Was there ever a more crazily overpriced bit of boat gear…

[fredrussell]

…than the Barton lazy jacks kit?

£274 at Force 4 currently. I mean, it’s just some line and a few mini-blocks isn’t it? Just for a bit of balance, I actually like Barton, so don’t wish to criticise - the Barton traveller I fitted is very nice and works very well, and at least half the price of lewmar or harken.

 

[pvb]

It's "only" £117 at Marine SuperStore - Barton Lightweight Lazy Jack Kit

 

[[70521]]

…than the Barton lazy jacks kit?

£274 at Force 4 currently. I mean, it’s just some line and a few mini-blocks isn’t it? Just for a bit of balance, I actually like Barton, so don’t wish to criticise - the Barton traveller I fitted is very nice and works very well, and at least half the price of lewmar or harken.

How much do you charge for your time and skill in collecting the bits, assembling them, doing the whippings, fitting and adjusting everything?

 

[fredrussell]

Ah, well £117 a bit more reasonable to be fair. The Farce 4 one must be a heavier duty one. On my last boat I used stainless rings instead of blocks. Worked just the same. Whole thing was about 30 quid iirc

 

[fredrussell]

How much do you charge for your time and skill in collecting the bits, assembling them, doing the whippings, fitting and adjusting everything?

To you Sandy, I’ll do it for £100, but I don’t know when I’m next down your way.

 

[Refueler]

C'mon ... MARINE !

Caravan stores have been selling hatch stays ... locks ... gas fittings .... all sorts at lower prices for same gear but without the Marina label ...

 

[Moodysailor]

Playing devil's advocate here, remember that Force 4, whist a chain store, are at least a 'brick & mortar' business too, often in prime real estate areas, so they will have higher costs than online only or outlets in cheaper areas.

I'm not defending the marine markup (although I always advise here to ensure you are truly comparing apples to apples) , and I'm not defending F4, as I'm sure many local chandleries will have their view on the chain stores.

What I am saying is that it's good to support local business & brick & mortar stores when possible, otherwise we may find that sooner or later our only way to get whatever widget it is we need is to crack open the phone & wait for a delivery to the marina....

I write this whilst waiting for my Amazon delivery of LED lights, so I totally get the contradiction and personal paradox. Please don't shoot!

 

[pvb]

Ah, well £117 a bit more reasonable to be fair. The Farce 4 one must be a heavier duty one.

It's not heavier duty, it's the "lightweight" version, suitable for boats up to 30ft, exactly the same as the one at Marine SuperStore.

 

[Tranona]

NO. Both their website and catalogue show them priced at £135 for the lightweight and £214 for the larger 3 point kit.

Force4 are not always the cheapest but the OP is overstating the "poor value" bit. Lots of bits in the kit and far more sophisticated than bits of string and a few eyes and thimbles.

Whether that level of sophistication is necessary for the job is another matter.

 

[Refueler]

Playing devil's advocate here, remember that Force 4, whist a chain store, are at least a 'brick & mortar' business too, often in prime real estate areas, so they will have higher costs than online only or outlets in cheaper areas.

I'm not defending the marine markup (although I always advise here to ensure you are truly comparing apples to apples) , and I'm not defending F4, as I'm sure many local chandleries will have their view on the chain stores.

What I am saying is that it's good to support local business & brick & mortar stores when possible, otherwise we may find that sooner or later our only way to get whatever widget it is we need is to crack open the phone & wait for a delivery to the marina....

I write this whilst waiting for my Amazon delivery of LED lights, so I totally get the contradiction and personal paradox. Please don't shoot!

Its not only Marine gear ... Model Shops have disappeared in many areas ... first it was mail Order - then Online that hit them ... then of course the sellers that did not have premises to maintain - just acted as box movers.
Its prevalent in many product lines ...........

Its OUR fault really ... we all want cheap prices ...

 

[stranded]

Whether that level of sophistication is necessary for the job is another matter.

On advice from a rigger I diyed ours out of a cheapish (c. £80 iirc) eBay reel of 2mm dyneema using simple spliced eyes instead of blocks or rings. 4+ years in, rigged 365 including 2 years in the sun, and still doing fine.

 

[fredrussell]

… the OP is overstating the "poor value" bit. Lots of bits in the kit and far more sophisticated than bits of string and a few eyes and thimbles.

2 x Lazy Jack wire assembly lines, including blocks and pad eyes to be fitted to the mast
1 x Adjustment line to be reeved through the blocks and fittings
1 x Cheek block (To fit to boom)
1 x Curved backing plate (For use when fitting cheek block to curved boom)
1 x Cleat (To fit to boom)
2 x Pad Eyes (to fit to boom)
Rivets & machine screws

£200 (or £274 at F4) for that lot is quite a lot I would say. I’ll price it all up individually and if it’s circa £200 I shall eat humble pie.

 

[KeelsonGraham]

The MOB Retrieval Kit from Duncan Wells/Harken at £495 for a block and tackle plus some nylon bit n bobs must be in the running.

Don’t get me wrong, I have the utmost respect for Duncan and his thoughtful approach to MOB problems. But, really, this pricing is totally bonkers.

 

[[70521]]

To you Sandy, I’ll do it for £100, but I don’t know when I’m next down your way.

I'm up in Kirkwall towards the end of August if that helps.

 

[Richard10002]

It's not heavier duty, it's the "lightweight" version, suitable for boats up to 30ft, exactly the same as the one at Marine SuperStore.

Yes... the version for yachts up to 40ft is £357.95

Barton Lazy Jack Kits for Yachts | Force 4 Chandlery

 

[pvb]

Yes... the version for yachts up to 40ft is £357.95

Barton Lazy Jack Kits for Yachts | Force 4 Chandlery

It seems it's even more complicated than that. Barton now apparently do a second "lightweight" kit which uses nylon line instead of the plastic coated SS wire in the more expensive kit. There's a distinct lack of clarity in their branding, leading to the confusion in this thread.

Barton Lightweight Lazy Jack Kit for Boats | Force 4 Chandlery

 

[Tranona]

2 x Lazy Jack wire assembly lines, including blocks and pad eyes to be fitted to the mast
1 x Adjustment line to be reeved through the blocks and fittings
1 x Cheek block (To fit to boom)
1 x Curved backing plate (For use when fitting cheek block to curved boom)
1 x Cleat (To fit to boom)
2 x Pad Eyes (to fit to boom)
Rivets & machine screws

£200 (or £274 at F4) for that lot is quite a lot I would say. I’ll price it all up individually and if it’s circa £200 I shall eat humble pie.

That is not what is in the £214 (in their catalogue £274 on line) item. It is a 3 point for a start and has fittings that are not available individually. Sure you can do a 3 point set of lazyjacks for less than that as I said (I have done it twice), but this is a complete premium product. If you don't want to pay the price for a better and more comprehensive bit of kit, fine but at least make a comparison that is real.

 

[davidpbo]

£178 for a genuine Yamaha 9.9 rectifier/regulator got me. At £50 it would still have been expensive but I might of bought it.

 

[dleroc]

I fitted the lightweight kit to my Sadler 25. It was a good kit but you need to be careful to get a really heavy duty rivet gun as a 'normal' heavy duty riveter will never cut through the stainless steel rivets.

 

[dunedin]

How much do you charge for your time and skill in collecting the bits, assembling them, doing the whippings, fitting and adjusting everything?

Still need to to the fitting, adjusting etc.

To my mind that kit is over complex anyway. Ours are fastened to the upper spreaders (per the mast manufacturer design) and have simple lightweight rings rather than pulleys (less weight, less wind age, less chafe), and all tied off with bowlines (10 seconds each) other than one end each side with round turn and two half hitches to adjust at the start of the season. So length of suitable string/rope and 6 O-rings. Job’s a good un. (40ft boat, fully battened mainsail and stack pack)