DaveNTL
Well-Known Member
I'm halfway down the intracoastal waterway and I'm in the 'once I've done it never again' corner.
Discuss?
Discuss?
The ICW - love it or hate it?
- Thread starter DaveNTL
- Start date
Talbot
Well-Known Member
What is your reasoning?
DaveNTL
Well-Known Member
My reasoning is that I have a boat with sails and therefore I would (after this run) prefer to wait in future for the right weather windows and go 'outside' in reasonable sized legs.
Cape Hatteras / Cape Fear can be dodgy with a northerly against the Gulf Stream but if you wait for southerlies I'd do it every time.
My experience is that chugging along the ICW at 5 - 7knots watching very similar countryside, whilst keeping one eye constantly on the depth because of shoaling in narrow channels, whilst being overtaken by motorboats who sometimes slow down, whilst swatting mosquitos, then catching up to the motorboats at bridges that you have to wait to open, then setting off in a gaggle...... etc etc... isn't my idea of fun.
The mud stinks and is difficult to get off your anchor too.
I went outside from Atlantic City to Norfolk Virginia in 28 hours, about 170 miles, missing out the Chesapeake completely because the westerly against the current in the Delaware didn't seem like a good idea and it was the best thing I could have done.
Wonderful night, 1-2 foot sea, only saw two other boats and got to Norfolk two days ahead of a friend who left two days before me and had a lousy time.
Georgia, for example, have stated that they are not going to maintain their stretch anymore because they can't aford it and they have one of the worst bits.
If you look at a chart of the Albemarle sound it's wide, really wide. But you can't go anywhere, you have to stick to a 60 foot wide channel all the way through it.
Thats all really. I now know why there are so many 'trawlers' here. Thats the sort of boat to use on the ICW. Even my 5' 9" draft is a lot.
I was interested to hear others opinions. Yotties mainly. Have you done it?
Cape Hatteras / Cape Fear can be dodgy with a northerly against the Gulf Stream but if you wait for southerlies I'd do it every time.
My experience is that chugging along the ICW at 5 - 7knots watching very similar countryside, whilst keeping one eye constantly on the depth because of shoaling in narrow channels, whilst being overtaken by motorboats who sometimes slow down, whilst swatting mosquitos, then catching up to the motorboats at bridges that you have to wait to open, then setting off in a gaggle...... etc etc... isn't my idea of fun.
The mud stinks and is difficult to get off your anchor too.
I went outside from Atlantic City to Norfolk Virginia in 28 hours, about 170 miles, missing out the Chesapeake completely because the westerly against the current in the Delaware didn't seem like a good idea and it was the best thing I could have done.
Wonderful night, 1-2 foot sea, only saw two other boats and got to Norfolk two days ahead of a friend who left two days before me and had a lousy time.
Georgia, for example, have stated that they are not going to maintain their stretch anymore because they can't aford it and they have one of the worst bits.
If you look at a chart of the Albemarle sound it's wide, really wide. But you can't go anywhere, you have to stick to a 60 foot wide channel all the way through it.
Thats all really. I now know why there are so many 'trawlers' here. Thats the sort of boat to use on the ICW. Even my 5' 9" draft is a lot.
I was interested to hear others opinions. Yotties mainly. Have you done it?
DaveNTL
Well-Known Member
As soon as I'd finished writing that I was looking for blogs of others that have done it - this is an extract from the first one I looked at.....
The shallow draft of our boat has been a godsend the past few days. Once, while waiting for a bridge to open I turned towards the shore and blundered into a 5 foot patch. Coming into the Cape Fear river we couldn't find a buoy (which it turns out wasn't there), got confused and we got into very shallow water yet again. I reported the missing buoy to our flotilla. Later when Brian came through a boat was grounded there. Afterwards Eleanor said, "You will never find adventure if you don't go looking for it". I said, "If you never find adventure you might live longer J ". But I was still recovering from the adrenaline rush.
The shallow draft of our boat has been a godsend the past few days. Once, while waiting for a bridge to open I turned towards the shore and blundered into a 5 foot patch. Coming into the Cape Fear river we couldn't find a buoy (which it turns out wasn't there), got confused and we got into very shallow water yet again. I reported the missing buoy to our flotilla. Later when Brian came through a boat was grounded there. Afterwards Eleanor said, "You will never find adventure if you don't go looking for it". I said, "If you never find adventure you might live longer J ". But I was still recovering from the adrenaline rush.
jimboaw
Well-Known Member
Hi Busby, we chatted briefly in Wrightsville Beach the other day! I seem to remember suggesting the outside route! Jim on "Moonlighting" Fair winds.
Talbot
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
I was interested to hear others opinions. Yotties mainly. Have you done it?
[/ QUOTE ]
Wrong side of the pond unfortunately
I was interested to hear others opinions. Yotties mainly. Have you done it?
[/ QUOTE ]
Wrong side of the pond unfortunately
Salty John
Well-Known Member
I've done it nine times and I love it. First trip was mainly "outside", subsequent trips have become more and more "inside" only. I've dragged 6' 4" draft the full length of the ICW, (and also most of the Gulf ICW which I would not want to do again), but I now have a trawler with under 4' draft, which is less restrictive. I've done the blue water thing also, but I like the changing character of the ICW, the more eventful days and the nightly anchorage with the opportunity to meet people. Tow Boat US insurance is the best deal around for those doing the ICW! Pity you missed Chesapeake Bay, it is one of the best cruising grounds in the world.
If the object of your sailing is to get to a specific destination as quickly as possible then, clearly, the ICW would not be your choice; for interest and adventure of the less life threatening variety I think it is well worth a try.
If the object of your sailing is to get to a specific destination as quickly as possible then, clearly, the ICW would not be your choice; for interest and adventure of the less life threatening variety I think it is well worth a try.
michael_w
Well-Known Member
We did the ICW from Ft Luderdale to Fernandina Beach. Only dodgy bit round New Smyrna. Outside to Beaufort NC via Charleston. As we heard that GA and SC could be a struggle. Inside again via the Virginia Cut to Norfolk. No problem with 6'2"draught in 2004.
When we came south after refitting in Little Creek VA. Took the inside route again. Much easier to get the weather right for crosing the Gulfstream from 60 miles out rather than the 150 or so from the Chesapeake.
Vital that you have Skipper Bob's Anchorages along the ICW. Best $15 I've ever spent.
When we came south after refitting in Little Creek VA. Took the inside route again. Much easier to get the weather right for crosing the Gulfstream from 60 miles out rather than the 150 or so from the Chesapeake.
Vital that you have Skipper Bob's Anchorages along the ICW. Best $15 I've ever spent.
DaveNTL
Well-Known Member
Hi again Jim /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif
Yes I'd already formed my opinions by the time I met you and you confirmed it. It's not really a sailors experience is it?
Our friends caught up to us again the day we met you at Wrightsville Beach and we up anchored to follow them.
I'm just putting this in here to stick in my two-pennuth and see what others come up with.
I grounded BIG TIME at the Little River inlet that day. I actually saw 2 foot on the depth guage which is interesting when you draw 5'9"! All good fun though!.... well... now it is.
You know what the americans are like though, lovely people but they don't half make a fuss. The wifey friend was in more of a panic on their boat than mine was. She's on the radio screeming 'what you gonna do?' to which I replied, I haven't decided yet.... barbeque?
All I did was stray to port of the channel by 10 feet because a fisherman on a boston whaler had decided the best place to drop his hook was in the middle of the channel at an inlet to the atlantic and BANG... right over a shoal. I was a good 12 to 15 foot INSIDE the port can, but I think with it being nearly springs it has shoaled up quick.
Anyway, turned out to be no biggy, I messed about for about half an hour putting sails up to try more tilt, that didn't work even with extra balast from the Mrs backside. For once I actually asked a mobo with 2 x 250 Yams to make me a big wake at the stern but that didn't help.
My friends, who draw 4' 3" came back at one stage to test the channel. They were no more than 6 foot away from my bow cutting across and shouting... 12 foot deep here!... 8 foot.... still 7 foot.... OH! we bumped the bottom!
I eventually cut a trench through by playing side to side on the bow thruster with a bit of forward gear.
Anyway, fair winds to you too Jim and go for that mooring consession! Great idea!
BTW, did you see the thread somewhere about Lavranos a few weeks back?
I'm booked in to Hinckleys yard in Savannah the end of next week for an upgrade on the genny so we havent got far to go now.
cheers - Dave
Yes I'd already formed my opinions by the time I met you and you confirmed it. It's not really a sailors experience is it?
Our friends caught up to us again the day we met you at Wrightsville Beach and we up anchored to follow them.
I'm just putting this in here to stick in my two-pennuth and see what others come up with.
I grounded BIG TIME at the Little River inlet that day. I actually saw 2 foot on the depth guage which is interesting when you draw 5'9"! All good fun though!.... well... now it is.
You know what the americans are like though, lovely people but they don't half make a fuss. The wifey friend was in more of a panic on their boat than mine was. She's on the radio screeming 'what you gonna do?' to which I replied, I haven't decided yet.... barbeque?
All I did was stray to port of the channel by 10 feet because a fisherman on a boston whaler had decided the best place to drop his hook was in the middle of the channel at an inlet to the atlantic and BANG... right over a shoal. I was a good 12 to 15 foot INSIDE the port can, but I think with it being nearly springs it has shoaled up quick.
Anyway, turned out to be no biggy, I messed about for about half an hour putting sails up to try more tilt, that didn't work even with extra balast from the Mrs backside. For once I actually asked a mobo with 2 x 250 Yams to make me a big wake at the stern but that didn't help.
My friends, who draw 4' 3" came back at one stage to test the channel. They were no more than 6 foot away from my bow cutting across and shouting... 12 foot deep here!... 8 foot.... still 7 foot.... OH! we bumped the bottom!
I eventually cut a trench through by playing side to side on the bow thruster with a bit of forward gear.
Anyway, fair winds to you too Jim and go for that mooring consession! Great idea!
BTW, did you see the thread somewhere about Lavranos a few weeks back?
I'm booked in to Hinckleys yard in Savannah the end of next week for an upgrade on the genny so we havent got far to go now.
cheers - Dave
DaveNTL
Well-Known Member
Agreed on Skipper Bob's anchorages. Updates are on the net and I've e mailed him where there are some new shoals.
absit_omen
Well-Known Member
Hmmmm, would appear that Talbot is wrong.
Sea Devil
Well-Known Member
I have been up and down a couple of times and the same offshore and close in. I think the ICW is a wonderful way to see America - East Coast. Some wonderful towns - Augustine, the 2 Beauforts, Norfolk for the battle ships Cape Canavera,l The marshes of Georgia....
Sure it is different from sailing offshore but that does not make it better or worse - just different. I ran agound sometimes softly and easy to get off and sometimes it took an hour or two but never did damage to the boat. Bit like the French Canals it is a different and very satisfieing experience with enough challange to make it interesting. I think part of the problem you are having is trying to do too much in a day and not enjoying the places and chilling out enough,,,, ???
It certainly beats the passage to windward from Miami back to the Caribbean!
Sure it is different from sailing offshore but that does not make it better or worse - just different. I ran agound sometimes softly and easy to get off and sometimes it took an hour or two but never did damage to the boat. Bit like the French Canals it is a different and very satisfieing experience with enough challange to make it interesting. I think part of the problem you are having is trying to do too much in a day and not enjoying the places and chilling out enough,,,, ???
It certainly beats the passage to windward from Miami back to the Caribbean!
DaveNTL
Well-Known Member
No not at all, we are thoroughly enjoying our time, well, apart from the lousy weather the last few days.
We're also enjoying the ICW. I enjoy all my time on my boat.
Thats the trouble with stuff writen in text, it gives the impression that because someone has gone to the trouble to write something they must obviously have enough of an issue with it to be really unhappy.
The truth is much more mundane.
I'm in the laundry of the Myrtle Beach Yacht Club. There are three washing machines behind me and three driers and they don't even have windows. There is, however, a desktop with internet access. So as I couldn't watch the washing go round and round I thought up something to write about that I thought may be of interest to others or be worthy of debate. /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif
We are however trying to make reasonable progress south because we left it a bit late leaving Rhode Island.
I'd probably go as far as to say I might go back north as far as Norfolk on the ICW next June. It might be better that way. /forums/images/graemlins/crazy.gif
To the person who said we missed out the Chesapeake and it's great - we'll be spending several weeks there next summer if not all of it. SWMBO has had enough of the 'cold north' and thats as far as she wants to go. Personally I'd go to Canada but I can't see her having any of that.
I'd love to try miami - bermuda - block island too except this bermuda triangle program on telly the other night put me right off.
We're also enjoying the ICW. I enjoy all my time on my boat.
Thats the trouble with stuff writen in text, it gives the impression that because someone has gone to the trouble to write something they must obviously have enough of an issue with it to be really unhappy.
The truth is much more mundane.
I'm in the laundry of the Myrtle Beach Yacht Club. There are three washing machines behind me and three driers and they don't even have windows. There is, however, a desktop with internet access. So as I couldn't watch the washing go round and round I thought up something to write about that I thought may be of interest to others or be worthy of debate. /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif
We are however trying to make reasonable progress south because we left it a bit late leaving Rhode Island.
I'd probably go as far as to say I might go back north as far as Norfolk on the ICW next June. It might be better that way. /forums/images/graemlins/crazy.gif
To the person who said we missed out the Chesapeake and it's great - we'll be spending several weeks there next summer if not all of it. SWMBO has had enough of the 'cold north' and thats as far as she wants to go. Personally I'd go to Canada but I can't see her having any of that.
I'd love to try miami - bermuda - block island too except this bermuda triangle program on telly the other night put me right off.
Rickm505
Active Member
Consider that this post is from one who lives on the ICW in east central Florida.
Where else can you sip coffee and watch the dolphins play?
Solid easterlies much of the year for fantastic sailing.
A few cold blasts (but never below zero degrees C) lasting a few days, the rest of the time absolutely lovely weather!!
Decent restaurants where you don't have to dingy in.
All in all, it's a very nice play to visit and I certainly don't mind living here (smile)
Rick in Florida, USA
Where else can you sip coffee and watch the dolphins play?
Solid easterlies much of the year for fantastic sailing.
A few cold blasts (but never below zero degrees C) lasting a few days, the rest of the time absolutely lovely weather!!
Decent restaurants where you don't have to dingy in.
All in all, it's a very nice play to visit and I certainly don't mind living here (smile)
Rick in Florida, USA
Lizzie_B
Well-Known Member
Re dolphins - Yarmouth harbour, Isle of Wight. UK
St Petersburg FL, also watch manatees, but I think some parts of ICW you can see them. Esp in the Tampa Bay stretch.
But then FL is not the whole of the ICW.
I think as a whole,the ICW is in desperate need of some tender loving care in places, and in the context of the original post is not the reliable North - South route it once was, espescially for a sail boat. As a result it needs a lot of research into Where to use ICW and where to cut outside for a while if transiting in a sail boat of any size.
That's not in any way a criticism of those charged with it's maintainance.
With all the damage of the last two years hurricane seasons, it is understandable that the less commercially important sectors of the ICW will be further down the 'things to do' list.
My personal favourite is Coan River Marina in the Northern Neck of Virginia, where you can sit in the cockpit sipping a cool drink on a hot day and watch , catch and eat blue fin crabs as they're having sex!!!
St Petersburg FL, also watch manatees, but I think some parts of ICW you can see them. Esp in the Tampa Bay stretch.
But then FL is not the whole of the ICW.
I think as a whole,the ICW is in desperate need of some tender loving care in places, and in the context of the original post is not the reliable North - South route it once was, espescially for a sail boat. As a result it needs a lot of research into Where to use ICW and where to cut outside for a while if transiting in a sail boat of any size.
That's not in any way a criticism of those charged with it's maintainance.
With all the damage of the last two years hurricane seasons, it is understandable that the less commercially important sectors of the ICW will be further down the 'things to do' list.
My personal favourite is Coan River Marina in the Northern Neck of Virginia, where you can sit in the cockpit sipping a cool drink on a hot day and watch , catch and eat blue fin crabs as they're having sex!!!
Lizzie_B
Well-Known Member
Re: Chesapeake. I'll keep an eye out for you. We'll be out at least six weeks during the summer.
Keep in touch as your itinerary firms up.
Have you been round to the West coast of FL yet? Well worth a visit, and simple to do depending on your airdraught.
Keep in touch as your itinerary firms up.
Have you been round to the West coast of FL yet? Well worth a visit, and simple to do depending on your airdraught.
DaveNTL
Well-Known Member
We're at Charleston SC now for three days. Very interesting place to see - reminds me of Amsterdam in terms of so many unspoilt old buildings in a relatively large area.
The creeks in south carolina were a delight to anchor in too. Solitude, deep water, scary noises at night..... in fact, even more scary noises in the morning when the hunters started shooting!
Savannah is as far as we'll get on this trip - Busby is booked into Hinckleys for some upgrades. I'm having a new Northern Lights generator put in instead of double glazing in the flat at home. /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif
No, haven't been round to the west coast of FL yet, this is as south as I've been.
The mast was purposely ordered to give a 48' 6" air draught so that it would fit under the Oochie coochie / ockey cocey bridge.... or whatever it's called. I fancy going around the keys and dry tortugas too so I don't know which way i'll get to the west coast yet.
Must admit, I was reading up on the Great Circle Route last night and it's tempting to carry on and do that but maybe thats for another time. I think the Great Lakes deserve more than passing through and time should probably be set aside to spend at least two summers up there and have the boat hauled and winterized inbetween.
I'll be in touch about the Chesapeake - maybe Jim of Moonstruck fancies coming up too? He's always leaving the house to 'check the anchor' anyway.
The creeks in south carolina were a delight to anchor in too. Solitude, deep water, scary noises at night..... in fact, even more scary noises in the morning when the hunters started shooting!
Savannah is as far as we'll get on this trip - Busby is booked into Hinckleys for some upgrades. I'm having a new Northern Lights generator put in instead of double glazing in the flat at home. /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif
No, haven't been round to the west coast of FL yet, this is as south as I've been.
The mast was purposely ordered to give a 48' 6" air draught so that it would fit under the Oochie coochie / ockey cocey bridge.... or whatever it's called. I fancy going around the keys and dry tortugas too so I don't know which way i'll get to the west coast yet.
Must admit, I was reading up on the Great Circle Route last night and it's tempting to carry on and do that but maybe thats for another time. I think the Great Lakes deserve more than passing through and time should probably be set aside to spend at least two summers up there and have the boat hauled and winterized inbetween.
I'll be in touch about the Chesapeake - maybe Jim of Moonstruck fancies coming up too? He's always leaving the house to 'check the anchor' anyway.
TQA
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Did the Keys to Washington and back to Miami. About 50% outside on the way up riding the stream and all the way back down on the inside.
A great, not to be missed, experience, great sights friendly locals [ they even lend you a car in North Carolina] and some interesting anchorages.
However I propably would not do it again from choice. Cuba or the Rio Dulce still wait to be seen.
A great, not to be missed, experience, great sights friendly locals [ they even lend you a car in North Carolina] and some interesting anchorages.
However I propably would not do it again from choice. Cuba or the Rio Dulce still wait to be seen.
Lizzie_B
Well-Known Member
Dear Naughty (I love that name). I loved Charleston SC when I was there too. We used to know the professor of marine biology at Charleston University (a complex of charming old buildings in their own right).
It made swimming on he beaches of the Island strings near there very interesting as he could cheer us with details of all the killer creatures that also enjoyed the warm waters that we raved about!!!!
The Okeechobee Waterway and the keys are not mutually exclusive. In fact in my opinion the best way is to use the OKW from East to West coast and work up to Tampa Bay /Tarpon Springs area.
Well worth visiting for the sight of a herd of manatee coming up the marina when the weather got cold in the bay.(strangely enough the Sunsail Website has some good cruising itinerys for the area as they have their FL base at St Petersburg . FL
St pete is well worth a visit - I am not usually into art, but the Salvador Dali Museum was stunning even to a Phillistine like me- could have spent the entire day there. If you decide to head for there PM me and I'll give you the info re berthing , fuel, etc. There is free, fully protected anchoring right by the $1 tram route that does all the tourist spots in St Pete like a mini circle line.
Then you have a one knot plus current helping you down to the keys and then ride the Gulf Stream for quick passage times back round to the East Coast. You can go through the Keys either by going round the end at Key West or out through Marathon - which is the only place where the highway bridge is high enough. All the locals I spoke to on the FL west coast favoured Marathon as they felt Key West was 'tacky', and not worth the extra time and mileage. I have all the pilotage contacts.
Up to Chesapeake the recommended option from several local delivery skippers was to ride the Gulf Stream up to Beaufort NC, and then ICW from there, but must not go if wind has any North in it. The Offshore hit is just under 500 miles. I have the exact mileage from my delivery skipper and with a 2+ knot lift from the GS, passage times are fast.
I will be out in the Cheasapeake for the last two weeks of April for post winter work up cruise, and then again last 10 days or so of May and into first week of June.
And hopefully at least twice more. teehee. /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif
We try and make the Memorial Day raft Up of the yacht club we sail with out there. They are a Great Bunch of people, very welcoming and fun to be with and a very valuable source of local knowledge for the whole of the Chesapeake/ Delaware system. You can view their antics on www.sailccyc.org
The Memorial Day raft up is usually the lst complete weekend of May, and we will definitely be there. You will be very welcome as a 'furriner' even if you don't own a Catalina, you at least have a 'cat' of sorts!!!!!! Be a good name for a Catalina.
That's enough for now. PM me with any requests for info and contacts. Hopefully see you some time in the coming year. Have also done Great Lakes from Chicago to New York, and have info and contacts in that neck of the woods.
It made swimming on he beaches of the Island strings near there very interesting as he could cheer us with details of all the killer creatures that also enjoyed the warm waters that we raved about!!!!
The Okeechobee Waterway and the keys are not mutually exclusive. In fact in my opinion the best way is to use the OKW from East to West coast and work up to Tampa Bay /Tarpon Springs area.
Well worth visiting for the sight of a herd of manatee coming up the marina when the weather got cold in the bay.(strangely enough the Sunsail Website has some good cruising itinerys for the area as they have their FL base at St Petersburg . FL
St pete is well worth a visit - I am not usually into art, but the Salvador Dali Museum was stunning even to a Phillistine like me- could have spent the entire day there. If you decide to head for there PM me and I'll give you the info re berthing , fuel, etc. There is free, fully protected anchoring right by the $1 tram route that does all the tourist spots in St Pete like a mini circle line.
Then you have a one knot plus current helping you down to the keys and then ride the Gulf Stream for quick passage times back round to the East Coast. You can go through the Keys either by going round the end at Key West or out through Marathon - which is the only place where the highway bridge is high enough. All the locals I spoke to on the FL west coast favoured Marathon as they felt Key West was 'tacky', and not worth the extra time and mileage. I have all the pilotage contacts.
Up to Chesapeake the recommended option from several local delivery skippers was to ride the Gulf Stream up to Beaufort NC, and then ICW from there, but must not go if wind has any North in it. The Offshore hit is just under 500 miles. I have the exact mileage from my delivery skipper and with a 2+ knot lift from the GS, passage times are fast.
I will be out in the Cheasapeake for the last two weeks of April for post winter work up cruise, and then again last 10 days or so of May and into first week of June.
And hopefully at least twice more. teehee. /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif
We try and make the Memorial Day raft Up of the yacht club we sail with out there. They are a Great Bunch of people, very welcoming and fun to be with and a very valuable source of local knowledge for the whole of the Chesapeake/ Delaware system. You can view their antics on www.sailccyc.org
The Memorial Day raft up is usually the lst complete weekend of May, and we will definitely be there. You will be very welcome as a 'furriner' even if you don't own a Catalina, you at least have a 'cat' of sorts!!!!!! Be a good name for a Catalina.
That's enough for now. PM me with any requests for info and contacts. Hopefully see you some time in the coming year. Have also done Great Lakes from Chicago to New York, and have info and contacts in that neck of the woods.
