Wind Farms - Air Traffic are worried...

[EdEssery]

This weeks Computing newspaper has a front page story with the headline:

Wind farms disrupt air traffic radar systems

The story reads:
"Air traffic controllers are struggling to overcome a significant technology problem - how to make radar systems differentiate between an aircraft and a wind farm.

A wind turbine's spinning propellers are picked up as clutter or noise on radar screens, and can even obscure low-flying aircraft when they pass out of the line of sight behind a turbine.

The issue affects flights across the world and airport operator BAA describes the effect on radar screens as similar to 'flying into a snowstorm of planes'.

There are two possible solutions: either relocating the wind farm, or implementing more advanced software that can tell the two objects apart.

But a working software application has yet to be developed. 'A company has a program under development for this, but it's not there yet', said a spokesman for the UK's National Air Traffic Service (NATS).

The problem is holiding up ScottishPower's wind farm expansion plans south of Glasgow because of safety concerns raised by NATS over possible interference with flights.

'We don't object to wind farms, but the placement of them is crucial', said a NATS spokesman."

So who is taking a lead from who here - NATS from the RYA or the RYA from NATS?! It seems wind farms are a navigational nightmare whichever way you look at them.

Ed

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[starboard]

I will confirm that this indeed is the case. Wind farms already situated on a hill 20 miles from Prestwick airport do show on the airport radar as a permanent echo. Normally the electronics within the system would not display the echo as it is stationary...although in this case it is and it is'nt if you get my drift!!!

Paul.

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[Sans Bateau]

Someone should ask the Dutch how they deal with the problem, the country is covered with wind farms, as any visitor will know.

Aside from the particular issue of the effect on radar, I think that windfarm wind mills are rather magestic. I was supprised how slowly they turn. The first ones that I saw was earlier this year, off the coast of Arklow. Just recently, on a trip to Holland I was able to witness the effect of force 8 - 9 winds on the mills, they still turned quite slowly.



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[beachbum]

I believe they change the pitch and/or gearing according to wind speed, so as to create more torque rather than more speed (which translates into more current rather than more volts).

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I am nobody.
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[pragmatist]

Sounds as though the UK s/ware is as good as ever. Once had the misfortune to share an office with the team testing the Nimrod early warning system. They had a problem with low-flying aircraft because the validation was very simple :

If > 50m then = aircraft
If <= 50m then = ship

They had a lot of "it's a plan - no it's a ship - no it's a plane" scenarios !

<hr width=100% size=1>a pragmatist is an optimist with a boat in the UK - but serious about not being in the UK !

 

[peterb]

Are they using Doppler radar? If the target's range is changing, then the frequency of the returned signal is greater or less than the transmitted signal, depending on whether the target is moving towards or away. The tip speed on the new wind farms is about 200 knots. With one tip moving towards and the other moving away, no wonder the poor system is confused!

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[Gunfleet]

Surely they'd have been better off using speed... if it's doing over fifty knots it's a hell of a boat, if it's doing under it's a hell of a plane (actually Lysanders' stall speed was 50 knots, which is why SOE used them, but that's another subject)

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[pragmatist]

I think they'd have been better off getting a system designer - cost plus govt project where everyone was not just encouraged to work slowly but told how much they might achieve per week to ensure the logevity of the project ! The recent govt initiated computer systems sound about as efficient !

And our Lysander never made more than about 4 knots as I recollect !

<hr width=100% size=1>a pragmatist is an optimist with a boat in the UK - but serious about not being in the UK !

 

[mirabriani]

"During the War"........
Well, rather earlier than that
A large concrete structure was built at Dungeness to reflect the noise of planes
The idea was to provide an early warning system of enemy aircraft (a very crude early form of radar)
At a demonstration, the dignitaries and ministers were all lined up and sure enough a faint noise slowly gained in volume. Every body expectantly
peered out to sea to catch a glimpse.
At long last a milk float trundled into sight!!!!
Incidently they still exist, known locally as "the listening ear"
Regards Briani

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