Why do some of us expect the RNLI to act as a marine recovery service?

[Bav34]

Why do some of us expect the RNLI to act as a marine recovery service?

Simply because they don't charge!

I know this is a contentious subject, but we spend the best part of our cruising year in France.

I would estimate 99% of 'the rescues' that we have seen have been carried out by other nearby boats.

Knowing that it can cost them 800E for a lifeboat seems to focus the average Frenchman on self-reliance.

 

[OGITD]

Yep!

OGITD, there have been known situations, where there was either not enough wind to gain control under sail or too much to wind to hoist sails, this combined with an engine failure and running out of sea room,is reason enough to call out the brigade and accept a tow.
C_W

Totally agree CW …. but I would class this as a danger to life and or shipping incident.

But to call on the services just because you have an engine failure.

There are a few of us who have sails, inboard, outboard on transom bracket and the
outboard for their tender which they could use secured alongside.

 

[prv]

Any vessel rescued or crew rescued should be charged a fee which in turn would be paid by the vessels insurers (ie exactly the same way the fire and ambulance service charge).

Eh? If someone's insurance is paying for my local fire service, can I have the money back from my Council Tax please? Likewise I'm sure the NHS will be delighted to hear they don't have to fund ambulances any more.

The rescue services should NOT be treated as a free AA service.

As a moral or philosophical question, I absolutely agree. As a practical one, I don't think there's a problem here that needs solving. Every lifeboat man I've ever come across seems to love getting to go roaring about in his big orange toy, stations seem to have so many volunteers turning up for each shout that they have to have systems to make sure everyone gets a fair go, and the organisation doesn't appear to be short of funds to pay for it all.

Pete

 

[obmij]

"There are a few of us who have sails, inboard, outboard on transom bracket and their outboard for their tender which they could use secured alongside"


50% of rescues were of commercial shipping.

15% Sailing yachts

Who knows what the circumstances were?

 

[sailorman]

"There are a few of us who have sails, inboard, outboard on transom bracket and their outboard for their tender which they could use secured alongside"


50% of rescues were of commercial shipping.

15% Sailing yachts

Who knows what the circumstances were?

mechanical failure was mentioned in 50% on incidents

 

[Searush]

Eh? If someone's insurance is paying for my local fire service, can I have the money back from my Council Tax please? Likewise I'm sure the NHS will be delighted to hear they don't have to fund ambulances any more.

(snip)Pete

It doesn't work like that & well you know it. Where possible users are charged, but it frequently isn't possible to charge for all services. Both services would cost a lot more if there wasn't some user charging.

Anyway, the RNLI objective is to provide a free life saving service & they are dead set against charging - possibly because it would hit their charitry collections quite hard if people thought users paid.

 

[[2068]]

The rescue services should NOT be treated as a free AA service.

The motoring analogy doesn't really map well to the marine world, even when comparing Sea Start to the AA.

1.) Home Start: Sea Start will attend your home berth for a breakdown. AA Home start will fix your car on the driveway. Try calling the Coastguard saying "My engines won't start" from your home berth and see what happens when you give your location.

2.) Rescue: There is some overlap here. The Sea Start service will attempt to repair you, and will tow you to the nearest safe refuge. The AA similarly. The RNLI will NOT attempt to repair your engine, but you might get a tow to the nearest safe haven. Or it might be another entirely different rescue service that performs the tow. But, it's a RESCUE. The objective is to save life and property, not to be arguing over who will foot the bill before the tow commences.

3.) Recovery: Sea Start will not tow you all the way to your final destination, if it is not the nearest safe refuge. Nor will the RNLI. You could try and ensnare a passing ferry, but you could end up in Cherbourg instead of Lymington.

In the Rescue scenario, how many people would actually accept a tow from the RNLI, and would contribute NOTHING when asked to do so (and were not offshore members or similar) - I think this is a very small group of boaters.

 

[Cardo]

One point that doesn't really seem to be discussed, although it was mentioned briefly by a previous poster:

The RNLI appear to have more volunteers than they can shake a stick at and plenty of £££ in the bank. They seem more than happy to take these calls, even the silly ones.

So what's the problem?

 

[OGITD]

The problem is!

So what's the problem?

I think one of the problems is getting all of those and their respective vessels who take to the sea up to a good, safe, serviceable and competent level. (could be a “bag-of-worms” here.)

 

[Cardo]

I kept seeing people mentioning being an RNLI Offshore member so I had to look up what that meant.

Blatant rip from RNLI's website:

Shoreline - our most popular membership, from £28 a year or £2.33 a month.
Offshore - designed for all water users, from £68 a year or £5.67 a month.
Governor - all the features of Shoreline and Offshore plus voting rights at our AGM, from £86 a year or £7.17 a month.
Storm Force - designed for our younger supporters aged 5-10, £7.50 a year.

So your membership is dependent on your contribution.

So why do people say one should be an Offshore member? Do we not like Shoreline contributors?

I just dug out my membership card, apparently I'm an Offshore member even though I contribute more than the £7.17/month required to be a Governor. Why am I not a Governor, hmm?

 

[sailorman]

I kept seeing people mentioning being an RNLI Offshore member so I had to look up what that meant.

Blatant rip from RNLI's website:



So your membership is dependent on your contribution.

So why do people say one should be an Offshore member? DO we not like Shoreline contributors?

I just dug out my membership card, apparently I'm an Offshore member even though I contribute more than the £7.17/month required to be a Governor. Why am I not a Governor, hmm?

One is a Governor @ £86

 

[Cardo]

One is a Governor @ £86

per year.

 

[kyleview]

The thing that really worries me is that lots of non sailing people donate and support the RNLI based on thinking that they are saving commercial fishermen and merchant ships - a very good cause.

However when they realise that a lot of their hard earned money is going towards saving pretty well off sailors things may change - if I were the RNLI I would be really concerned about this trend, particularly in these stretched times.

I have been an offshore member for years, and as a keen cruising type think it's a good insurance policy, hopefully never to be used. Would I be so keen to be a member / donate if I did not sail - who knows, but I would certainly think twice knowing who most of those "rescues" were.

 

[[2068]]

However well-maintained, complex mechanical (and electronic) systems will still fail in unusual and unpredictable ways. It's always been so, and it probably always will be.

 

[[2068]]

Why am I not a Governor, hmm?

I think you just have to ask, else they assume you just want to be a more generous offshore member.

 

[Cardo]

I think you just have to ask, else they assume you just want to be a more generous offshore member.

I just like the sound of it.

Though I like the fact they seem to think I might be capable of anything "offshore"

 

[Sandyman]

Experience and knowledge is such a grey area, but insurance can be made black & white.

Simples! …. if you are recovered without insurance then you forfeit your vessel

TOTAL HOGWASH

However well-maintained, complex mechanical (and electronic) systems will still fail in unusual and unpredictable ways. It's always been so, and it probably always will be.

Indeed but if more peeps knew a bit more about their engines other than where the dieso goes in & where the start switch is located, had their engines properly service, and knew at least the basics of what to do when it breaks down, there would be less call outs such as this. But of course they don't like getting their little pinky fingers covered in grease do they.

 

[Bosun Higgs]

Surely the question should be "Why do some of them expect the RNLI to act as a marine recovery service?". None of us would behave in such a manner.

We've already discovered just how perfect we are in that banned sailing school discussion so of course none of us would ever be caught out. That only happens to people who dont use the forum.

 

[[2068]]

But of course they don't like getting their little pinky fingers covered in grease do they.

I think there's a set of callouts that could probably have been prevented by better maintenance, but without aviation-style root cause analysis of each failure and some proper stats, we are in the realms of speculation as to what proportion this is.

 

[OGITD]

I agree!

TOTAL HOGWASH

Sandy I have to agree!

Your “Total Hogwash” is just that … total hogwash.

IMHO (aka my point is):
If there are those out there who take to the sea, without appropriate training, experience and knowledge. Also on vessels ill-equipped for most if not all weathers and in a badly maintained condition without insurance then they must be prevented from going out there...... did I say ..... simples!