Survey/sea trial

[MapisM]

Am I right to have doubt or am I being over concerned?

Based on what you told us so far, IMHO you are being over concerned, but you ain't seen nothing yet.

Just look at this thread, in hindsight: 60+ posts of conjectures about a boat nobody knows anything about except yourself, eventually ended with some photos of a 20yo boat you probably never heard, and surely you couldn't care less about - and rightly so.

Now, my personal suggestion is that you'd better NOT tell what the boat you are considering is, let alone the results of a new seatrial, if and when you'll make one.
Reason being that if you would, regardless of its results, you should buckle up for a tirade about the reasons why you should NOT buy that boat and get an Itama instead.

You've been warned...

 

[Portofino]

Based on what you told us so far, IMHO you are being over concerned, but you ain't seen nothing yet.

Just look at this thread, in hindsight: 60+ posts of conjectures about a boat nobody knows anything about except yourself, eventually ended with some photos of a 20yo boat you probably never heard, and surely you couldn't care less about - and rightly so.

Now, my personal suggestion is that you'd better NOT tell what the boat you are considering is, let alone the results of a new seatrial, if and when you'll make one.
Reason being that if you would, regardless of its results, you should buckle up for a tirade about the reasons why you should NOT buy that boat and get an Itama instead.

You've been warned...

He asked should he be concerned about the under 400 rpm at WOT in what transpired to be a only 2 y old boat .
My advice has been considered.
He needs to one way or another see the manufacturers data .It’s pretty simple really .
Irrespective of make or modal .That applies across all diesels boats spectrums .

The suggestion was fouling .If so a clean is up is all that’s needed = great !
Nether the less the manufacturers rated rpm or slightly over is the bench mark .
The vodia guy will be able to see load and fuel burn if it’s not accessible from the dash ?

The 20 yr old boat is used as an illustrative example because it was mine out this AM .No special prep before hand .
I imagine when it was 2 yr old it would have gone more over ….buts that’s academic.

Theres a plethora ( I have given links ) of info on the net about rated rpm and wot , the effects of insidious overloading , and how little the subject is really understood.
Dont shoot the messenger guys .

I don’t get why folks are trying to normalise a 2 y old boat unable to get the last 400 rpm ? Brushing it under the carpet .
Or why a trail was even attempted if there was the slightest doubt of fouling ?

Full Power Engine Speed Readings & Proper Engine Loading on a Marine Diesel Engine — Scott Marine Power

 

[petem]

Or why a trail was even attempted if there was the slightest doubt of fouling ?

Porto, the OP describes himself as a novice, only used to outboards and I therefore assume a smaller boat.

Underestimating the effects of fouling is a simple mistake and fortunately there have been many other posters familiar with Solent boating who I hope have reassured him that fouling will be the cause.

Who knows, perhaps one day he can attain boating nirvana and buy himself an old Itama...

 

[Martxer]

Just an update boat was sea trailed again today made recommended speed engine rpm was 3480 in a lumpy sea.
Trim tab fault was down to a loose fuse.

 

[petem]

Just an update boat was sea trailed again today made recommended speed engine rpm was 3480 in a lumpy sea.
Trim tab fault was down to a loose fuse.

Great news.

 

[Portofino]

Just an update boat was sea trailed again today made recommended speed engine rpm was 3480 in a lumpy sea.
Trim tab fault was down to a loose fuse.

.
Sounds great , if 3500 is the rated rpm ? Taking the lumpy sea into account .You haven’t said which D4 they are ?
Thats more like it and what you want to see .

Glad you know now it can .
Well done for pushing them to repeat it .

 

[MapisM]

Just an update boat was sea trailed again today made recommended speed engine rpm was 3480 in a lumpy sea.
Trim tab fault was down to a loose fuse.

Q.E.D.
Goes to prove that scaremongering is a way too popular internet sport, these days.
Enjoy the new toy, and don't forget that we always like seeing pics of nice boats, if and when you will fancy sharing her with us.

 

[MapisM]

You haven’t said which D4 they are ?

Ahem. He did, Porto. In the very first post.

 

[rafiki_]

Q.E.D.
Goes to prove that scaremongering is a way too popular internet sport, these days.
Enjoy the new toy, and don't forget that we always like seeing pics of nice boats, if and when you will fancy sharing her with us.

Yep, will second this. Sounds a safe buy. Only 2 years old, with plenty of Volvo warranty. I’m sure you will enjoy this boat.

 

[madabouttheboat]

In the words of the surveyor the bellows are showing signs of salt water permeation .

As no-one else has asked, I will. How on earth does salt water permeate through a rubber bellows, and what evidence does the surveyor have that this has happened?

 

[Portofino]

There has been no scaremongering from me .
The squabble ( if I understood those who challenged me ) was wether or not it should reach rated Rpm at a sea trial .
I said it should .
Others said they weren’t bothered , one Rafiki told us his never did , making out therefore it was ok in sone kinda way .I challenged that .

I ve popped a few useful links in to back my assertions , which reference fouling and folks still couldn’t see the gravitas .

Even went out in my own boat on spec to demonstrate what this rated rpm at wot stuff is all about and how easy it should be achieved if the propping is correct .Albeit different numbers but the principles the same .

Thx Martxer , I know my boats ok can still hit rated rpm etc .

Any one else up for a rated rpm challenge? …..MapishM, Pete , Rafiki ….sorry we knows can’t hit it you have already told us .

 

[jrudge]

The ultimate answer is that they crack and let in sea water in large quantities which is why they are on a 2 year replacement cycle. I have no doubt that the design life will be double that as many people stretch it but Volvo have no incentive to stretch the service interval as sinking boats is not a great brand value !

. I suspect he could see some sign of ageing as you would on a car tyre for example but that is just a guess.

enjoy your new boat.

 

[MapisM]

There has been no scaremongering from me.

Excusatio non petita, ...

 

[Portofino]

The ultimate answer is that they crack and let in sea water in large quantities which is why they are on a 2 year replacement cycle. I have no doubt that the design life will be double that as many people stretch it but Volvo have no incentive to stretch the service interval as sinking boats is not a great brand value !

. I suspect he could see some sign of ageing as you would on a car tyre for example but that is just a guess.

enjoy your new boat.

Yours will be an interesting one to see if can reach rated rpm at wot .
You have eluded to a bit of weight gain from the gyro and tender .

How near have your been with the D12 s if you don’t mind me asking ?
Where do you set them at cruise ?

 

[Portofino]

As no-one else has asked, I will. How on earth does salt water permeate through a rubber bellows, and what evidence does the surveyor have that this has happened?

There will be pic in the report .

When I had my recent insurance survey they OD on pics , a good thing I might add .I guess to indemnify themselves from future come back .

 

[Seastoke]

Well done , now get it out on the water yourself so you know how it handles and performs so you know in the future. Also having the warranty is a massive bonus.
I think the broker has performed quickly to get the sale you could ask for a copy off the Volvo engineer.

 

[jakew009]

Based on what you told us so far, IMHO you are being over concerned, but you ain't seen nothing yet.

Just look at this thread, in hindsight: 60+ posts of conjectures about a boat nobody knows anything about except yourself, eventually ended with some photos of a 20yo boat you probably never heard, and surely you couldn't care less about - and rightly so.

Now, my personal suggestion is that you'd better NOT tell what the boat you are considering is, let alone the results of a new seatrial, if and when you'll make one.
Reason being that if you would, regardless of its results, you should buckle up for a tirade about the reasons why you should NOT buy that boat and get an Itama instead.

You've been warned...

This is the reason why selling leisure boats is such a pain in the ass.

Selling lorries or tractors or diggers is quite simple because usually the buyer knows what they are looking at and can tell the difference between a minor issue and a deal breaker.

With boats often the buyer barely knows anything practical so it’s hard for them to see the wood from the trees.

Often they end up relying on a broker to advise them who knows very little either, or some surveyor who puts so much ass covering in his report, it becomes worthless.

 

[jointventureII]

This is the reason why selling leisure boats is such a pain in the ass.

Selling lorries or tractors or diggers is quite simple because usually the buyer knows what they are looking at and can tell the difference between a minor issue and a deal breaker.

With boats often the buyer barely knows anything practical so it’s hard for them to see the wood from the trees.

Often they end up relying on a broker to advise them who knows very little either, or some surveyor who puts so much ass covering in his report, it becomes worthless.

Absolutely spot on - we just had a, well I won't say how much but 37m Superyacht, sale fall through because the surveyors snag list contained so much arse covering that it put off the client. They'd put in "estimated resolution price" and a massive price range (for example, ipad in guest cabin needs to be substituted, €200 - €8000)....!!

 

[MapisM]

(for example, ipad in guest cabin needs to be substituted, €200 - €8000)....!!

If someone who can afford a 37m toy doesn't question the sanity of a surveyor who goes as far as putting such BS in writing, I wonder what such buyer does for a living.
If I should bet, drug dealer is the most sensible option I'd put my money on!

 

[Portofino]

Absolutely spot on - we just had a, well I won't say how much but 37m Superyacht, sale fall through because the surveyors snag list contained so much arse covering that it put off the client. They'd put in "estimated resolution price" and a massive price range (for example, ipad in guest cabin needs to be substituted, €200 - €8000)....!!

If it’s the same one we had a look around , I could tell it was a good one , well maintained.Subject to sea trail the triple MTUs reaching rated rpm ( with clean sterngear ) I would if in that market have bought it assuming it was ball park price wise .
Perhaps hired MTU guys to officially ok the motors . But even without them the necessary data to analyse the motors is all available at the helm screen anyhow .
Fuel burn , EGTs , load + much more etc .
The rest is just boats ongoing expense , I pads , carpets , kitchen appliances, covers , state of anchor chain or what ever etc .
They are not new . They should have a thick service history file .
Finding a fire extinguisher hidden in a cabin wardrobe 1month out of date is not a deal breaker in my book .

I am looking at the bigger picture as soon as you sail off you will be throwing €€€ at it .€€€ proportionate to size .