Torqeedo Outboards?

[nestawayboats]

Safety announcement on Torqeedo batteries.

We have started a separate forum thread for this, but in brief Torqeedo announced today that (amongst others) some Travel 1003 batteries made between 2010 and 2017 might have a leak that would potentially allow water inside the case.

The batteries potentially affected are all in the serial number ranges:
- 1001--- to 1752--- for a Travel 503 or 1003 battery
- or 1117--- to 1826--- for an Ultralight 403 battery

If you've got one of those it needs to be registered online at www.torqeedo.com/safety and they will tell you how to deal with it. (It will have to go back to a service centre for pressure testing and repair if necessary.)

We believe the risk to be very low, but Torqeedo are rightly taking a "safety must come first at all costs" approach on this.

Ian, Nestaway Boats Ltd

 

[richjmaynard]

I have a Torqeedo 1103 which is perfect for my usual use case - I have a Drascombe Lugger, and just use the outboard to pull off the slipway, find a mooring (or keep head to wind) while I set the sails, then sail away, outboard off for the day until using it again to motor back onto the slipway.
But I'd like to do some cruising on inland waterways, maybe a couple of days with camping, so I need a range extension strategy.
The Torqeedo spare batteries are very expensive. The Torqeedo solar charger is very expensive and doesn't really fit on my deck space.
Should I get a couple of 12v leisure batteries to charge the Torqeedo from as I motor along? I believe I could put 120W into the Torqeedo with this syatem. Could potentially recharge overnight at the campsite if I get an electric hookup.
Should I get some solar cells? The Torqeedo one is rated at 50W but I could go bigger if I used stern and bow decks. Wouldn't work if it rained...
I also have a little suitcase generator which might work on inland waterways, but charging at 90W with the mains charger would take 10 hours to recharge the Torqeedo battery. Not an option!

Also, is the Torqeedo 12-24v charging cable really just a fused cable? For £35!?!

 

[nestawayboats]

I have a Torqeedo 1103 which is perfect for my usual use case - I have a Drascombe Lugger, and just use the outboard to pull off the slipway, find a mooring (or keep head to wind) while I set the sails, then sail away, outboard off for the day until using it again to motor back onto the slipway.
But I'd like to do some cruising on inland waterways, maybe a couple of days with camping, so I need a range extension strategy.
The Torqeedo spare batteries are very expensive. The Torqeedo solar charger is very expensive and doesn't really fit on my deck space.
Should I get a couple of 12v leisure batteries to charge the Torqeedo from as I motor along? I believe I could put 120W into the Torqeedo with this syatem. Could potentially recharge overnight at the campsite if I get an electric hookup.
Should I get some solar cells? The Torqeedo one is rated at 50W but I could go bigger if I used stern and bow decks. Wouldn't work if it rained...
I also have a little suitcase generator which might work on inland waterways, but charging at 90W with the mains charger would take 10 hours to recharge the Torqeedo battery. Not an option!

Also, is the Torqeedo 12-24v charging cable really just a fused cable? For £35!?!

Yes DC charging from "slave" 12V batteries, possibly recharged from solar, is a cheaper option than buying additional Torqeedo batteries. With the further advantage of giving you a DC supply on board your boat, if you don't already have that. As the Torqeedo battery will draw 4A (any source between about 11 and 28V, from memory) you will get faster charging if you wire the two 12V batteries in series, to make a 24V bank. The charge rate should then be 96W (4x 24), or about 10% of the Torqeedo battery's capacity per hour of charging (assuming you have the 916Wh battery).

On your Drascombe I'd guess you get a useful cruising speed from about 300W power output on the Torqeedo, so you can't replace the Torqeedo battery capacity as fast as you want to use it. But you can certainly slow down the rate at which it discharges when you are motoring, and recharge it at up to 10% per hour when sailing or sitting on the beach.

There are limitations to this strategy. The Torqeedo lithium battery holds its capacity in a much smaller weight/volume than the lead acid "leisure battery" equivalent. Again assuming you have the 916Wh (Watt hour) Torqeedo battery, that's equivalent to a 76Ah (Amp hour) 12V battery (916 divided by 12 = 76). But lead acid batteries don't like being taken below 50% of their rated capacity, so you actually need about 150Ah of 12V batteries to recharge the Torqeedo battery once, without damaging the lead acid batteries. 75Ah 12V batteries typically weigh about 17kg so that's at least 34kg of lead acid batteries to double your range (compared with 6kg and a lot less space for another Torqeedo battery).

Solar panels are only as good as the weather in the UK (!), but you are correct that it's much cheaper to buy non-Torqeedo ones and use those to charge your 12/24V system. Then use that to charge your Torqeedo battery.

The Torqeedo cable is indeed only a cable with the right ends on it (a cigar lighter socket one end, the Torqeedo charging socket at the other end) but it is also an "official product" supplied by Torqeedo with the correct polarity and a threaded connection to the battery that has a level of waterproof-ness. If you make your own cable using the right laptop-type connector (which is possible, we used to do it before Torqeedo made their own) it doesn't have any waterproof rating. Your battery really won't like it if you supply it the wrong polarity so I think most customers decide it's worth £35 to avoid that risk and have the waterproof connector end. (And manufacturers can't really argue about warranty issues caused by charging, if you've used their charging products.)

Ian, Nestaway Boats Ltd

 

[richjmaynard]

Thank you for another really helpful, clear and useful reply!

I hadn't really considered the weight aspect, or the fact that lead acid batteries don't like being discharged too far (which effectively doubles the price and weight per unit energy stored)

Hmm. Maybe some li-ion battery packs out of those new-fangled electric scooters?

 

[richjmaynard]

Something like this:

￡56.92 30%OFF | original 7S4P 29.4V 15Ah electric bicycle motor ebike scooter 24V 18650 lithium battery pack batteries 20A BMS 450watt + charger
https://s.click.aliexpress.com/e/fWseKne

Assuming the built in battery management system lets me get most of the 15Ah out at 24v, that's roughly equivalent to a half discharged 60Ah 12v lead acid but only weight 1.4kg.

Only issue is that battery is in China and I'm not sure what Customs would say when it arrives in the post!

 

[nestawayboats]

Don't know offhand what the duty rate is on batteries from China, but after calculating that there will be 20% VAT to pay, on the sum of the purchase price plus duty plus shipping. Plus a 50 day wait.

It should also go in a waterproof box if you're putting it on a boat, water and lithium don't mix well - or maybe I should say they mix rather too well!

When buying a Torqeedo battery you're getting top quality Panasonic cells (this seller doesn't specify, but I'm sure if they were Panasonic or Samsung they would) encased - in fact potted - inside an IP67 rated case made from special heat resistant plastic and CE rated for the purpose. Also contained within that case is a battery management system allowing discharge rates up to at least 1100W (the maximum power draw of the 1103 motor), GPS chip, etc etc.

Nonetheless if you know what you're doing I agree this is a relatively cheap and light way to add range. If you ignore price then another Torqeedo battery would be much simpler - plug and play - and gives you a longer run time at useful power output levels.

Ian, Nestaway Boats Ltd

 

[thug]

Hello everybody.

I've used Torqeedo Travel 1003 for 2 years and ~8-10 rides in RIB boat 275cm length and ~40kg weight. After all, the propeller doesn't even have a visible damage or scrathes, but the shape of the base of propeller looks like an egg now, instead of a circle =(

Short video:
Torqeedo 1003 propeller curvature video

The vibrations of new propeller shape are felt through the boat.

Has anyone noticed something like this on your Torqeedo propellers ? I've ordered the new one, but I am worrying of situation repeating.

Yury

 

[dolabriform]

Hello everybody.

I've used Torqeedo Travel 1003 for 2 years and ~8-10 rides in RIB boat 275cm length and ~40kg weight. After all, the propeller doesn't even have a visible damage or scrathes, but the shape of the base of propeller looks like an egg now, instead of a circle =(

Short video:
Torqeedo 1003 propeller curvature video

The vibrations of new propeller shape are felt through the boat.

Has anyone noticed something like this on your Torqeedo propellers ? I've ordered the new one, but I am worrying of situation repeating.

Yury

I can't say I've noticed anything, but we don't drive ours hard.
Have you asked Torqeedo about this?

 

[Bouba]

It’s hard to see on your video what you mean, but I would first look at the prop, it’s only plastic has it distorted?
Next, see if the shearpin is ok, I’m told these are vulnerable. Lastly the shaft, and best to hope it’s not that

 

[sailaboutvic]

We was on the verge of buying the 1103 , buy decided not too ,
Too many bad reports of t hem breaking down one reason the other if they do break down there not that amount of support about .
Find if your based on land but as a cruiser moving around we would have a real problem getting it sorted.
Plus when I thought about it I'm better off with something I can fix myself .

 

[RupertW]

We was on the verge of buying the 1103 , buy decided not too ,
Too many bad reports of t hem breaking down one reason the other if they do break down there not that amount of support about .
Find if your based on land but as a cruiser moving around we would have a real problem getting it sorted.
Plus when I thought about it I'm better off with something I can fix myself .

That is such a pity - it’s hard to judge from the experience of just yourself but after all these years with the 1003 without a single worry I wouldn’t hesitate - still our best buy.

 

[sailaboutvic]

That is such a pity - it’s hard to judge from the experience of just yourself but after all these years with the 1003 without a single worry I wouldn’t hesitate - still our best buy.

Rupert it was your comments that made us nearly buy one mate here and else where , but the more I research the more bad rather then good reports I found .
The other thing that put us off ,is having to carry a 6kg battery around with us in case some one nicked it .
Bad enough having to carry backpacks of shopping

 

[Bouba]

Rupert it was your comments that made us nearly buy one mate here and else where , but the more I research the more bad rather then good reports I found .
The other thing that put us off ,is having to carry a 6kg battery around with us in case some one nicked it .
Bad enough having to carry backpacks of shopping

I keep a lightweight chain and padlock connecting the battery to the dingy. I take a philosophical approach, you can’t carry it and you can’t keep a thief out. You can only keep an honest man honest.
The whole dingy is vulnerable to theft or vandalism as is the mothership at anchor. So I ask myself, if this looks like a dodgy area, why am I here? That’s not why I go boating. The rest is down to insurance.
As for the horror stories, I think that they are way more reliable than (easily stolen) small outboards. Starting an electric outboard is a real pleasure!

 

[sailaboutvic]

I keep a lightweight chain and padlock connecting the battery to the dingy. I take a philosophical approach, you can’t carry it and you can’t keep a thief out. You can only keep an honest man honest.
The whole dingy is vulnerable to theft or vandalism as is the mothership at anchor. So I ask myself, if this looks like a dodgy area, why am I here? That’s not why I go boating. The rest is down to insurance.
As for the horror stories, I think that they are way more reliable than (easily stolen) small outboards. Starting an electric outboard is a real pleasure!

Agree thief everywhere our US friend in Siracusa last year left there rib and engine chain to the back of their yacht over night , in the morning they found the fuel taken taken and the prop removed and taken too .
Has I said there was many reason why we not brought one , I can almost repair most stuff but an ele outboard would be out of my league. And there just not enough services dealers about , if you live on land you can always drive off and find one or take it to a carrier and set it back when you cruising it's a very different story .
My old rusty Honda I can keep it going , when a push Rod broke I replace it with a bit of threaded rod , and when the valve cover rusty away I grip it ,

 

[Bouba]

Agree thief everywhere our US friend in Siracusa last year left there rib and engine chain to the back of their yacht over night , in the morning they found the fuel taken taken and the prop removed and taken too .
Has I said there was many reason why we not brought one , I can almost repair most stuff but an ele outboard would be out of my league. And there just not enough services dealers about , if you live on land you can always drive off and find one or take it to a carrier and set it back when you cruising it's a very different story .
My old rusty Honda I can keep it going , when a push Rod broke I replace it with a bit of threaded rod , and when the valve cover rusty away I grip it ,

Can’t disagree with your logic. It’s almost impossible for a home mechanic to fix anything electronic

 

[thug]

It’s hard to see on your video what you mean

Its's easy to see while you know what to see: central hole of propeller has an egg shape. Looks like an overheated plastic or something similar. I'll take a photo with digital measurements.

 

[Bouba]

Its's easy to see while you know what to see: central hole of propeller has an egg shape. Looks like an overheated plastic or something similar. I'll take a photo with digital measurements.

Don’t forget it’s not meant to spin in the air, it likes water. But take the prop off to see if it’s true and the shearpin isn’t corroded and there’s no fishing line and no bend in the shaft