Towing an inflatable

[tarik]

As it is my intention to enter one of the Jester Challenges, I have been thinking about the formal liferaft verses the inflatable scenario. I have both but the former takes up a lot of room. I would like to adapt the inflatable as a l/raft and tow it along behind me - I tow it occasionally now, but what effect or other likely problem would there be if I were to tow the inflatable the whole way - I have been told that it could reduce overall speed by 1/2 a knot, well I can wear that, its a challenge not a race.

Your views/advice wold be most welcome.

Many thanks

David

 

[gregandginas]

You're probably a lot safer at sea than ashore anyway.

Wonderful notion! Lot of factors could screw up the theory... but why not?

I used to climb a lot: seconded extreme grades and led up to those levels. Despite frequently getting into situations where I tensed up... never once, whilst climbing a proper route, was I in more danger than I would have been (say) carrying a basket of washing down the stairs.

I mis-spent my youth kayaking on rock-strewn rapids and waterfalls... but never once got half as worried as I routinely did cycling to school. Same goes with my sea kayaking (often in the biggest tideraces / overfalls we could find, or in and out of caves).

None of this warrants complacency in any sport that might leave one exposed... but within reason, "probably a lot safer at sea than ashore anyway" strikes me as potentially realistic.

 

[Noddy]

I'm sure it has been done before.

The name Bombard springs to mind. I seem to remember he drifted across the Atlantic in an inflateable to undermine all sorts of assumtions about survival at sea.

However it is very important that you research and understand the challenges of survival at sea: hypothermia, exposure, dehydration, dispair. It is not just a matter of staying afloat after your boat has sunk.

Could be some useful info here: http://www.caske2000.org/survival/survivesea.htm

I took a liferaft to the Azores. I was sailing a multihull and was/am of the opinion that it wouldn't sink. But the arguments around exposure convinced me that survival on an overturned boat in heavy weather could only go on for a matter of hours. Oh, and a mate had one I could borrow.

I'd be interested to see photos of your liferaft design.

Cheers
Paul

 

[co256]

There's a mile of difference between a liferaft and an inflatable tender, I would not consider using the latter as the former unless absolutely desperate!

As for towing it across the Atlantic.... how long before you wake to find it's gone or that a wave has picked it up and thrown it at your transom etc. ???

Sorry, this one's a no brainer for me.

 

[Independence]

Not sure it would be my choice.

Dependant upon your design you would have to consider in a big sea,
1) it filling with water and / or over turning,
2) getting the tow line caught in your self sterring system or anything hanging over the stern. I found this a problem when using a sea anchor for a while,
3) it blowing all over the place in high winds,
4) your tow line suffering from abrasion and it breaking away. I seem to recall Raphael Dinalli watched his laft raft float away whilst he was on deck of his sinking vessel!!....can't be nice.

I'd suggest doing a sea survival course before you make a final decision. A life-raft has design features to help you get in from the water and turn it up the right way should you turn upside down in it. I have no expertise in construction of either of these but at least a life-raft is designed and strengthened to be in the harshest of conditions.

Good luck though.

 

[jesterchallenger]

Impossible - an inflatable will be airborne by the time it's blowing over 30 knots, which it will be pretty quickly once you get offshore. Deflated it will stow well on deck, better than a solid dinghy. Whether or not you want to use it as a liferaft is another consideration altogether, but if you do, a canopy will be essential. Tinker Tramp do an auto inflation version of their inflatable, with canopy and a sailing rig, which gives you the ability to sail towards safety, something you can't do in a raft. But assuming you have an EPIRB, then you can alert someone to your predicament and position so perhaps that's not so important these days. Personally, I think a liferaft is a useful survival tool, though not perfect, and having set my boat on fire coming back from the Azores, thought I was going to have to launch it. Unsinkable boats supposedly don't need liferafts - unless they catch fire. Liferafts can be hired at reasonable cost, and for small boats a 4 man valise is not unacceptably heavy.

 

[Noddy]

SET YOUR BOAT ON FIRE ????

The above points are well made: It would be an awkward beast to tow, but stowing it deflated renders it pretty useless as a liferaft - it takes me 30 minutes and a can of beer followed by a little sit down, to blow mine up.

P

 

[co256]

SET YOUR BOAT ON FIRE ????

.....it's the alternative to a set of flares Noddy!

 

[Gargleblaster]

I feel as though this thread is a repetition of an earlier one, but I can't help myself, I have to have my say as the subject of liferafts is very important to my mental comfort at sea. I find that when I think about the fact that the bottom is 3000 metres below me and sailing in any direction puts me 2 to 3 weeks from land to know I have an escape hatch should my little boat fail in some way is of great comfort. But I have opened my washboards a couple of times or stared out of one of my cabin portholes and thought to myself that I wouldn't like to be in a liferaft out there. Even with little pockets that hold water that are supposed to keep them upright and supposedly the ability to be turned up the right way by one person I don't believe they could cope with the wind and waves on many occasions. Now an inflatable, even a Tinker Tramp, doesn't have those little pockets to hold water and I believe you would spend most of your time trying to hang on to the slippery rubber sides. Of course Duncan* in his unsinkable boat [??? - Rustler 31???] only has to worry about fire and hopefully that will only occur in good weather so he can set his EPIRB off and be rescued before any bad weather hits. [*Duncan sorry if you take that the wrong way, please don't, but I couldn't resist the jibe. I can't believe you would have made Vaquero unsinkable.]

In the book 'Survive the Savage Sea' [I think it was called], I have a copy of the one written by the son 'The Last Voyage of the Lucette', after 3 weeks [?] or so the liferaft disintegrated and they were fortunate that all Five [?] of them were able to fit into their 8' [?] dinghy and keep it stable and bailed despite several strong winds and waves. The book doesn't give you much confidence in liferafts. Bill Churchouse I noticed in JAC08 carried a hard dinghy on his foredeck, although I understand his purpose was more a way of getting around if anchored in the Azores. I've considered trying to fit a hard dinghy to my foredeck but lack what I would consider firm attachment points to keep it there when the waves are breaking over the boat. I found it a hard row back and forth in Newport Harbour in my Avon Inflatable when the wind got up - no sensible person would pay the marina fees they are asking.

Which brings me to another point, where do you keep your liferaft. Duncan would want to keep his external as its a bit hard to get out of the cabin when the boat is on fire. I prefer a valise stored in the cabin underneath the companionway and 3' from my EPIRB. I have personally never met anyone who has used a liferaft, I know of three people who have found their liferaft has taken off by itself after the attachment points have broken. In fact to cover both contingencies perhaps we should all carry two liferafts one external and one internal. [In fact in the English Channel, I carry my liferaft in the cockpit as I believe I am in more danger of being hit by a ship or fishing boat than I am of losing it over the side.]

A lot of this really comes down to what you perceive as the dangers out there. Personally my fear is not of the boat sinking by itself or of it catching fire. I can imagine being hit by a ship or a fishing boat one night and for this reason I sleep in a manual inflation lifejacket and pray I can reach the EPIRB in time. If I have a bit longer I imagine I would get the liferaft into the cockpit and deploy it and even add some extra water from the bottles I carry as ship's stores.

What I'm really trying to say is that whatever it is that gives you mental comfort is what is important. But whatever that thing that gives you mental comfort is, it needs to reliably last the whole trip or you may lose your mental comfort. Personally I would never go beyond soundings without a liferaft [kept in the cabin] and an EPIRB. Single handed I always wear a manual inflation lifejacket with harness and lifeline attached.

 

[Gargleblaster]

Of course the real expert on using an inflatable as a liferaft is perhaps Nick Barham, and I think he has made comments to that effect elsewhere on this forum. The video starring his Avon Inflatable can be seen here:

http://www.ybw.com/auto/newsdesk/20080712150837ymnews.html

 

[jesterchallenger]

No, no, my boat is definitely not unsinkable - my comment referred to other JCers with unsinkable boats that don't carry rafts. And I would admit fire is pretty rare and in my case was due to a poor electrical installation that I meant to check before leaving Terceira and forgot about in the heat of the moment. A bit scary for a few minutes with the cabin full of smoke until I found the source and dealt with it. My auto fire extinguishing system had tripped on arrival at Terceira (it put my engine out very effectively, but at a bad moment entering the marina!), so that wasn't available. My liferaft (hired) is stowed in a s/s bracket on the coachroof, possibly not ideal but I just can't find anywhere else to put it. Whilst I am happy to sail in coastal waters without one, I wouldn't venture offshore without it - it's a refuge of last resort, though I would add to a certain reluctance to put my trust in a raft until there really was no alternative.

 

[co256]

All perfectly sensible!

I was taught (basic sea survival course) to only step up to a liferaft not down, even a half sunken yacht will afford more protection that a liferaft.

And before you abandon.... witness the number of recovered yachts after the Fastnet, abandoned yet perfectly intact!

 

[CPD]

Hello David,
When it really starts blowing, I would not want to be worrying about an infltabale flapping about on the back of the boat. I would rather be thinking about other things and for that reason I wouldn't go with what in theory is a good idea.
If you are still in Ramsgate and fancy a beer towards the end of next week then let me know. I have pm'd my mobile.
Cheers,
Alan

 

[helixkimara]

Towing an inflatable accross the Atlantic. No ! Just No !
(jamb it somewhere)

Liferaft, Yes (but dont tow it). See Johns (Glayva) reasoning.

Regards

 

[David_Jersey]

Of course Duncan* in his unsinkable boat [??? - Rustler 31???] only has to worry about fire and hopefully that will only occur in good weather so he can set his EPIRB off and be rescued before any bad weather hits

Some very good points in your post , but on the fire thing I would also add that it is not just the flames that might force someone to evacuate the boat, the smoke alone can do so. Mid Ocean or anchored.

With regard to the Liferaft vs dinghy (or nothing?) debate, one thing to consider (and IMO you rightly touched upon) is that their can easily be situations where a liferaft does not provide the safety until help arrives that one hopes / envisages when buying (remember the key word in it's name is not "life" it's the word raft ).......therefore the debate is not simply between a method of 100% assured safety vs a calculated risk. On tht deate it is of course for each to make an informed decision.

FWIW I always want some method of leaving a boat and settle on a rubber dinghy (IMO a lot better than a liferaft if anchored inshore and a fire onboard forces you off as one has a good chance of rowing ashore!), but going offshore I would probably buy a liferaft, if for no other reason than I would not later be standing on a burning poop deck looking at my dinghy and saying to myself "I wish I had bought a liferaft" - not because I would think it would 100% guarantee my later survival.

 

[stevenhumphrey]

Hi there guys and girls.
Just a note or two,

We all think about the dramas of the high seas,
But it’s the early hours and the unthinkable that comes to pass,
So why not both?
I am going raft and a very good survival suit,
with a EPIRB,
plus the boat while not unsinkable will be dam hard to sink as it will build in form, and 2 tons of air bags to go bang in the night with a flick of a hand!
i think.
after all floating is only half the game!
Steve

 

[bluebosunsmate]

The answer is in the name!!

Liferaft and EPIRB is the MINIMUM unless you don't have a family or are planning to let someone to claim your life insurance if it does go pear shape!

 

[mainmarine]

PM sent.

 

[PacketRat]

EPIRB or PLB?

 

[srm]

Hmmm, if I was on a big ship and had to abandon to a lifeboat I would be in something around the size of a JC entrant and a lot less seaworthy.

In response to CO256's comments about the 79 Fastnet - none of the abandoned yachts was found 'perfectly intact' - missing washboards and half full of water would be more typical, along with rig over the side. Even so I used to use them to illustrate the benefit of staying with the boat while running STCW Sea Survival courses. If I remember correctly one 4 man raft and crew disapeared without trace but their damaged yacht was towed in to port after the storm.

If you look at even a modern small liferaft when inflated its not much more than a kiddies paddling pool with a floppy tent on top.

As to towing an inflatable dinghy, I tried that once just to cross a couple of miles between two islands in a force 5 and arrived on the other side with it lashed vertically alongside the cockpit guard rails to prevent it doing any more damage. I have seen them airborne while at anchor and a friend cut one away in a full gale when the painter wrapped around the mizzen leaving it flying from the rigging.

There is no easy answer, but that's part of the challenge. I would go with Glayvas final comments about whatever gives mental comfort, and add that this comfort applies to both the crew and those they leave ashore.