What's the worst sailing boat?

[flaming]

Tinker traveller.

Absolutely excellent idea, motored well, rowed excellently, sailed like the very slow catamaran with rope rigging that it basically was, and drew more than the main boat in sailing mode! That daggerboard was ridiculous.

 

[Iain C]

Laser Vortex. All 3 foils were identical, so none of them exactly optimised for the job. And a cat with one rudder...go figure.

Not wide enough for the cat "hull flying" experience, but wide enough to not roll through tacks which made it hideously slow through the corners, especially with no jib. Chuck it in the p1ss and it drifts downwind on its side faster than you can swim, to the extent that the SIs for races were changed so that if you received "outside assistance" (getting picked up by a rib and put back in it) you didn't have to retire. Marketed as a "tunnel hull" which provides lift. Yeah right. Laser Vortex...kill it with fire.

It's one and only saving grace was the girl in the original advert.

 

[Seajet]

I like all boats, they all have a bit of character and I make a point of trying new ( to me ) designs, even if not the latest trendy dayglo job, in fact I think overall the more traditional boats handle in a much sweeter way.

When I say I like all, there is one exception - the Express dinghy !

This thing went into a death roll off the wind in a F4, and despite having the time to try tweaking the centreboard position and the rather minimalist kicker etc, the gyrations increased to something like an astronaut gets in training, and over it went.

Then the optimistically named ' buoyancy tanks ' flooded with an interesting stream of bubbles to keep us entertained.

 

[johnalison]

The Firefly could do an interesting manoeuvre if you tried to go on the plane with the plate fully down. It would simply bury its bow in the water, when you would either submerge or trip over and capsize the traditional way.

 

[dom]

This thing went into a death roll off the wind in a F4, and despite having the time to try tweaking the centreboard position and the rather minimalist kicker etc, the gyrations increased to something like an astronaut gets in training, and over it went.

Then the optimistically named ' buoyancy tanks ' flooded with an interesting stream of bubbles to keep us entertained.

...all you were missing was a Hamlet cigar

 

[Seajet]

The Firefly could do an interesting manoeuvre if you tried to go on the plane with the plate fully down. It would simply bury its bow in the water, when you would either submerge or trip over and capsize the traditional way.

Funny you should mention that, I once saw a Lark do an impressive nose dive in a lake, the skipper of ' Das Boot ' would have been proud !

Was your Firefly on a fresh water lake or river by any chance ?

I found dinghies like my Caricraft 10, Topper and Scorpion for instance all showed a tendency to nose dive in fresh water, but not in salt which they were presumably designed for.

The Express dinghy was special though, it wouldn't have handled properly if one filled it with helium and strapped on Thunderbird 2's stabiliser rockets !

 

[V1701]

The worst boat I ever been on was a westerly centaur. It was a caravan and the ceiling was falling down...

 

[LittleSister]

The Firefly could do an interesting manoeuvre if you tried to go on the plane with the plate fully down. It would simply bury its bow in the water, when you would either submerge or trip over and capsize the traditional way.

Ah! That's why it kept doing that, is it? (I used to sailed one single handed, and almost always left the plate down as I already had my hands full and thought I'd lose less speed by concentrating on sails and where I was going.)

 

[Channel Sailor]

A dinghy hired on a Goan beach in th 1990s. As we bumped into the first breaker to get through the surf, the mast fell down. The mast was rotten at the rigging fixings!

 

[Seajet]

The worst boat I ever been on was a westerly centaur. It was a caravan and the ceiling was falling down...

The Centaur is a fine sailing machine and will get one from Point A to Point B very efficently & safely, just without much enjoyable helm feedback.

.All depends what one wants, an Aphrodite 101, Rustler, nuclear submarine or HMS Victory won't suit everyone.

 

[Iain C]

Going to be controversial here, but let's not forget...the Laser.

True "one design" racing where the best person wins...apart from the fact that the boats aren't weight equalised so you'd best hope you get a light one. A rudder that is clearly too small. You've never been allowed to rig up something made out of a piece of plastic or bungee to stop the mainsheet hooking over the quarter during a gybe as it's "one design" and that's not fair, however when Laser introduce an enormously expensive retro fitted sail control system that works, that's ok, as long as you buy it from Laser. Sails must be from Laser, so they are all identical, and non Laser training sails are "illegal". However if Sir would like to pay £55 extra for a rolled, rather than folded sail, for a performance advantage, that's ok. They have a well known problem with cracking mast pots, which Laser choose to ignore. However when a small British manufacturer started making an oversized rig, to effectively make a different class using the Laser hull for heavyweights, Laser started jumping up and down and talking about voided warranties.

Chuck in the whole Kirby Torch and other manufacturer/designer royalty claims and the whole thing becomes a "you couldn't make it up" fiasco over a boat that has enjoyed far more success than it ever deserved. Don't get me wrong, we probably have 20 of them out on a Wednesday night at our club, offering fantastic close racing, which I guess does prove that in fact, you can polish a turd after all.

 

[johnalison]

Ah! That's why it kept doing that, is it? (I used to sailed one single handed, and almost always left the plate down as I already had my hands full and thought I'd lose less speed by concentrating on sails and where I was going.)

Didn't anyone tell you? It was common knowledge.

The Firefly was at its best single-handed, and as I was about nine stone as a teenager it would plane on a mere puff. It always blew a hoolie for our club's single-handed race though.

 

[southseaian]

Probably a Heavenly Twins cat. I had to go on one to test a guy for his ICC.
The test includes a display of basic sailing skills. Out in Southampton water I suggested we went over there indicating a mark up wind. After twenty minutes we were further from the mark than when we started.
After any number of "beam reaches" I realised our lack of progress was due more to boat design than lack of candidates skills. This boat just would not sail towards the wind.
He got his ICC and went of to tackle the French canals. which was a relief as when he told me he was on his way to the Med I had pictured Biscay.

Apologies to any Heavenly owners. The boat did however have lots of room for bikes on the aft cabin top, a great plus point in rural France.

 

[lw395]

RS600 on a bad day.
Also one of the best on a good day....

 

[Concerto]

It is funny this thread seems to be concentrating on dinghies, not cruisers.

I wish to add a solid old cruiser that my parent's used to own which they bought new in 1965. A Kingfisher 30. It was heavy, undercanvased, could not point, carried an unbalanced rig causing massive weather helm, plus bilge keels and three bladed prop did not help the speed. One bank holiday weekend we cruised in company with a Nich 32 and a Twister, to keep up we kept having to motor sail!

 

[lw395]

It is funny this thread seems to be concentrating on dinghies, not cruisers.
....!

I hesitate to name any cruisers, because I rate those I've owned quite highly, and those of other people's I've not really liked may not be bad boats, not just not boats for me.

I dislike anything that won't point, is too heavy, won't handle a bit of weather, etc etc, but if somebody enjoys owning or using it, it's a good boat.
For them, not me!

 

[Seajet]

I hesitate to name any cruisers, because I rate those I've owned quite highly, and those of other people's I've not really liked may not be bad boats, not just not boats for me.

I dislike anything that won't point, is too heavy, won't handle a bit of weather, etc etc, but if somebody enjoys owning or using it, it's a good boat.
For them, not me!

+1, well said !

 

[Rivers & creeks]

Iroquois cat - what's the point? A cruising cat that anyone can capsize. We didn't but one trip was enough.
Heavenly Twins on a beat was a pig, on every other point of sail it was divine.
But for sheer unmitigated awfulness to sail it has to be a Westerley 22. It also suffers from the Anderson 22 problem of no side decks so you have to crawl through a Forehatch to change a sail or crawl over the coachroof.

 

[Seajet]

Clueless about the Anderson 22, have you ever sailed one ?

The coachroof is wide for good reasons; headroom when sitting below, and more importantly, upper buoyancy in heavy seas, for the same reason Arun etc lifeboats have high coachroofs; the A22's coachroof is not that high, but it is wide, I once asked a novice crew to open the curtains ( we'd left in a hurry ) knowing the bow wave was halfway up the windows - you can probably guess his response, the second word was ' Me ! '

Going to and from the foredeck is easy - I retain hanked headsails for performance and fun - the swept shrouds make good handholds, going on deck is easy.

And she sails well, not like a shed.

 

[jwilson]

Going to be controversial here, but let's not forget...the Laser.

True "one design" racing where the best person wins...apart from the fact that the boats aren't weight equalised so you'd best hope you get a light one. A rudder that is clearly too small. You've never been allowed to rig up something made out of a piece of plastic or bungee to stop the mainsheet hooking over the quarter during a gybe as it's "one design" and that's not fair, however when Laser introduce an enormously expensive retro fitted sail control system that works, that's ok, as long as you buy it from Laser. Sails must be from Laser, so they are all identical, and non Laser training sails are "illegal". However if Sir would like to pay £55 extra for a rolled, rather than folded sail, for a performance advantage, that's ok. They have a well known problem with cracking mast pots, which Laser choose to ignore. However when a small British manufacturer started making an oversized rig, to effectively make a different class using the Laser hull for heavyweights, Laser started jumping up and down and talking about voided warranties.

Chuck in the whole Kirby Torch and other manufacturer/designer royalty claims and the whole thing becomes a "you couldn't make it up" fiasco over a boat that has enjoyed far more success than it ever deserved. Don't get me wrong, we probably have 20 of them out on a Wednesday night at our club, offering fantastic close racing, which I guess does prove that in fact, you can polish a turd after all.

Everything true, but still good fun on a breezy day. I had sailed them a few times before when I bought one as an off-the-beach fun boat. My son hijacked it and put new thin strings on it and polished/faired up the hull and foils to race, so I had to buy another.