Sunseeker wood problems

PEJ

Active member
Joined
23 Jul 2005
Messages
1,262
Visit site
A friend of mine, who is prone to exaggeration, has a new sunseeker 52. He tells me that all the wood on the cabinets, doors, etc is having to be replaced on his boat because it has changed colour due to it having no UV protection. He reckons it is the same on all 52s.

Like I said, he is prone to exaggeration , but has any one else heard about, or experienced, wood surfaces changing colour on a sunseeker?
 

alt

Well-known member
Joined
24 Oct 2006
Messages
4,082
Location
Éire
Visit site
Is this a Manhattan 52? A friend of mine bought new in 2008 - after a few hours on the clocks, there was over 5m of gelcoat cracks on the structure. After some negotiation back and forth, they got a new Manhattan 52 (IIRC paid extra for MAN engines 2nd time round)
 

PEJ

Active member
Joined
23 Jul 2005
Messages
1,262
Visit site
Yes, pretty sure it is a Manhattan, the new model they launched about 2? years ago
 
D

Deleted User YDKXO

Guest
I have commented that the interior finish looks and feels low rent

Thats my impression of all current Sunseekers. They have cut back on quality since the financial crash in order to keep prices competitive. Certainly the Manhattan 66 I looked at a few months ago was very much less than impressive in that respect. However, other manufacturers have done much the same
 

Boat2016

Active member
Joined
22 Oct 2016
Messages
847
Location
UK
Visit site
I have not yet found a wood that doesn’t discolour when exposed to the sun, I have looked at many boats where the wood is bleached because adequate precautions haven’t been taken to keep the sun off.
 

MapisM

Well-known member
Joined
11 Mar 2002
Messages
20,369
Visit site
I have not yet found a wood that doesn’t discolour when exposed to the sun
You are mixing up two completely different effects.
What I believe is being discussed is the fading of the laquer (aka milking), rather than a "discolour" of the wood itself - which btw normally gets darker, not lighter, when exposed to the sun.
That milking effect is a well known defect of some types of wood paints, firstly used around the late 90s in boat interiors, and very common on most boats built (also by top yards) in the naughties.
It gained popularity because on top of being less expensive and faster to apply for the builder, it gave a very nice finishing.
It's only over time that this varnish degradation became apparent - and btw that didn't affect only the areas exposed to the sun, because it also depends on humidity and other factors connected to the original application.
I'm surprised to hear that S/skr is still using this varnishing technique, which afaik no half decent builder is using anymore.
 

rlw

Member
Joined
21 Jun 2001
Messages
479
Location
Belgium
Visit site
Interesting topic. On my new Targa 52 the wood has discolored at the entrance on the job list to fix. Be interested to know what processes work to get it back to scratch. Does it need to be stripped or can it be recoated / sprayed to blend in the colour again? Have been researching this through the winter. Did some tests and think Polyurathane is used on the Fairline.
 

MapisM

Well-known member
Joined
11 Mar 2002
Messages
20,369
Visit site
Does it need to be stripped or can it be recoated / sprayed to blend in the colour again?
As I was explained by a chemist very experienced on these matters, the milking effect is created by micro-moisture finding its way in between the lacquer and the wood, therefore it's sort of obvious that the only way to get rid of it is by stripping the bad varnish completely, and then re-varnish from bare wood.
Which might be anywhere between relatively easy (in flat and removable panels) to a nightmare (in curved wooden bits, hand-made to measure during the boat construction and not meant to be removed).
Fwiw, the type of lacquers more prone to suffer this effect, depending mostly on the quality of the original application, are the nitro-combi ones, while 2K-PUR is the "better" stuff.
 

Piers

Well-known member
Joined
2 Jun 2001
Messages
3,593
Location
Guernsey, Channel Islands
www.playdeau.com
As I was explained by a chemist very experienced on these matters, the milking effect is created by micro-moisture finding its way in between the lacquer and the wood, therefore it's sort of obvious that the only way to get rid of it is by stripping the bad varnish completely, and then re-varnish from bare wood.

When we took delivery of Play d'eau, the caprails had been varnished. It wasn't long before they started to show a milky effect under the varnish. It transpired the boat was hastily delivered to the UK from Taiwan in time for the Dusseldorf boat show. That meant the cap rails were varnished in haste in the UK at a time of the year when a high moisture content was in the air. The moisture absorbtion into the teak before varnishing caused the effect, as detailed above by mapisM.

I was offerd a re-varnish or removal altogether. Choice? Removal. I far prefer the natural look (matches my grey hair) plus the thought of varnish upkeep was a number of steps too far.
 

rlw

Member
Joined
21 Jun 2001
Messages
479
Location
Belgium
Visit site
Luckily I have very little of the white milking. Just sun fading where the varnish is in perfect condition but just faded. I think it is clear varnish over a stain and I think the stain has lost it's colour.
 

Piers

Well-known member
Joined
2 Jun 2001
Messages
3,593
Location
Guernsey, Channel Islands
www.playdeau.com
Luckily I have very little of the white milking. Just sun fading where the varnish is in perfect condition but just faded. I think it is clear varnish over a stain and I think the stain has lost it's colour.

I occasionally have this issue on some of the exposed internal varish work, especially in the pilot house. I started treating these areas by a reasonable rub with a 3M light machine compound which lo and behold, brings it back perfectly. It's as though the surface of the varnish itself has become bloomed/whitened.
 

jrudge

Well-known member
Joined
4 Dec 2005
Messages
5,343
Location
Live London, boat Mallorca
Visit site
Interesting topic. On my new Targa 52 the wood has discolored at the entrance on the job list to fix. Be interested to know what processes work to get it back to scratch. Does it need to be stripped or can it be recoated / sprayed to blend in the colour again? Have been researching this through the winter. Did some tests and think Polyurathane is used on the Fairline.

There s a guy in Mallorca who does this in situ as I looked at a boat and broker ( who I know) told me of it. Where is the boat? I can message him and ask .

The "normal" way as far as I know is removal and re finishing.

You could wrap the wood, but unless it is a basket case for a quick refresh that is not a path I would go.
 

rlw

Member
Joined
21 Jun 2001
Messages
479
Location
Belgium
Visit site
Good to know the 3M machine polish does not do dammage. I have that but have not been brave enough to put a polishing machine against the varnish yet. Might give it a try on the back of a locker lids. The easy route would just to be able darken the wood in the entrance way a few tones so it matches with the rest of the saloon again. It is not damaged just severely faded.

I am considering wrapping it in a faux leather finish like 3M Dinoc as I actually prefer the light vinyl wall covering on my previous Targa 40 to the wood walls on the T52 saloon. However don't want to do anything that will have a negative impact on resale value. My plan was to order a large piece of Dinoc to see what it looks like in real life. Concerned if might feel/look a bit plasticy. The doors and cupboards are all fine. I am guessing the Dinoc glue would damage the woodwork if ever removed.
 

Piers

Well-known member
Joined
2 Jun 2001
Messages
3,593
Location
Guernsey, Channel Islands
www.playdeau.com
Good to know the 3M machine polish does not do dammage. I have that but have not been brave enough to put a polishing machine against the varnish yet. Might give it a try on the back of a locker lids. The easy route would just to be able darken the wood in the entrance way a few tones so it matches with the rest of the saloon again. It is not damaged just severely faded.

I put some 3M on a cloth and polish by hand, not machine. I've found areas where it's a varnish problem and one or two where it's a wood or stain bleach. These need taking back and starting again. Having said that, alnmost every 'bloom' has been restored by hand, cloth and 3M.
 

rafiki_

Well-known member
Joined
19 Jan 2009
Messages
11,966
Location
Stratford on Avon
Visit site
Thats my impression of all current Sunseekers. They have cut back on quality since the financial crash in order to keep prices competitive. Certainly the Manhattan 66 I looked at a few months ago was very much less than impressive in that respect. However, other manufacturers have done much the same
This is where the Fairlines look much better quality imho
 
Top