The best family coastal cruiser

You are brave trying to squeeze three kids and two adults into any 20 footer..

We have one of the larger trailable yachts.It would be just about possible to accomodate three kids in the bow but the taxing part is where you then stow all the gear for a weekend. Our boat usually has the forecabin taken up with sails, sailing gear, food, drink and cooler box.

Cockpit tent does create space and is esssential early and late season. Ours is made from a Tarpaulin! Over boom with the back end slit and restitched to form a triangle. I wouldnt want to sleep out in the cockpit too often! Kids might find it an adventure but not every weekend.

I would not dream of trailing for a weekend as I find it takes a minimum of 4 hours(after considerable practice) to ready our boat from off the trailer to sail away. You will inevitably find that with a trailable boat you will prefer to be semi permanently berthed for at least a month at a time.

You could try finding a yard that offers dry sailing at a reasonable price or a cheap drying mooring berth. But why then limit your search to lift keelers?

With regards sailing ability of a lift keel.

Our boat has a deep 1.7 m draft with deep fin and bulb that lifts nearly vertically. This enables the boat to carry a big 30+ foot rig . Our windward ability is better than any bilge keelers and up to the time of our first reef we will outperform many much larger boats in speed and ability to head up wind. I prefer not to bash into the wind but will do if required. I prefer to do most of my sailing without wearing oilies!
View attachment 34960
Internally ballasted and centreboard boats do not perform in the same way.

Our boat used to be Medway based at Segas
 
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you need to look at a few in the flesh my first sail boat was and still is a westerly 25 I have towed it (2.5 ton ) and I brought it because I want to try sailing and wanted something big enough and cheep enough not to put the wife off
I found it local to me and went to sit in it .
it was in good shape apart from it had a bad paint job , it had only bean on the Norfolk boards and had sat in a aircraft hanger for 12 years or so after
I can't stand up in it , it has a lot of wasted space which could be used as the cooker and sink areas are large
The front twin beds have bean joint and now make a bed witch u could fit two adults and a child or 3 /4 kids on plus 2 full 6 ft plus births at the rear
I think most of the 22- 25 ft boats if you looked at them might do you as yes you have 3 children but they are small and can share bed spaces

as I said in a previous post I was going to trailer my boat about but just try to get
to a slipway (bizzy ) and park your car and trailer ( yellow lines everywhere ) nearby
set up the boat and go out for the day and that's if get the tides right
you will be pulling your hair out, or pay for launch and car plus trailer parking plus the extra fuel towing a boat it works out cheaper to join a club and have no stresssssssss
as that is why we do it
the Blackwater can get windy I know ..... but it is what u want to sail :)
look at a map or chart for the Blackwater it has loads from Maldon promenade park up to Brightlandsea with Haybridge basin (camping area aswell) , Pye fleet, Westmersea , Maylandsea, Tollesbury , round osea island and all the creeks in between and the you can get up the river colne
 
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TSB240 said:
You are brave trying to squeeze three kids and two adults into any 20 footer..

We have one of the larger trailable yachts.It would be just about possible to accomodate three kids in the bow but the taxing part is where you then stow all the gear for a weekend. Our boat usually has the forecabin taken up with sails, sailing gear, food, drink and cooler box.

Cockpit tent does create space and is esssential early and late season. Ours is made from a Tarpaulin! Over boom with the back end slit and restitched to form a triangle. I wouldnt want to sleep out in the cockpit too often! Kids might find it an adventure but not every weekend.

I would not dream of trailing for a weekend as I find it takes a minimum of 4 hours(after considerable practice) to ready our boat from off the trailer to sail away. You will inevitably find that with a trailable boat you will prefer to be semi permanently berthed for at least a month at a time.

You could try finding a yard that offers dry sailing at a reasonable price or a cheap drying mooring berth. But why then limit your search to lift keelers?

With regards sailing ability of a lift keel.

Our boat has a deep 1.7 m draft with deep fin and bulb that lifts nearly vertically. This enables the boat to carry a big 30+ foot rig . Our windward ability is better than any bilge keelers and up to the time of our first reef we will outperform many much larger boats in speed and ability to head up wind. I prefer not to bash into the wind but will do if required. I prefer to do most of my sailing without wearing oilies!
View attachment 34960
Internally ballasted and centreboard boats do not perform in the same way.

Our boat used to be Medway based at Segas
Click to expand...

Im "brave" out of necessity. We are not in a position to spend more, at least for the time being :)
Storage will inevitably be a trial. We will just have to try and be organised.
And I hear what you say about dropping a boat in the water. It takes time to rig and be off. I really hope it wont take 4 hours though!

I keep coming back to this question of having a mooring. It adds cost but would reduce hassle. But im not sure my budget will stretch to it next season. My current plan is to stay on the trailer in the first season but to do some serious investigation in the spring checking out Medway and Crouch for possible bases. If it starts to do my head in I guess we can apply to join somewhere mid season. Regarding your thoughts on being "semi berthed for a month at a time". This makes sense but wont it be very expensive? Or is it easy to get a drying mooring for short periods?

I was not sure whether your boat has a retracting keel or not. There have been many times Ive looked at Van de Stat boats and the like and thought how nice it would be to have a deep fin. Ive never really had the pleasure but have frequently been overtaken by boats that make short work of a sea that has me dead in the water. It all comes down to the kind of sailing we want to do though. The kids and wife will enjoy exploring up rivers rather than getting seasick and being stuck on board for 9 hours at a time. I love the thought of passage making and it will happen, but Im going to take it easy.
 
paul-essex said:
as I said in a previous post I was going to trailer my boat about but just try to get
to a slipway (bizzy ) and park your car and trailer ( yellow lines everywhere ) nearby
set up the boat and go out for the day and that's if get the tides right
you will be pulling your hair out, or pay for launch and car plus trailer parking plus the extra fuel towing a boat it works out cheaper to join a club and have now stresssssssss
as that is why we do it
Click to expand...

Gawd. Everyone is advising I get a mooring, and I can understand why. Ive seen what Felixstow is like on a bank holiday weekend.
Food for thought.
 
Stu9000,

I agree with what TSB240 and Paul say; trailer sailing sounds an idea but in reality it's a nightmare even with dinghies !

Don't be so worried about mooring costs;

my club is extremely reasonable, with a great sheltered half tide mooring in Chichester Harbour, hoist in & out in Spring & Autumn, shore berth for the winter, secure dinghy pen and parking ( the last two are essential to check at any club or harbour ).

I don't know the Burnham area but I bet it's worth asking around at a few clubs and boatyards about moorings.
 
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Stu,

If you're in Kingston on Thames, you're daft to think of basing yourself on the E Coast. Chichester or Portsmouth Harbours are the places to be, hour and a bit down the A3. Chichester especially. Scout around, find a club with mooring possibilities, maybe even buy a boat off a current member. The kids'll love Chi, there's lots of fun stuff to do. Don't think "Ooh, Solent prices". The are cheap alternatives for drying or semi-drying moorings. Seajet would be a good guy to ask in the first instance. The right club might even have club oppies or toppers so the kids could graduate to being captain of their own vessels.
 
I trailed & sailed my 20 footer for 3 seasons, and put it on a mooring for the first time this year. I'm getting far more use out of it, even tho it's only half tide. You have to hit tides just right to both launch and recover, and often use a whole day at at least one end of the trip. A summer's half tide mooring should be gettable for £300 -400 east coast. Blackwater's no windier than anywhere else - narrower rivers with lumpy land, like Orwell & Deben, tend to be gustier - and the entrance is do-able most tide states.

I wouldn't lust after a Drascombe, myself - I want something that will always recover from a knockdown.

If you do go for a mooring, you can go a bit bigger. I've done a lot of time with 3 people in 20' and Jeeze it gets squashed. As someone said, it's all the gear too. You have to move the bags before you can sit down to change your socks, etc etc etc. I long for something a bit bigger, and I mostly sail SH now - bigger feels safer, too, when it blows up, and will still make progress.
 
Just an off beat suggestion, Hoo sailing club on the Medway and a hillyard, http://www.hillyardyachts.com/ and look down the list for Nantua 9 ton. No connection but did use to own Gillaroo some way down the listing and bought her from Faversham creek and kept her at Hoo for the season but East coast cruising was way too shallow for me.

Is Mum keen to be on the water? I sold my lovely old Nic36 and bought a westerly conway on the promise more family time on board but have managed 700 mile this year (mostly on my own) but three days have been at anchor in a local bay (but it was absolutely lovely) and a weekend in France have been with the family.
 
stu9000 said:
Gawd. Everyone is advising I get a mooring, and I can understand why. Ive seen what Felixstow is like on a bank holiday weekend.
Food for thought.
Click to expand...

If you want east coast, try a swinging mooring at Mersea, always somewhere to sail wherever the wind is, packages available with several yards. Also free access and launching for trailer sailers
 
stu9000 said:
Yes I know this question is asked endlessly. Ive been reading some great threads here and wanted to get your help to find a boat that suits my particular needs.

I have three kids (the oldest is 8) and I want them to get the experience I had when I was a kid. East coast mud up to my waist, great memories of us all in a tiny bilge keeler.

i want it all. I want a 24 foot or less trailable good sailing shallow draft boat that doesnt look too awful. Cockpits are coming in quite small on a lot. It would be nice to have 6 ft on the bench. I know, Im asking too much.

Budget is 4k

I looked at the Corribee which seems lovely but for the small cockpit. Jaguar 22 seems to offer value but is it really a lake boat? Maybe im going too "big" and should consider a Drascombe Longboat Cruiser?

It is tricky. I want to inspire my kids, not put them off, or end up getting divorced! You can get a lot for 4k but im wondering if by packing it all in you compromise too much on the core values. A Drascombe has enough of a cuddy to get the kids out of the weather, especially moored up with a tent. Its a day sailer though with no capacity for sleeping 5 on board (the youngest is 2) But im seduced by what you get by a more modern boat. Help. Confused!
Click to expand...

The Leisure 23 ticks all the boxes (as suggested previously), 6ft cockpit, bilge keel enough room for 2 adults and 3 kids and sails pretty well. You might be pushed to get the SL version for under 4k but a 23 should come within budget.
http://www.leisureowners.org.uk/site/contents/leisure23_new.shtml
 
The amount of money you will have to spend on extra fuel towing the extra weight of the trailer and the boat together with the additional expense in maintaining the trailer and the inconvenience, you will be better off putting the money towards a cheap tidal mooring; you will maximise the usage of the boat and it is less stressful; a small twin keeler will be great for a tidal mud moorings, also, twin keel boats tent to be roomier too, and there are plenty for sale at a low cost, IMHO off course.
 
Twister_Ken said:
Stu,

If you're in Kingston on Thames, you're daft to think of basing yourself on the E Coast. Chichester or Portsmouth Harbours are the places to be, hour and a bit down the A3. Chichester especially. Scout around, find a club with mooring possibilities, maybe even buy a boat off a current member. The kids'll love Chi, there's lots of fun stuff to do. Don't think "Ooh, Solent prices". The are cheap alternatives for drying or semi-drying moorings. Seajet would be a good guy to ask in the first instance. The right club might even have club oppies or toppers so the kids could graduate to being captain of their own vessels.
Click to expand...

Chichester harbour is a good place.Try somewhere around Emsworth as Itchenor etc get really busy with beach traffic in the summer.
 
Trident 24 is mentioned several times. Not really a trailer sailer at 2 tons but Ok behind a landrover or better. But you can pick a good one up well within budget between £2k and £4k. Two cabins, separate heads, near standing headroom in the main saloon, and a good solid tough boat. Mine takes everything I throw at it, and I have yet to feel I have been anywhere near her limits - near MINE, maybe, but never felt the boat was struggling. Most Tridents have an infill between the vee berths froward, allowing plenty of room for 3 children in safety.

They come in fin, triple bilge or drop keel versions, obviously the drop keel being the shallowest draft, but the triple is the most popular and common configuration. They have an active Owners Association - but as Commodore I would say that anyway!

I agree with those who suggest from Kingston that you come down to the S Coast. 1.5 hours down the A3 and you will be afloat, specialy now the Hindhead tunnel is open, while going to the east coast from there, you will be committed to the M25 and the Dartford Tunnel - can be 2 or more hours in itself, let alone another hour to anywhere worth going up the A12.

Seajet's club is one of the best deals going for a drying mooring around Chichester, but the Conservancy will set you up from about £550 a year, or local boatyards like Wyche marine at Dell Quay for around £100 more, both giving you around 3 hours each side of HW, and both currently having vacancies on their moorings.

Having tried trailer sailing, the hassle of running a dnghy is FAR less than the several hours hard labour involved in trailer sailing for each trip. I tried it, and found you just dont go out over a single tide - its just not worth it.
 
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oldharry said:
Trident 24 is mentioned several times. Not really a trailer sailer at 2 tons but Ok behind a landrover or better. But you can pick a good one up well within budget between £2k and £4k. Two cabins, separate heads, near standing headroom in the main saloon, and a good solid tough boat. Mine takes everything I throw at it, and I have yet to feel I have been anywhere near her limits - near MINE, maybe, but never felt the boat was struggling. Most Tridents have an infill between the vee berths froward, allowing plenty of room for 3 children in safety.

They come in fin, triple bilge or drop keel versions, obviously the drop keel being the shallowest draft, but the triple is the most popular and common configuration. They have an active Owners Association - but as Commodore I would say that anyway!

I agree with those who suggest from Kingston that you come down to the S Coast. 1.5 hours down the A3 and you will be afloat, specialy now the Hindhead tunnel is open, while going to the east coast from there, you will be committed to the M25 and the Dartford Tunnel - can be 2 or more hours in itself, let alone another hour to anywhere worth going up the A12.

Seajet's club is one of the best deals going for a drying mooring around Chichester, but the Conservancy will set you up from about £550 a year, or local boatyards like Wyche marine at Dell Quay for around £100 more, both giving you around 3 hours each side of HW, and both currently having vacancies on their moorings.

Having tried trailer sailing, the hassle of running a dnghy is FAR less than the several hours hard labour involved in trailer sailing for each trip. I tried it, and found you just dont go out over a single tide - its just not worth it.
Click to expand...

I'm sold on most of the points made by you good people. M25 can bottleneck anywhere and would inevitably make a 1.5 h journey become 2+. Then there is the slip, the parking and the rigging. All the while the family wondering when the good bits actually happen. So I'm selling my beloved Mgb roadster. Once that is sorted I can do more than talk.

Thanks to you lot, I have a coherent plan and a range of boats to check out. I hope to see some of on the water soon .
 
JumbleDuck said:
Charter, then. For your budget you'll get a couple of weeks a year for five years in something which has respectable room for five people.
Click to expand...

That is a very good idea.

Snapdragon 23 might be worth a look. I sailed one with your size family and we had a gas. But really the thing to do if you are going to buy anything is to figure out where you will be based first of all. Then look at what is available in a reasonable radius. No point finding a great boat 200 miles away and spending a lot of money to move it. There are LOADS of boats for sale and LOTS of room to negotiate on the price.
 
I agree on finding a decent boat within reasonable sailing / transport range; however you're hopefully going to have this boat for years rather than months, so she needs to be reasonably rewarding to sail not just make a lot of leeway, which rules out the Leisure 23 and Snapdragons !
 
stu9000 said:
I'm sold on most of the points made by you good people. M25 can bottleneck anywhere and would inevitably make a 1.5 h journey become 2+. Then there is the slip, the parking and the rigging. All the while the family wondering when the good bits actually happen. So I'm selling my beloved Mgb roadster. Once that is sorted I can do more than talk.

Thanks to you lot, I have a coherent plan and a range of boats to check out. I hope to see some of on the water soon .
Click to expand...

Ha Ha! My much loved MGC went for the same reason...console yourself with the fact that you cant really drive in this country anymore!!! So let's go sailing!!
 
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