Survey fees

[Windy_Blow]

Can anyone tell me on what basis suveryors charge?
If it is on a per foot basis, then the costs of a survey on a small (26' - 27') boat would be a much larger proportion of the purchase price than on a larger (35'+) boat. Is this the case?

If so, is there a minimum boat length, below which it is not worth getting a survey done, as the cost would be disproportionate to the cost of actually buying the boat?

 

[Ecosse120]

I paid £2,250 for my e-boat last year and she had a survey a couple of years before and the faults had been rectified. I reckoned on about £500 for a survey so decided against it. I think you need to decide whether you are happy without a survey (Insurance may need one) and decide what the financial gamble is.

 

[eastcoastbernie]

Yes, surveyors charge according to the length of boat. However, worth shopping around. Get out your PBO look in classified and ring around people near you. I got a survey for £250 plus cost of lift and hoist. A survey can be a useful guide to boat condition and, if there are faults, you can negotiate the selling price down, or walk away from the boat. But, be warned, a surveyor may spot all sorts of things you hadn't noticed, but that doesn't mean they spot every single fault. Surveyors don't usually test everything and they can't be expected to know how much more life you can be expected to get out of all the boat's equipment.

 

[bobgosling]

You can probably save some money by asking for a minimal survey rather than a full survey if you have to get one done for insurance purposes. Basically the insurers just want a registered surveyor to ascertain that the boat actually exists and isn't a rotting hulk to avoid scammers.

 

[mainmarine]

Hi
Just had a 28 ft boat surveyed today Solent area, £11 per foot plus travelling expenses

 

[dedwards]

Hi, What sort of survey did you get for that?

 

[Jonny_H]

Hi,

Just had a quote to survey a 37 foot yacht in the Hamble (she's on the hard at the moment) - full survey ("condition report") for £579 + VAT - I thought this was quite expensive and will definetly shop around before going with a surveyor.

I'm sure someone will tell me if I'm being tight and this in fact reasonable, but based on the comments above it appears to be on the steap side

Jonny

p.s. If anyone can recommend a good / cheap (I know they usually aren't linked) surveyor in the Hamble I would be very appreciative!

 

[muckypup]

I picked up a chap from http://www.boatsurvey.com/ - I think he charged about £350 for full survey.

Steve

 

[bobgosling]

Why don't you want a full survey for a 37 foot yacht ( which by implication is probably fairly valuable ) ?

I would have thought that unless it is particulalrly well kept the results of the survey would eanble you to haggle the price down to more than compensate the cost ?

The original poster's enquiry differs because he is being charged a significant amount when compared to the value of the vessel and probably can't benefit from any reduction that could be obtained as the result of a problem being found.

 

[Bajansailor]

I occasionally have a survey job on a yacht here in Barbados, and can only dream wistfully of the fees that surveyors in England can charge...... it seems to be around GBP10 per foot for an insurance survey, and around GBP15 per foot for a full condition survey.
I think the going rate in Antigua is about US$10 and US$15 per foot respectively, while here we usually charge about US$6 / ft for insurance surveys, and about US$10 / ft for condition surveys.
And I still might get flack re our fees are too high....
Despite these fees, we do not get very many condition surveys (its mostly just inspections to tell the insurance company that the boat is still sound) - probably because we are 100 miles to windward of the Windward Islands, and most sailors are not too keen on beating their way over to Barbados.....

 

[Guest]

Some Insurance Brokers with agreement with their Underwriters will accept Yard Letter stating boat is in good general condition - but is usually limited to ~max 24ft LOA.

Unfortunately you are just outside of that size .... but it may be worth discussing with Ins. Brokers .... ie KC Powell ( google for Polestar) etc. - as depending on excess / risk you may find cover without survey - or reduced survey / letter anyway ...

Most people don't understand that you can negotiate cover ....

If you just want 3rd Party cover to satisfy Yacht Club / Harbour / Marina requirements - then there is always Basic Boat Liability .... google exactly that phrase and it'll come up - no surveys, owner is covered and fixed fee ins. of under a ton. On a boat of limited value - it's way I would go ..........


As to original ? of fees for surveys ...... PI cover for Marine Surveyor is EXPENSIVE .... a Yacht Surveyor lower - but still significant enough that means fees can no longer be "attarctive".

Market forces - namely who pays demands economic fees ... but with protection. So Supplier of service takes on Insurnace Cover ... this adds substantially to costs ... fee's go up.

Typical PI cover for Independent Surveyor can be ~ £6000 a year ... Of course there is cheaper cover - but you get what you pay for ...

So sorry to say it - but in these days of Litigation / Responsibility / claims etc. has caused a situation where we have no choice but to charge significantly higher fees than previous .....

EG ..... My fees in Uk were £5 a linear foot ....... no volume or beam correction as a certain Assoc. imposes ... Basic £5 a ft. I have to say that I could only do such now if PI cover was not involved and limited travel. Even a 30ft at £300 all in would be cutting it so fine that it's literally non-profit unless literally on door-step.

OK - let's look at practical maths ....

Average salary expectation of UK person .... 30K pa after employer covers to / from work etc.
Lets say a person surveys 2 boats every 4 days ... average fee £400, we leave out w/ends ... so that's ~ 2 boats a week....... weekly = £800...... = ~ £3000 a month .... £36K pa .... BUT he has no employer to cover his travel /costs etc. - he is independent. So we can deduct at least 30% from that for costs - likely a lot higher ... so now he's down to £23K pa before taxes .......... and remember he's Self Employed - emaning his Pension / other costs to Gov't etc. are significant .... The nett result is he is better of claiming dole ... but he can't - he's SE !!

Sorry to be blunt - but a Yacht Survey fee is expensive - but too many times HE doesn't get the work to allow him to bring his fees down ....

 

[Danny Jo]

I chose a surveyor based on personal recommendation, because I wanted answers to specific questions I had about the keel-hull joint, some damp in one of the timber strips, and the skeg. I had made my own list of minor faults and wanted an opinion about the overall soundness of the boat, not a long list of let-out clauses and recommendations to have the engine/electronics/domestic water professionally tested.

I got exactly what I wanted. I would take a lot of convincing that I could have got that choosing by a surveyor on price.

 

[kcrane]

Enjoyed the empirical explanation, sbc

 

[VicMallows]

Re: Survey fees / Why do we need a survey?

The bigest problem I perceive is Insurance Companies requiring a survey that otherwise you would not need or want, especially in respect of boats which they have been insuring for many years. The cost of a required survey can easily (if justifiably) be far in excess of the insurance premium.

My house insurer doesn't ask for a periodic survey. Indeed, I did not have a survey when I bought it ... I trusted my own abilities. (don't worry, that was 28yrs ago!).

Vic

 

[jonathankent]

Are you talking about a specific boat?

If so, what size and asking price?

As SBC has already said, you don't need to have surveys for all boats in order to get full insurance. Obviously, you need to be happy with condition and asking price. You can get full insurance with photos, yard letters or personal condition reports, and normally for boats up to ~24ft LOA, or a value of up to £10k.

How does that fit in with your circumstances?

 

[PeterGibbs]

Depending on your purpose in ordering a survey, you could consider a strict structural survey and get a couple of quotes for just that. A full survey will be several pages of inventory and comment on the cosmetic condition - useful if you want it, expensive if you don't. A structural survey will be just that - to be agreed in advance with the surveyor - and includes the obvious items - hull, deck/hull seal, bulkheads, keel and fixing, mast and shroud bases, engine mounts, steering and drive gear, evidence of osmosis, delamination of furniture bonding from the hull etc, plus evidence of any evidence of damage/repairs to the boat.

Most surveyors will not climb the mast to inspect the fixings, if raised, and will not operate the engine, so their comments on these items will be circumspect. Sail and halyard condition are often for the purchaser to validate.

By concentrating on the key items the cost is kept down, and the essentials focused on.

Experience with the type of vessel is important - I once employed a marine surveyor who raised great and unneccessary alarm over a purchase I was contemplating by declaring the rudder full of water - I subsequently learned a wet rudder is not uncommon, and not a reason to reject the boat or throw away the rudder!

PWG