brambles Q(9)10s Racon Bell marks the passage as does South Brambles G f1 G25s if going East. Does this Help!!

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Haydn

 

[longjohnsilver]

Re: Brambles Bank

Can now picture exactly where it is, why didn't anyone else mention Thorn Reach??!!

And I never knew you were a walking talking chart encyclopaedia. So where's Studland Bay?

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[tcm]

Re: Brambles Bank

This is a shoal area right slap bang in the middle of the solent, between cowes and the hamble. Big ships have to go acros the north of it, or around the east and south. The shortest route along the solent east to west passes to the south of it. At very low water, local funsters have been known to dinghy up to it and play a watery game of cricket here.

Countless people run aground all around the uk, but running aground here is pretty publicly embarassing because it is indeed so well known. You would need a big sign saying "ah but, see, somebody else was skipper and navigator, not me". But I would still roll my eyes and make tsking noises, as would everyone else.



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[milltech]

Who, in your quoted text, is "The Organisation". Sounds a bit like something from a spoof spy thriller?

<hr width=100% size=1>John
<A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.allgadgets.co.uk>http://www.allgadgets.co.uk</A>

 

[jhr]

Re: Brambles Bank

There's actually a "Brambles Yacht Club" with membership open only to those who have ended up spending some involuntary time resting there. It has a large membership )

It was set up by a reasonably well known yottie, but I can't remember who. Not Bob Fisher, I think - he prefers relaxing at the Needles........

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[Observer]

It would be the IMO (International Maritime Organisation) who are responsible for SOLAS.

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