Twin Jubilee Clips or Single Mikalor Supra Clamp?

[Yellow Ballad]

Here's one for the masses.

I'm replacing all the hoses on the boat out of due course, now they were all single jubilee clipped without any issues but I know the done thing is to double clip them. I'm not a massive fan of jubilee clips but I have used and sold Mikalor clamps for years and like the fact they are wide with rolled edges with a stainless bolt holding them together.

The only down side is because they are wider I can probably only get one on each barb/tail. All my through hulls under the water have a sea cock (which is always shut when not on the boat) so could be closed if a clamp/hose failed whilst at sea.

What are the thoughts? Anyone had issues with the Supra clamp? Double clipping just a scare story or serious issue and is this because of jubilee clips failing or something else?

 

[pvb]

Using twin jubilee clips is old-style safety, when better methods weren't available. A single Mykalor Supra would be fine.

 

[NormanS]

Personally, I think that double clips is a scare story. When you try to remove a correctly sized hose from a proper hose tail, having slackened off the clips, how easily does it come off? Having said that, all the important hoses on my boat are double clipped with Jubilee type clips, but that's only to satisfy insurance requirements.

 

[pvb]

Having said that, all the important hoses on my boat are double clipped with Jubilee type clips, but that's only to satisfy insurance requirements.

Do some insurers actually specify that?

 

[NormanS]

Do some insurers actually specify that?

Probably not, but the surveyor who did my survey for insurance, noted a hose with only one, and wasn't happy with it. It was very easy to comply.

 

[macd]

Using twin jubilee clips is old-style safety, when better methods weren't available. A single Mykalor Supra would be fine.

I'm inclined to agree, as have many other contributors over the years. And where there's room for only one clamp in such an application, a bolt-type such as the Supra must surely be preferred. In fact any application requiring high torque should have them.

It's worth remembering that by 'jubilee clip', many people simply mean worm-drive hose clips of varying provenance and quality (some at least as good as the originals, some complete junk), to the extent that the expression has lost much of its meaning. And that's without recognising that genuine Jubilee worm-drive clips come in both regular and 'high-torque' spec. Equally, Jubilee and many others make clamps comparable to Mikalor Supras: in Jubilee's case, Superclamps.

 

[seaangler23]

Id go mikalor, make sure it's 316 stainless, had a lesser one rot half through on the stern gland underneath where you couldn't see it! Twin jubilees is fine but half the time the fitting they are put on isn't long enough to safely clamp both on to make a tidy safe job and it would be better to have one well positioned clamp

 

[RivalRedwing]

Do some insurers actually specify that?

mine did last year.. but it was a new insurer and they didn't ask for a new survey so overall I was quite happy to oblige

 

[RichardS]

My boat is built to the USA regulations ...... double clipping on fuel lines only. It's fine.

Richard

 

[Prasutigus]

Do some insurers actually specify that?

Yes mine (Y) did and I complied, where there was room for two.

(Mind you, they insist upon an engine survey to cross the Atlantic. When the engine will not be used...
But for rock-dodging in Britanny, Norway, etc? No mention of the engine, when it might well matter if it starts..)

 

[ghostlymoron]

It usually takes me half an hour with a variety of tools to remove a hose from a tail so unless it's a sloppy fit I can't imagine how a hose can shake itself free. I usually put one good quality jubilee clip on and gave never been asked to double up by my insurer.

 

[JumbleDuck]

It usually takes me half an hour with a variety of tools to remove a hose from a tail so unless it's a sloppy fit I can't imagine how a hose can shake itself free.

Agreed. Double-clipping appears to be a fetish with no evidential justification. Very British too, somehow. There's a reference in one of the "Old Harry" books to a "Westerly from Grimsby, all double clipped hoses and radar reflector the right way up".

 

[doug748]

If you get a survey down the line, your man will probably note there is only one clip, leaving you to argue the toss. Probably easier to get a box of Jubilee clips now and forestall the discussion.
I would reuse the old ones, functional Jubilee clips are often the last artifacts left when an old boat rots back to the earth.

 

[savageseadog]

Our insurance Co. Pants told me once that they lose a few boats a year due to failing hose clips

 

[lw395]

If you get a survey down the line, your man will probably note there is only one clip, leaving you to argue the toss. Probably easier to get a box of Jubilee clips now and forestall the discussion.
I would reuse the old ones, functional Jubilee clips are often the last artifacts left when an old boat rots back to the earth.

You have to give the surveyor a box to tick. They normally find something. Let them find something that's easy to fix.

 

[doug748]

You have to give the surveyor a box to tick. They normally find something. Let them find something that's easy to fix.

Indeed that is the other approach, it has a lot to commend it.

 

[Yellow Ballad]

Thanks all, I thought it would be ok, well no worse then what it was.

 

[Neeves]

If you want to make a surveyor happy use your super clamps and simply add an old jubilee clip as decoration, or tighten it up so that it actually does something. I don't see anything wrong with belt and braces and making an insurance company (or surveyor) happy. From memory are not some water 'pipes' on engines non barbed - I know we have some somewhere, but cannot recall where (but if I had to guess I'd say it was the water intake from the sail drive to engine (and maybe engine) - and I would definitely double clip them (all our water and fuel fittings are twin jubilee clipped).

Jonathan

Edit

From memory, and this is going a long way back, double clipping was demanded prior to, maybe long before prior to, 1990. Our new yacht in the 1989 was all double clipped and I believe every yacht since has been double clipped - based on some standard or recommendation. At some time prior there must have been issues - now long forgotten. But since then - with yachts being double clipped there have been o issues - suggesting it has been effective.

Just because we have forgotten the reasons does not mean it was not an issue. It might merit talking with a sage from then, or before then, as to the reasons - but double clipping is hardly onerous.

close edit

 

[sarabande]

The "must be double-clipped" mantra is surely just a psychological sop to the thought that if one clip is strong, then two must be stronger. Why does need two ? Of one fails for some reason, then another of the same design and specification is also likely to fail for the same reason (basic risk management stuff).

Those Mikalor look sensible, and as if they can be installed and de-installed in a simple way. I hate standard jubilee clips for their habit of springing open just as you are about to start tightening them by putting the tongue into the worm drive, and the ones I come across always seem to have sharp, stamped, edges designed to draw blood at the slightest opportunity.

The only issue I have is that Mikalor seem to have zinc-plated only, but that may be me mis-reading the website.

 

[mikegunn]

This is an interesting thread. Particularly as the only time I’ve had a hose to tail connection “pop”, it failed downstream of the freshwater pump and deposited 500 litres of drinking water into the bilges, despite two Jubilee type clamps!
I’ve noticed that most tails on my vessel lack the length to comfortably accommodate two clamps. So the result where two clamps are fitted is really a bit of a compromise. It’s also impossible to know which of the twin clamps is actually doing the work or whether it’s being shared. I’m now sufficiently convinced by all the arguments for the use single Mykalor Supra type clamps, to embark on a gradual programme of change. As some have also suggested, I’ll only add a second clamp if my insurance co’ insists.
Mike