Standard for tethers

[Kukri]

….
The other notion is that you might want to unclip if you found yourself in the water being roughly dragged under the bow wave. But I've not heard of a sailor that was able to do so, and it would take nerves of steel to release yourself in mid-ocean, since you might not be found again.
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Teamo Backtow.

275N Ocean BackTow Lifejacket DeckHarness in Blue

I have no interest in this business, but I’m a very happy customer.

 

[thinwater]

Nothing you said suggests a higher breaking load than 22kN is required.

... Obviously? No one on this thread has suggested, from my reading, that forces over 22 kN are probable, documented, or that you would live thought it. The 22 kN standard is primarily for durability, and is well accepted in industry and climbing. Done.

What was missing from the yachting standard is a requirement for side load and open gate testing. These are how carabiners actually fail in the real world, and that is what the Spinlock Race clips missed.

A bit of history. The Gibbs Safety Snap, upon which the Spinlock Race Clip was based, is MUCH thicker and can take a reasonable side load. But the standard did not require that test and Spinlock (and others) took this opertunity to save weight and reduce manufacturing costs by stamping them out of thin metal, ruining the design (which honestly, is obsolete anyway).


Notice the increase "meat" in the Kong clips they now use. Designed for via ferrata climbing, they meet the side load and open gate requirements. Also easier to operate with winter gloves. Because they are used by climbers and the militaries, they are FAR most use-tested and proven than recreational marine designs. They will clip a 1-inch railing, yet weigh no more (both are about 130g). The original Gibb was heavier.

 

[lustyd]

Obviously?

Given that that was all my post addressed and you disputed my post I’m not sure what you’re trying to say.

 

[lustyd]

Teamo Backtow.

275N Ocean BackTow Lifejacket DeckHarness in Blue

I have no interest in this business, but I’m a very happy customer.

No longer in business. Several threads about them recently.

 

[Kukri]

No longer in business. Several threads about them recently.

Pity. They were really good.

 

[PetiteFleur]

I have bright yellow tapes, kept in a cool dry place out of the sun when not underway.

I also keep mine down below when not in use - after I discovered on a previous yacht that the sewn end looked vulnerable so, to my horror managed to pull the stitching apart! I immediately scrapped them and made new ones with a cover over the sewn join to prevent UV degradation of the stitching.

 

[zoidberg]

.... I contacted SpinLock in the UK asking if they did a tether with a locking clip and the response was we manufacture to the standard.
Perhaps time to get the next set of tethers custom made.

I've long been a bit sceptical of that sort of response from industry 'experts'.... perhaps learned when doing mil flying in the 70s. I/we were expected to do a Pre-Flight check on our ejection seats, and I can still recite the litany. I took my cue from an aged Squadron Leader with thousands of hours on a couple of score 'Types', who advised one to learn what else the Safety Equipment Crew Chief inspected and why, and do that oneself.

My tethers are past of my yottie Safety Equipment. I choose to learn enough about them to make good decisions - for me and those who rely on me. Here's a tether I made up myself a few years ago....

The eagle-eyed engineers among us will spot the two snaplinks/carabiners/mousequetons are of slightly different patterns. One is the original Gibb UK Patt 1527238 and 'Tested 11Kn', now unavailable. The other has no info but is rather similar. The webbing loop, from a climbers' specialist, is labeled 25Kn. They're the best I could access at the time.

I have several tethers-with-snaplinks as above, and use/clip into more than one when working the cockpit at night/poor weather. 'Cos they're there. I'm grateful for having/using two on the foredeck, for I am then well-secured in place and have two hands for the job.
I don't mind the brief extra 'clipping/unclipping' needed - perhaps that's down to my earlier background in rock-climbing necessity. My choice. Sandy and Thinweather will understand.

Now, the Standard to which yottie tethers sold in the UK/EU are required to conform is ISO12401:2009. One has to pay, normally, to read such a document - and I did, for I was curious to explore how similar it was to the comparable ISO Standard for 'arborial/positioning' work mentioned above. I decided the standardisation/testing regimes did not compare easily, but that the '12401' testing was rather less challenging than the other. I do recognise the difficulties but have decided that, for myself, I will purchase and use the Gibb-pattern and Kong products for snaplinks - and webbing loops manufactured to the higher Standards. Especially as that is better but cheaper than chandlery-bought products.

For better or worse....

 

[PetiteFleur]

The possible problem with mountaineering hooks is they are aluminium and could corrode in sea water and affect their function?

 

[Star-Lord]

I spent some time this week in an 'arborist trade supplier' with an international clientele and a huge range of safety equipment, and I was able to inspect the PPE available. It struck me that the personal tethers available to pro tree climbers were rather more capable than those I'd noticed in chandlers.

They're also rather less expensive.

Arborists' tethers ( and access ropes ) are tightly regulated and are required to conform to ISO EN 566 2017, EN354 and EN795b. One priced at £10.50 was rated at 30Kn. Corresponding two-stage snaplinks conformed to EN362, and cost £8.

Yottie tethers sold with snaplinks attached should all conform to ISO 12401 of 2009.
One major UK chandler is still selling 'Scandi' tethers made to the obsolete ISO 1095 standard - revoked and superceded in mid 2009 - and shouldn't.

Many tethers have overload indicators fitted to indicate 'when the item needs replacing'. They do NOT indicate if the webbing has been weakened by salt, solvents or UV radiation.... just like webbing jackstays.

The chandlery-sold items inspected all seem rated to 22Kn, while the arborist items are rated at 25Kn or 30Kn.

Every tether I have seen is too long. I get the three (one long one short) option type and cut off the long one. Stretch tethers are not for me. No point in a tether that lets you fall off the boat. Get on your iMessage and crawl forward with a short tether imho.

 

[Sandy]

Every tether I have seen is too long. I get the three (one long one short) option type and cut off the long one. Stretch tethers are not for me. No point in a tether that lets you fall off the boat. Get on your iMessage and crawl forward with a short tether imho.

On my boat I have a mix of stretchy and fixed tethers. I prefer the stretchy ones as they are much less of a trip hazard when used and don't get in the way when slung round your head.

I came across Spinlock tethers last year on another yacht I sail on and liked the design apart from lack of a locking clip at the harness end. As @zoidberg said he, @thinwater and I have a mountaineering background and a locking carabiner is normal on your harness. With my advancing years I'd like to hang on for as long as possible; long gone are the days of my ignorance of mortality.

I have just spotted that Spinlock do a three point tether with two clips and a loop. That might give me something to work with.

 

[thinwater]

The side load test required by ANSI, OHSA, and UIAA 121 Type K (the kong Tango) requires that a connector be clipped to the pin and loaded downwards with 8 kN. This simulates mis-loading that happens in real world falls in industry, via ferrata climbing, and sailing. The Kong connector can pass this easily, as can many other Type K connectors and all industrial connectors (required). Most carabiners cannot (I have run this test--it requires considerable beef in the athwartships direction).

Whether World Sailing will adopt this standard is unknown. In the first round they said it was impractical, since a new standard would need to be developed ... which was rather silly since both the standard and equipment already existed. Jingoism IMO.

Corrosion is a minor problem if the gear is properly maintained. You will see these on Volvo boats and they been on cruising boats for 15 years. If you keep them in a bucket of seawater, yes, eventually there could be a problem. But they do well if lubed once a year. I've been using them for a decade. Nothing new here. More like a well proven evolution.

 

[slawosz]

Given the biggest fall on a yacht is 2m not an issue at all.

The lenght of fall is not important. 2 meters fall can cause serious injuries and 20 meters fall might fell light (in climbing). Its the amount of amortization in the gear that matters.
Few years ago in Baltics there was an accident where large modern yacht (wide) capsized on the surf and impact tore tethers - attached to stanchions - there was no impact absorbing elements. But its rare possibility of this happening on yacht, but does not require a lot of precaution.
There is excellent video showing facts about impact:

 

[slawosz]

Plus, recently I was walking around small marina, paying attention to the lifelines. I wonder how many of the owners pay attention to the fact than in case of falling overboard, in case of long tether they will have little chance to come back.

 

[Daydream believer]

Every tether I have seen is too long. I get the three (one long one short) option type and cut off the long one. Stretch tethers are not for me. No point in a tether that lets you fall off the boat. Get on your iMessage and crawl forward with a short tether imho.

No tether will stop one falling off a boat & a short one can be dangerous. One of my crew turned up with a 4 ft one & found that he could not stand up with it hooked in the cockpit. Nor could he step up on to the cabin top to hand the sails when hooked to the life lines along the deck. Lots of people like to work sails on deck. To do that they need to stand up.
He would have still fallen over the side if he had gone on the bow, because, like all bows, the boat is narrow (monohull)& the tether will always reach the side. Quite possible when anchoring or sail changing in a blow
As for 3 point. My wife bought one & said that she felt like Marlows ghost with the 2 lumps of steel clip swinging about on the end. At no time did she need the 2 because she hooked on before leaving the cockpit ( we do not have one of those silly tents to navigate round) She was able to go the full length of the boat hooked on.

 

[Sandy]

The lenght of fall is not important. 2 meters fall can cause serious injuries and 20 meters fall might fell light (in climbing). Its the amount of amortization in the gear that matters.

Thanks that video was very informative.

 

[thinwater]

Oh, we're off in the woods now.

[popcorn]

It should be obvious that there is no one-size-fits-all tether solution, and that what is true on one boat is not alway true on another. Simple declarative statements are often wrong or pointlessly simplistic.

 

[Neeves]

On the Clipper yachts all the harnesses, tethers, LJs and helmets are stored, hanging longitudinally, and named at the bottom of the steps to the cockpit. Immediately available if going on deck.



If we are sailing offshore ours are stored on a line, used as a hand hold, under the cockpit roof. When we raced we had a line secured to one side of centre running from mast to steps, again used as a hand hold, with all the harnesses hanging from the line.

Jonathan

 

[jlavery]

To give an idea of loadings - no maths, just evidence.

In the 89 Whitbread I was washed out of the cockpit by a wave. Came to a hard stop at the end of my tether.

The clip at the boat end (design as the red one in the picture) was loaded enough to spring out and allow the spring loaded safety bar to flip past the locking detent. I had to cut it off the end of the teather. (I still have it as a memento).

There was no sideways load on the clip, pure inline load.

As has been observed, more re modern clips are stronger.

 

[thinwater]

To give an idea of loadings - no maths, just evidence.

In the 89 Whitbread I was washed out of the cockpit by a wave. Came to a hard stop at the end of my tether.

The clip at the boat end (design as the red one in the picture) was loaded enough to spring out and allow the spring loaded safety bar to flip past the locking detent. I had to cut it off the end of the teather. (I still have it as a memento).

There was no sideways load on the clip, pure inline load.

As has been observed, more re modern clips are stronger.

I keep a broken carabiner on the mantle as a reminder. A bump on the rock pressed the gate open, greatly reducing the strength.

 

[Daydream believer]

On the Clipper yachts all the harnesses, tethers, LJs and helmets are stored, hanging longitudinally, and named at the bottom of the steps to the cockpit. Immediately available if going on deck.
If we are sailing offshore ours are stored on a line, used as a hand hold, under the cockpit roof. When we raced we had a line secured to one side of centre running from mast to steps, again used as a hand hold, with all the harnesses hanging from the line.

So what happened when a crew needed to go forward of the mast?