Trailer Troubles

[Major Catastrophe]

Just got back from North Wales, where I spent an hour or so launching and recovering the boat, with the assistance of the harbour master. Kawasaki volunteered to help, but he was already busy enough with re-wiring his boat, so thanks Richard for the offer.

First of all, so that we all know what I am talking about, this is a picture of the trailer, an SBS ELR4 - 1800 Easy Loader trailer.

I have named the various parts.

The two axles now have retro fitted double rollers to stop the keel hitting them, which has caused quite a lot of damage in the past.

Lovely calm day, with very little wind, ideal in fact for launching tests and Kawasaki's boat is the one on the far right, where all the swearing was coming from!

This is the first attempt and you will see that the trailer is in the 'deep' mode for the launch. For the first recover, the retro fitted rollers on Axle 2 were just level with the surface. The recovery resulted in the keel hitting Spreader 2.


So, we launched again and recovered with the rear rollers, part of the Spreader 1 array, just level with the surface. The result was that the keel hit the V of Spreader 1.

We tried it at intermediate depths and if we were lucky and didn't use much power, or it was a slightly different angle, we variously did, or did not hit something. But, whatever they say, the phrase Easy Loader did not spring to the lips.

The opinion was that it just was not reliable enough to guarantee a damage free recovery, so we towed the boat around to the marine car park and spent much time just staring at it with a mug of tea in the hand.

As more people arrived, most ventured to say that the trailer was not big enough for the boat.

Well, it was supplied by the boat's dealer as the ideal trailer for the boat and it is certainly okay for the weight!

But looking around the boat park we noticed that EVERY other boat on an SBS trailer was on a trailer that more or less matched the length of the boat.

As an example, this is a poor photo of a boat on and identical ELR4 - 1800 Easy Loader trailer and you will see that the rear rollers support the very back of the boat, as do all the other SBS trailers we looked at.

This is my boat and trailer.

Does anyone have any thoughts on this? I have had the boat form new for 2 1/2 years now and it has already been back to the dealers for six months while they fitted the axle rollers and 'tested' it. What are my options? A good lawyer, a new trailer or give up boating, as it is becoming not quite so much fun when I am not at sea?

By the way, on the way back home I took this picture of Puffin Island, just to show you all what you are missing today. Sorry, but when I was a boy I also pulled wings off flies. /forums/images/graemlins/shocked.gif

 

[Sixpence]

First time I've seen the boat on the trailer from that angle and although only very much IMHO , it does look like the trailer's too small for the boat

 

[neale]

A couple of thoughts to ponder.

Spreader 1 could be moved back on the trailer frame a foot or so to provide a bit more support further aft once the boat is loaded.

The roller assemblies on spreader 1 could be moved inboard a bit to lift the front of the hull over the spreader on loading. Because the front of the boat has a deep V, the keel is hitting the spreader before the rollers hit the hull.

Not sure how practical these propositions are, just my initial thoughts.

 

[DAKA]

It would be interesting to know what the weight is on the tow hitch ?

As a rough guide snap a broom handle, stuff one end under the tow hitch and rest on bathroom scales at tow hitch hight.

 

[Sixpence]

Is it just me , or does the front tyre look more compressed than the rear , that would imply to me that the load isn't spread evenly

 

[Major Catastrophe]

[ QUOTE ]

It would be interesting to know what the weight is on the tow hitch ?

[/ QUOTE ]
It's not that much as the car hardly dips at all when I hitch up and it rides very well with no weight distribution problems. I have no complaints there at all.

The reason for that is that it has two engines on the back. A 90 and a 6hp Suzuki.

As to moving the rollers, I could do a trial an error session, but I bought the boat in a 'ready to use' condition and the dealer just faffs about for six months doing nothing very much.

I wonder if they are related to TC?
/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

 

[Sixpence]

OOooooohhh ,,, that's naughty /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

 

[andyball]

firstly look at http://www.sbstrailers.co.uk/trailer_finder.asp to see if yr trailer is actually big enough, according to sbs. It certainly looks short in the pic.

 

[me2]

the trailer is in to deep when you use the engine to push the boat on to the trailer when the boat hits the first roller the bow will rise frist but then the engine will give lift so the bow will dip and hit the trailer try pulling the trailer out until the first axle is in the water and then winch the boat in you can see whats going wrong
the trailer is to short the last rollers should be under the engine

right someone will come along and say i am wrong but i
build 75 to 100 trailers a year
service/repair 125 to 140 trailers a year
fit 500 + towbars a year every year for the past 28 years so its up to you

 

[Major Catastrophe]

Thanks sb1, the first professional reply.

I can't get rollers under the engine, even with a longer trailer, as it hangs off the back! Do you really think the trailer is too short?

We have tried winching, but it is heart attack territory and when I winched it before the retro fitted rollers were added to the axles, it scraped the front part of the keel across the axles and severely damaged it.

The the boat and trailer was sold to me as a "simple solution for the single handed boater." Simply drive the boat on to the trailer, leave a bit of power on while you go forward and clip on the hook.

On Saturday I will try it with just axle 1 in the water and winch it.

Thanks

 

[Major Catastrophe]

[ QUOTE ]
firstly look at http://www.sbstrailers.co.uk/trailer_finder.asp to see if yr trailer is actually big enough, according to sbs. It certainly looks short in the pic.

[/ QUOTE ]

Done all that and it recommends the 1800, which is what I have got. If I add a few inches, it does show the 2000 as well, so it's not a accurate guide, especially as it does not give an option for a Peche Promenade style of boat.

 

[me2]

no i mean under the last part of the hull to which the engine bolts that is where most of the weight is yes the trailer is to short we have the same boat in our boat yard on a sbs trailer and its longer then the boat sadly this year the boat is in the water so i can not get photos for you

 

[Major Catastrophe]

[ QUOTE ]

no i mean under the last part of the hull to which the engine bolts that is where most of the weight is yes the trailer is to short we have the same boat in our boat yard on a sbs trailer and its longer then the boat sadly this year the boat is in the water so i can not get photos for you

[/ QUOTE ]

No matter, that is good information.

These are the rollers they fitted to the axles.

These are other views of the entire set up. The last one was when she was shiny new.

The more I look at it, the smaller the trailer looks!

 

[neale]

Can the winch post be repositioned further forward on the trailer, allowing the whole boat to sit further on the trailer?

In the brochure shot at the top, the winch post is infront of the point where the two trailer sides meet. On your trailer it is behind. The boat could sit a bit further forward which together with moving spreader one a bit aft, could make the whole boat better supported. At the end of the day you need to have the right amount of weight on the hitch, so where the boat sits on the trailer will depend on the centre of gravity of your set up. Having said that it does look like it ain't on the trailer far enough to me.

 

[me2]

yep to small can the winch post go forward it does not look that it will but it might also the lighting set should be on the outside of the outboard with it up which it would be if the trailer went to the back of the boat

 

[gjgm]

send these pictures to SBS and ask them what to do. I m sure they can sort it out

 

[enterprise]

I had an SBS trailer manufactured for our boat, it was not a stock length, the factory lengthened the drawbar to allow the winch post to be moved further forward as Neale sudgests.

Your boat/trailer combo might be OK for capacity but not for the length of your boat.

I would be worried about hull flexing with the rollers shown in their current possition even though the keel is well supported, hope there is no weight on these rollers as they are designed for latteral support only.

The rig is balanced by moving the axle frame forward or back to achieve the desired noseweight but the boat must first sit on the trailer with the transom level with the rear suports.

Bypass your dealer & talk to SBS direct, they are very knowledgable & extreamly helpfull.

Hope this helps.

 

[emcm0025]

Hi there Major,

From how the boat looks on the trailer it really does look to short for the boat. Ive had 5 boats so far and all been on trailers, from a fletcher arrowflight to a crusier 224, on all of them the rear rollers have came either even with the rear of the boat or just a fraction short. The cruiser was on an sbs trailer and never hit against the axels.

Do you know someone with a longer version of an sbs trailer that you could try a launch and recover with to see if it still has the same effect on the boat?

Ewan

 

[Major Catastrophe]

[ QUOTE ]

In the brochure shot at the top, the winch post is infront of the point where the two trailer sides meet.

[/ QUOTE ]

Oh yes. Funny how I didn't see that. I will check it out on Saturday.

[ QUOTE ]
also the lighting set should be on the outside of the outboard

[/ QUOTE ]

I slide it back a bit when it is at home, so I can drop the boarding ladder and get on board, as you can see in the snowy picture. The lighting set can slide out about another 2 feet.

[ QUOTE ]

Your boat/trailer combo might be OK for capacity but not for the length of your boat.

[/ QUOTE ]

Exactly my thoughts.

[ QUOTE ]

I would be worried about hull flexing with the rollers shown in their current possition even though the keel is well supported,

[/ QUOTE ]

The keel isn't supported at all and according to Beneteau should be when travelling.

I agree with the idea that I should talk to SBS directly and could even take it to them as they are not that far from me.

 

[ExcaliburII]

It seems to me that the fundamental problem with this setup is that the boat and trailer are not compatible. Assuming you cannot adjust the height of the roller carriers relative to the spreaders, your hull is too deep a V (at least near the bow) for this trailer. As others have said, it is also too short, as the rearmost roller should be just ahead of the transom to provide proper support.

Probably not what you want to hear, but I would advise changing the trailer for one which is better able to accommodate the shape of your hull. IMHO, (as long as the boat and trailer are lined up straight /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif) there should be no way the keel can contact the structure of the trailer, regardless of how deep or shallow the slipway/water is.

I use a De Graaf trailer which I bought new at the same time as Excalibur II, and I have had absolutely no problems with it, including initially setting it up for the boat. Everything is adjustable, and they even asked what boat it was for so they could supply it in approximately the right configuration. Very helpful. Needless to say, I have no connection with De Graaf, other than as a very satisfied customer.

Happy to provide detailed procedure for initial setting up of the rig if you are interested.