The Future of our Hobby

[bedouin]

LPG is still a fossil fuel. Ethanol has certainly been done but the problem is producing it in the sort of quantities needed to replace fossil fuel would demand a lot of resources - e.g. crops that could otherwise be feeding people

 

[wombat88]

I saw an electric motorbike on telly a few days ago that looked impressive. I have a 50hp Suzuki on the back of our 20ft semi displacement boat, I really only do trips around the harbour limited by 8 knot speed limit. So...shall we say 4 hours at 30% throttle. Boat lives in a marina with shore power. Plenty of room in the boat for batteries.

It seems to me that the technology is there for me to switch to electric and continue to do what I do, but the product isn't.

One thing that no one seems to mention is the silent way that electric boats proceed. It is sheer bliss. I'd pay a fair bit for silence.

 

[Deleted User YDKXO]

I doubt many non-boaters have a clue just how much energy it takes to drive big (or even not so big) mobos. When the row starts, that will be laid bare.

I agree and I'm surprised it hasnt happened already. Once the econutter lobby gets hold of the fact that there are tens of thousands of pleasure boats around our shores consuming dirty old diesel at a rate of less than 1nmpg, they're going to come for us and the only thing thats going to stop them banning us will be the fact that the UK motorboat manufacturing industry is one of the few manufacturing success stories we've got. Having said that, the industry itself has done bugger all to prepare for the inevitable day when diesel engined pleasure boats are banned

IMHO, the way it will go will be much like road vehicles. There will be increasing numbers of inshore cruising areas designated as low emission zones and either your boat has the technology to comply with those low emission regulations or they will price you out of those areas. Again IMHO, the only readily available technology to boat manufacturers seems to be hybrid power and I can see more and more boats being offered with diesel/electric hybrid power which will allow those boats to cruise emission free in low emission zones but still blast along at 20kts outside those zones. Some manufactures are already going down that route (eg Greenline) and I'm sure others will follow. The days of diesel guzzling gin palaces are definitely numbered and if boaters like us want to continue with our hobby, we're going to have to come up with alternative power systems

 

[ontheplane]

I agree and I'm surprised it hasnt happened already. Once the econutter lobby gets hold of the fact that there are tens of thousands of pleasure boats around our shores consuming dirty old diesel at a rate of less than 1nmpg, they're going to come for us and the only thing thats going to stop them banning us will be the fact that the UK motorboat manufacturing industry is one of the few manufacturing success stories we've got. Having said that, the industry itself has done bugger all to prepare for the inevitable day when diesel engined pleasure boats are banned

IMHO, the way it will go will be much like road vehicles. There will be increasing numbers of inshore cruising areas designated as low emission zones and either your boat has the technology to comply with those low emission regulations or they will price you out of those areas. Again IMHO, the only readily available technology to boat manufacturers seems to be hybrid power and I can see more and more boats being offered with diesel/electric hybrid power which will allow those boats to cruise emission free in low emission zones but still blast along at 20kts outside those zones. Some manufactures are already going down that route (eg Greenline) and I'm sure others will follow. The days of diesel guzzling gin palaces are definitely numbered and if boaters like us want to continue with our hobby, we're going to have to come up with alternative power systems

So would you pay £3 million for a massive Yacht that may be banned / obsolete etc within 10 years? You may not want to keep it 10 years, but if it's gonna be banned in 10, what will it be worth at 7yrs old - almost nothing... thus at 5yrs old it won't be worth that much either.... and so on.

The minute they put a timeline on it, is the moment the "old fashioned" type boats start dropping in value like a cannonball dropped from the ramparts.....

At the moment the mooted date is 2050 which is far enough away people don't see it as an issue - once it's only 5 years or 10 years away - then things change.

 

[BruceK]

Funny how perspectives change. Not so long ago when things were rosy and upbeat the idea our hobby was in jeopardy was derided and scorned. Slap a few months house arrest on and it's "inevitable" .

The world has changed but it will return to normal. I avoid making predictions when in a depressed mood. Just look what happenned to boats after the first wave. People couldnt sell and buy them fast enough. Every generation has it's crisis. Cold War Nuclear threat, terrorism, Ozone layer, Climate change. Boats have been around for millenia and actually boomed AFTER the oil crisis.

 

[Durley245]

Funny how perspectives change. Not so long ago when things were rosy and upbeat the idea our hobby was in jeopardy was derided and scorned. Slap a few months house arrest on and it's "inevitable" .

The world has changed but it will return to normal. I avoid making predictions when in a depressed mood. Just look what happenned to boats after the first wave. People couldnt sell and buy them fast enough. Every generation has it's crisis. Cold War Nuclear threat, terrorism, Ozone layer, Climate change. Boats have been around for millenia and actually boomed AFTER the oil crisis.

Volvo penta will come up with something for our lovely gin palaces, so not to worry. and price will increase and people will buy into it. Hang on to your petrol boats, they will have a bo- fuel like there will be for old classic cars , and for the older boats to run on. Second values won't change.

 

[Deleted User YDKXO]

So would you pay £3 million for a massive Yacht that may be banned / obsolete etc within 10 years?

I didnt suggest that pleasure motorboating would be banned. I suggested it would be restricted in certain areas where emissions were considered sensitive. And its coming. There are no anchoring zones in some Med countries already and very likely in the UK shortly and the inevitable next step with be low emission zones. I suspect what that will mean will be that gas guzzling mobos will be concentrated in areas where restrictions on their use are least onerous and I would suggest that may be in countries more interested in attracting tourist income that green willy waving

 

[Portofino]

Ferretti have already started with a hybrid useable platform.
Once the ‘ state ‘ have ragged it up acted as mules i,am sure a more marketable versions will come along .
There‘s no Joe public dipping his toe in with this .16 boats or so in all .
The bottom part is relevant to this thread

N800: the new Carabinieri Fast Patrol Vessel by FSD - EDR Magazine

 

[thejonesey]

2035 ban on petrol/diesel cars and the implications to boating?

There is no doubt though that this thread feels bleaker than back in Feb 2020! I think the gas guzzlers will have to be re-engine eventually however how good would silent electric power be?!

I had about 10 years out of boating and could not believe that the Decca Navigator had been replaced by these chart plotter things!? Perhaps it will become cheap to replace engines .... even subsidised?... now getting carried away!

 

[Portofino]

What it could be might mirror the Aston Martin Cygnet marketing .......well success really .
EU Brussels treacle makers may say a certain figure , something measurable by a EU jobsworth needs to be achieved.
With the cygnet @ at the time it was av emissions values needed dropping with a range of 6.0L V 12 s rolling off the production line .

With boats it may be numbers of hulls % with a green / eco nod .
So you will see them all going down range to 14 ft speed boats powered by a 12 v bat .....al la Cygnet ( Yaris badged AM )
Something like that .

eg the new Pershing E x 140 debuts @ Monacco

 

[ontheplane]

You are right about the odd partnerships.

Peugeot makes electric bikes - they can then offset each of these as a "vehicle" with 0 emissions against their car range....

My point about boats is they have a longer life than cars. Only people buying new (ish) cars worry about resale - after 10 years the depreciation is negligable.

However a 10 year old boat is still worth properly good money and is a very large investment. So if they are going to ban the SALE (not the use) of solely petrol or diesel cars in 2035 - so what, we already have plenty of alternatives.....

But if they ban the USE of huge diesel engines in boats in 2050 - well that's only 30 years off - and actually I think it will have an impact - yes people will still sell new, but some may choose to hold onto what they have until the future path is clearer - we are already seeing it massively in the motor trade.

I have customers who have a diesel. They don't want a petrol, and they are not ready for electric / hybrid.

Because they feel their diesel cars will become worthless soon, they are not willing to buy another, but the diesel suits them, so they are just holding onto it for now - "running it into the ground" and then will replace it with something when they HAVE to. Some of these customers used to change every 3 years on the dot, come hell or high water, and now they have cars they happily think they will run to 10 years + because they don't want to buy a diesel for fear of horrendous depreciation and don't want any of the alternatives.

I think the boat manufacturers do need to start offering some real alternatives, or they might find themselves well behind the curve - whereas car manufacturers were well ahead of it - offering electric and hybrid cars long before the general main public wanted them......

 

[Megs20Burt!]

You are right about the odd partnerships.

Peugeot makes electric bikes - they can then offset each of these as a "vehicle" with 0 emissions against their car range....

My point about boats is they have a longer life than cars. Only people buying new (ish) cars worry about resale - after 10 years the depreciation is negligable.

However a 10 year old boat is still worth properly good money and is a very large investment. So if they are going to ban the SALE (not the use) of solely petrol or diesel cars in 2035 - so what, we already have plenty of alternatives.....

But if they ban the USE of huge diesel engines in boats in 2050 - well that's only 30 years off - and actually I think it will have an impact - yes people will still sell new, but some may choose to hold onto what they have until the future path is clearer - we are already seeing it massively in the motor trade.

I have customers who have a diesel. They don't want a petrol, and they are not ready for electric / hybrid.

Because they feel their diesel cars will become worthless soon, they are not willing to buy another, but the diesel suits them, so they are just holding onto it for now - "running it into the ground" and then will replace it with something when they HAVE to. Some of these customers used to change every 3 years on the dot, come hell or high water, and now they have cars they happily think they will run to 10 years + because they don't want to buy a diesel for fear of horrendous depreciation and don't want any of the alternatives.

I think the boat manufacturers do need to start offering some real alternatives, or they might find themselves well behind the curve - whereas car manufacturers were well ahead of it - offering electric and hybrid cars long before the general main public wanted them......

I would definitely consider re-powering using hybrid power...?